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Slugrage

Rise of the Empire: Cinematic Combat

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Yeah. It seems interesting. Has a lord of the rings:the confrontation vibe to revealing the tactic cards.

I liked the original combat, but I know a lot of others didn't, I'm curious if they now like the changes.

I like some of the ideas, like towcables and tractor beam.

The rerolls and defence changes are interesting. Can't wait to give it a try

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So we got confirmation that the green dice are indeed, 2 direct hits and 4 blanks.

I like the minor skill icons because while they are slightly less than half of a major skill icon, they count for full value for mission requirements so I think they are pretty good.

However, in combat, I think the lack of a tactics side makes them particularly worse in most cases compared to the base dice. That said, with the new tactics cards, you may want to use the new units for their cards despite their dice. And when you are already capped for red/black dice, 3 more green dice will always be useful.

I guess we will have to see.

Edited by Deadwolf

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These new rules are very interesting. The new tactics decks support a combined arms approach as well. Since you'll want the special ability specific to a unit but will only be able to use a card once per the number of rounds equal to the size of the new decks you'll need to manage all of your logistics properly or reduce the effectiveness of your tactics decks. The re-rolls should make things interesting as well. 

This expansion is looking very neat. 

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4 hours ago, Spidey NZ said:

Yeah. It seems interesting. Has a lord of the rings:the confrontation vibe to revealing the tactic cards.

I liked the original combat, but I know a lot of others didn't, I'm curious if they now like the changes.

I like some of the ideas, like towcables and tractor beam.

The rerolls and defence changes are interesting. Can't wait to give it a try

It actually feels like its more of a call out to how the second edition (not sure about the first) Game of Thrones board game does combat, which is pretty cool. I still think I'd have liked to have seen them try to go a Forbidden Stars route, but this is gives battles a lot more consideration.

Also, I always hated that both sides used the same decks. Just the switch to Rebel and Imperial decks is perfect. Using the Leader tactics values as reroll values also seems like a really simple, neat answer that is crazy functional, and I still think feels thematic.

I mean, you just don't want to fail when Darth Vader is on the field, you know? Or didn't you hear what happened to the last guy...

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7 hours ago, ArbitraryNerd said:

Using the Leader tactics values as reroll values also seems like a really simple, neat answer that is crazy functional, and I still think feels thematic.

I don't know, when I hear "thematic" in relation to Star Wars, "reroll" is not the first thing that comes to my mind... ; )

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7 hours ago, Bron Ander Haltern said:

I don't know, when I hear "thematic" in relation to Star Wars, "reroll" is not the first thing that comes to my mind... ; )

Thematic in that the leaders have variable levels of influence over their troops. Ranging from characters like Boba Fett, who are lone wolves and want nothing to do with large scale battles, to the Dark Lord of the Sith, who demands high performance from his troops.

I disliked how leaders in combat now only provide variable numbers of tactics cards that are in no way related to the characters or factions themselves. That lacked theme, and felt like a barely stapled on component of combat.

If you're only looking at physical components for theme, you're missing out on the best Rebellion (and many games) has to offer.

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2 hours ago, patrickmahan said:

This change sounds so awesome. Combat was always clunky with the cards deciding which happens first and who can cancel what damage. Also no more drawing useless cards like 'bombard' when you have no capital ships.

 

Honestly, this combat change alone is worth an expansion.

The fact that you have seven cards to manage on a rotating scale means you can enter combat with something approaching a strategy, instead of the tactics card making everything feel a bit like a cluster.

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On 2017-7-22 at 7:50 PM, ArbitraryNerd said:

Thematic in that the leaders have variable levels of influence over their troops. Ranging from characters like Boba Fett, who are lone wolves and want nothing to do with large scale battles, to the Dark Lord of the Sith, who demands high performance from his troops.

I disliked how leaders in combat now only provide variable numbers of tactics cards that are in no way related to the characters or factions themselves. That lacked theme, and felt like a barely stapled on component of combat.

If you're only looking at physical components for theme, you're missing out on the best Rebellion (and many games) has to offer.

Sure, liking one mechanic over the other is subjective and I have no problems with that, but I just don't see how old tactic cards lack theme, but rerolls are suddenly thematic. I consider both devoid of theme.

One could take two words in your entire post, "tactic cards", substitute it with "rerolls", and it would still apply.

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5 hours ago, Bron Ander Haltern said:

Sure, liking one mechanic over the other is subjective and I have no problems with that, but I just don't see how old tactic cards lack theme, but rerolls are suddenly thematic. I consider both devoid of theme.

One could take two words in your entire post, "tactic cards", substitute it with "rerolls", and it would still apply.

Rerolls are the physical manifestation of the game units attacking. The reroll amount are how inspiring the specific leaders are in certain theaters of war. And you can choose the cards you use in combat, instead of drawing random cards that may have zero relation to the units/leaders/whatever you've brought to the battle. "The randomness of battle" doesn't really make sense, when the cards are supposedly what your leader is supplying you with.

Rerolling as a mechanic isn't what I'm talking about. Working in the values already present on the chits themselves, while tying into the more thematic system overall, is what I'm getting at. It's a simple shift in how the numbers are used, without having to deep-six them for something else.

Feel free to disagree, though, as I'm not suggesting my posts are anything more than subjective.

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I disliked the old combat system.  Dislike may be harsh actually.  It worked fine, but it lacked any cinematic feel.  It was cold basic A&A/risk style combat that seemed to lack something compared to the rest of the game.  It 'worked' but it wasn't fun.  I threw around a lot of ideas to change that, and while I'm not taking a bit of credit (because, I honestly hope FFG didn't listen to the ramblings of an crazy loon on the forum), I see bits and pieces of my (and other's) ideas in the new system.

I hated drawing random cards that could be completely irrelevant to the battle at hand.  The rebel's greatest admiral could be hamstrung by drawing worthless tactic cards...guess he was having an off day.  This system allows some semblance of planning and tactics.  The limited use of them may or not make me happy, but we'll see.

Rerolls instead of tactic cards is interesting.  It should make combat a little quicker, and still gives value to the leaders.

Blocks instead of card draws seems interesting.  Combat will be greatly affected by this.  Extended combat, more chances for escape, more possibility for interesting combat scenarios.

The green dice are interesting.  First thought is that I wouldn't want to use those units.  Why pick a weaker unit with a slightly higher chance of crits at the sacrifice of regular hits and card draws or regular hits and blocks?  But the reroll system can make them a little more dependable, and with dice limits, adding 3 more dice even with a low chance of hits is nice.  And if you have a situation where you kill all the black or red targets, you wouldn't want to waste rerolls for a 1/6 chance of a crit when you have a 1/3 chance with the green.  It seems like mixed forces is the way to go.  Tossing in a green unit or two with every larger force can potentially add some real power.

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On 7/21/2017 at 3:11 PM, Spidey NZ said:

Yeah. It seems interesting. Has a lord of the rings:the confrontation vibe to revealing the tactic cards.

I liked the original combat, but I know a lot of others didn't, I'm curious if they now like the changes.

I like some of the ideas, like towcables and tractor beam.

The rerolls and defence changes are interesting. Can't wait to give it a try

I think this is a 10000% improvement. The current combat system is super clunky and relies too heavily on the random tactics decks. I've been in too many combats where it's even and one side just decimates simply through dice rolls and card draws. 

The leaders allowing us to reroll dice is super big. It also means that they have impact beyond the first turn. Being able to choose the cards before a dice roll makes a ton of sense because it actually gives you more decision-making ability and feel like we are actually strategizing during combat, rather than just letting chance decide what happens. It's also cool to see that you can get direct advantages from having numbers (since dice are limited) and also specific units. 

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As someone who absolutely loved the old combat system I am super hyped for this system. The whole system of having to play all your tactics to get the old ones back (except for a few other means of drawing tactic cards) will add a huge level of strategic planning to the combat that intrigues me.

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