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Congrats to Joel for again winning a big event

\_(ツ)_/  on phantoms winning. At this point for extended, I'm only interested to know when the point adjustment will hit. I have my (only) real extended event in late August. Hopefully it will be utter chaos. But more likely, the big 4 won't get hit enough and some very similar lists will survive.

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1 hour ago, GreenDragoon said:

Congrats to Joel for again winning a big event

\_(ツ)_/  on phantoms winning. At this point for extended, I'm only interested to know when the point adjustment will hit. I have my (only) real extended event in late August. Hopefully it will be utter chaos. But more likely, the big 4 won't get hit enough and some very similar lists will survive.

Rebel Beef will always be a thing. You probably won't be able to to take Cassian+Leia with more good stuff anymore.

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13 hours ago, MegaSilver said:

AP5 is a great Cassian lite, and can pull some shenanigans that Cassian can't.

 

In fact I like AP5 a lot more.

I like AP5 a lot too. he is pretty versatile. I like to run him with R4 and Intimidation. Nothings more fun than a coordinating blocker! I like doing the reverse too just to mess people up, catches my opponents off guard all the time, then they bump and deal with the intimidation. Especially with Leia! but that's getting expensive. 

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3 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

I like AP5 a lot too. he is pretty versatile. I like to run him with R4 and Intimidation. Nothings more fun than a coordinating blocker! I like doing the reverse too just to mess people up, catches my opponents off guard all the time, then they bump and deal with the intimidation. Especially with Leia! but that's getting expensive. 

Why R4? He is rarely stressed.

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17 hours ago, Scott Pilgrim2 said:

Rebel Beef will always be a thing. You probably won't be able to to take Cassian+Leia with more good stuff anymore.

Rebel beef doesn't really want Cassian though as soon as the Bwings are increased a bit again.  I know he's also popular in other lists, but the list was doing rather well before Bwings and without Cassian.

I expect the new rebel beef to go back to xwings and ywings. Horton is still a sleeper hit that everyone ignores.

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24 minutes ago, MegaSilver said:

Why R4? He is rarely stressed.

I reverse, A LOT, and a reverse then hard 2 is a pretty neat trick. it's only if I got the points to fit it. but it's nice to have for sure. 

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If we are talking about 4 ships build, switching from Bwings to Xwings is a huge downside imo. They can still work, but you are more susceptible to variance (it only takes two maximized enemy 3 dice attacks followed by two blanked out green rolls to lose one ship compared to the at least 3 of Bs. And that's without considering crits) and you are losing the awesome focus linked to barrel roll action which is great.

Also other than Wedge, Biggs and maybe Luke xwings are overcosted by 1 or 2 points even if we assume all Bs and not just Braylen will go back to their previous cost.

I agree thought that without Braylen Cassian it's quite pointless as probably is an U-wing without Leia. Horton seems to already going well, we can assume he might even get better if other choices get more expansive.

AP-5 could also work but it requires a bit of wishfull thinking to directly compare it to Cassian. He was doing fine before Leia thought, but mostly in 5 ships or proton torps builds iirc

 

Assuming Leia, Phantoms and Wedge will get more expansive and assuming there won't be another leia (which is a pretty big assumption, I expect something else to get lowered way below its actual value), what faction/archetype will emerge dominant?

By myself I expect Jedi to get more prevalent which in turn will probably make imperial aces great again. Some kind of republic beef might also emerge (3 arcs + 1 jedi is definitely not on rebel beef level, but without it on the picture anymore... And that's without considering ps 2 Torrents which are great).

FO already has a pretty nice archetype (QD+Kylo+BD or Tavson), if they get some kind of discount somewhere they'll might also be able to field some strong FO salads.

About scum I don't know: Para's Ketsu+Talon+Teroch (which will probably be better off with Fenn in a phantom free meta) is good and the 4 fangs are also good. But right now I don't have much experience with scum other than those 2 lists.

For Separatist I hear double Siths is good. Right now I can't see how that beats Rebel beef but without it (or with it somewhat nerfed) they might also shine (I hope so, I just bought them), although if imperial aces aren't kept in check by rebel beef anymore Maul and Dooku might not be so happy

What's your take guys?

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Posted (edited)
37 minutes ago, Sunitsa said:

What's your take guys?

Hard to project or speculate since FFG is kinda random about stuff and seems to make point adjustments for Extended first and Hyperspace second. 

Only thing I 100% expect is that Resistance will be the next dominate R* Good Guy faction. 

Rey, Han, Edon, Bob, and all their degenerate dice modifying crew/gunners are gonna get massive point reductions paired with this crazy thing. 
latest?cb=20160520230433

Wave 3 Hyperspace's "Worst" Ships:

dgCXVQH.png

Scum YT cant really get reduced much further, Z95s/Miner Ties are wholesome and somewhat irrelevant regardless of cost. Escape Craft is known cancer and untouchable. Guri is already 100% fine. B22 is bad and should see a point decrease. Tie FOs are terrible and should see a point decrease but might not. Only thing for sure is the YT1300 and StarFortress are gonna get much cheaper. 

Wave 3 Extended's "Worst" Ships:

yAlTOM7.png

Tie Aggressor is aggressively bad and needs help. YT-2400 is untouchable in my book. Tie/FN is lame so whatever. Wookies are already legitimately good. IG-88s get sketchy if 3 fit with significant points free. YV-666 is already good. Jumpmaster is a completely broken chassis that is either going to be completely irrelevant or game breakingly cheap. Tie Advanced v1 was punished for Supernatural Reflexes sins, Grand Inq can be good. Quadjumper is known good and unchangeable. StarFortress down down. Decimator down down on the way into a Hyperspace that is fully unprepared for the fact that RAC is an i5 with free mods thats already only 80 points and gonna get cheaper. Oh and while I am wildly and incorrectly speculating the VCX is great and gonna bully hyperspace. 

Edited by Boom Owl

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29 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

Hard to project or speculate since FFG is kinda random about stuff and seems to make point adjustments for Extended first and Hyperspace second. 

Only thing I 100% expect is that Resistance will be the next dominate R* Good Guy faction. 

Rey, Han, Edon, Bob, and all their degenerate dice modifying crew/gunners are gonna get massive point reductions paired with this crazy thing. 
latest?cb=20160520230433

Wave 3 Hyperspace's "Worst" Ships:

dgCXVQH.png

Scum YT cant really get reduced much further, Z95s/Miner Ties are wholesome and somewhat irrelevant regardless of cost. Escape Craft is known cancer and untouchable. Guri is already 100% fine. B22 is bad and should see a point decrease. Tie FOs are terrible and should see a point decrease but might not. Only thing for sure is the YT1300 and StarFortress are gonna get much cheaper. 

Rose crew worries me so much, it's just such a paste eating card. Do not want.

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4 minutes ago, SnooSnarry said:

Rose crew worries me so much, it's just such a paste eating card. Do not want.

🌹 getting significantly reduced as a way to indirectly buff YTs and Fortresses would not surprise me at all. 

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Just now, Boom Owl said:

🌹 getting significantly reduced as a way to indirectly buff YTs and Fortresses would not surprise me at all. 

Don't forget the obligatory reductions for them for that sweet double down effect. 8 pt Leia and overpriced beef meant rebels couldn't do anything. 2 pt Leia [exclusive] or cheap beef would be a balanced fix. But no, we need to get 2 pt Leia and cheap beef to cause them problems. Who honestly believes that it won't be a case of 4pt Rose and cheaper salvaged YT? Who am I kidding? Rose is actually 3pt.

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18 minutes ago, player3010587 said:

Don't forget the obligatory reductions for them for that sweet double down effect. 8 pt Leia and overpriced beef meant rebels couldn't do anything. 2 pt Leia [exclusive] or cheap beef would be a balanced fix. But no, we need to get 2 pt Leia and cheap beef to cause them problems. Who honestly believes that it won't be a case of 4pt Rose and cheaper salvaged YT? Who am I kidding? Rose is actually 3pt.

The tricky thing is Resistance YT1300s actually need help.

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2 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

The tricky thing is Resistance YT1300s actually need help.

For sure they need help. And that's what it's adjustable cost value is for. I'd love to see it become significantly cheaper. But I fear that FFG will use that solution and create a "Leia fix" problem by decreasing Rose along with it.

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Also want to point out that although Black Squadron Scout is this thread's meme of being the most useless pilot choice, he rocks 150th place out of 184 in Hyperspace. That's bottom 18%, not bottom 1%! Now let's have a moment of silence for least popular Hyperspace pilot: Obsidian Squadron Pilot.

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I still beleive the large based turrets are poorly designed in 2.0: they needed to have a linked action to rotate red. Lacking it, they will relay on dumb combos or insane costs to be relevant which kinda sucks because they should be a legit archetype imo

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Just now, Sunitsa said:

I still beleive the large based turrets are poorly designed in 2.0: they needed to have a linked action to rotate red. Lacking it, they will relay on dumb combos or insane costs to be relevant which kinda sucks because they should be a legit archetype imo

Gotta disagree here.  Having to set your Arc to f/b OR l/r to some extent dictates your engagement pattern, but you *do* get to choose one before you engage.  Large bases, especially falcons, have the ability to disengage, rotate, and come back for a different take if they want.  And sometimes you eff up and have to give up mods just to get any shot at all.  I think it's a great design that can be properly balanced purely by points adjustment.

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Maybe I'm somewhat alone but the Resistance Falcon seems to me to by dramatically more fair than the Rebel one.

It has Han at I6, but his ability is goofy instead of unlimited passive mods. It's got less HP, a worse dial, a red rotate, and a worse Title. Han or Rey have none Regen, instead of infinite regen.

And basically every Resistance ability stacks offense. Rey Gunner converts a hit, Finn adds a blank red dice, Paige shoots twice, Rose spends results to get locks, Chewbacca converts focuses to crits.

Compare:

Han with Trick Shot, R2-D2, Nien Nunb, Inertial Dampeners, and Engine Upgrade. (Currently 105)

Han with Trick Shot, Rose Tico, Rey, Engine Upgrade, and Rey's Falcon. (Currently 113)

The former can choose to boost OR stop at I6, rerolls every time it attacks or defends, has unlimited regen, has blue banks at every speed, and has 13HP.

The latter can choose to boost at I6 while stressed, gets to deploy funny, guarantees one hit or evade per turn, can get a free target lock by spending one of its green or red dice, and has 11HP.

I am much, much less worried by an 11HP 3-dice ship with a blank pilot ability and upgrades that stack offense, than I am by the 13HP ship with passive rerolls on every roll and upgrades that give infinite regen and minimal-consequence dial fixing, that we already have.

Resistance Han is gonna max out on his one 3-dice shot per turn, and then give up half points to random shots from range 3. Whatever.

... until the crew in the Resistance Transport completely break him, or something. Shouldn't that preview have come out today?

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17 minutes ago, Sunitsa said:

I still beleive the large based turrets are poorly designed in 2.0: they needed to have a linked action to rotate red. Lacking it, they will relay on dumb combos or insane costs to be relevant which kinda sucks because they should be a legit archetype imo

I've so rarely needed to move the turret on the Falcon I almost wouldn't care if it couldn't turn the guns. Just turn them sideways and circle the board in boring spirals...  It seems to hypnotize opponents into bad choices.

And that is now back in the bin o' neglected ships...  I'm going to play with Scyks for a bit... They're bad, but... I love those little guys and I'm not exactly competing for anything right now.

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