No Frills Imperial Might

[KrisWall 966]

I'm headed to a Store Championship this coming weekend.  I rarely play.  Whenever I try to obey the meta, I tend to lose all my games because I don't practice nearly enough.  As such, I kind of want to bring something crazy and unexpected that will be fun to fly even if I lose.

I'm thinking maximum health, no frills Imperial might!  I'll have to consider missions, but this is what I'm thinking for fleet.

• 399 points
• ISD-II w/Motti and Reinforced Blast Doors
• ISD-II w/Reinforced Blast Doors
• ISD-II w/Reinforced Blast Doors

The goal would be to just fly forward at speed 3 to start, banking a nav token on the first round.  After that, engineering commands all day long to repair shields and damage.  With Motti and the Blast Doors, the ISDs are looking at 17 hull each.  Add in shields, redirects and engineering commands and I'm thinking that my opponents would have to chew through 20-25 damage to kill one ISD.

I'm thinking that I fly in, focus fire on an enemy ship and try to kill it.  Then it becomes an Imperial free for all?  I've also considered swapping out Motti for Jerjerrod.  That would put me at 398, but would make me far more maneuverable.

Thoughts?  Might be fun and nobody will have experience flying against it?

[Visovics 1,675]

I may be as crazy as you on that one, I would have Blockade Run, Fleet Ambush and Minefields as objectives

[KrisWall 966]

26 minutes ago, Visovics said:

I may be as crazy as you on that one, I would have Blockade Run, Fleet Ambush and Minefields as objectives

Yeah, that seems like a good set to me.

[TaeSWXW 755]

I assume a delta-formation or column would be best?

[KrisWall 966]

19 minutes ago, TaeSWXW said:

I assume a delta-formation or column would be best?

I'm planning on a delta formation.  A column would seem tough to pull off.

[Triangular 1,135]

Three ISD do look impressive at the first view. But I'm afraid, a fleet with bombers will kill you! Some B-wings or Firesprays can make your Star Destroyers melt.

[BrobaFett 4,209]

If you are going aggro ISD's make them ISD-1s with boarding troopers. Add avenger with Tua + RBD or ECM to one. Don't add anything else, just take the extra points as a large bid for first and take first whenever you can. I can attest it is incredibly hard to deal with, especially for front arc ships like nebulons, liberties, or other ISD's if you come straight in. Remember to try and bank at the last second to set up the double arc, which can be a bit tough with ISD's. MC30's and Demolisher along with the aforementioned bombers will be your achilles heal, but if you have first player shouldn't be an issue because you should be able to one shot most carriers with Avenger.

[KrisWall 966]

34 minutes ago, BrobaFett said:

If you are going aggro ISD's make them ISD-1s with boarding troopers. Add avenger with Tua + RBD or ECM to one. Don't add anything else, just take the extra points as a large bid for first and take first whenever you can. I can attest it is incredibly hard to deal with, especially for front arc ships like nebulons, liberties, or other ISD's if you come straight in. Remember to try and bank at the last second to set up the double arc, which can be a bit tough with ISD's. MC30's and Demolisher along with the aforementioned bombers will be your achilles heal, but if you have first player shouldn't be an issue because you should be able to one shot most carriers with Avenger.

Would you stick with Motti?

[BrobaFett 4,209]

3 minutes ago, KrisWall said:

Would you stick with Motti?

I plugged it into Armada Warlords to look at the exact points and I would either go with Vader and a 20pt bid which is the ultimate kill or be killed version of this fleet. Motti lets you add tua/ecm or a pair of ties and keep the bid. For objectives, I landed on blockade run, planetary ion cannon, and solar corona as objectives, but that doesn't particularly matter because your chance of winning falls DRAMATICALLY if you don't have first player. (with either version of this fleet)

[KrisWall 966]

Fair enough.  I might try running ISD-I's instead of II's.

[BrobaFett 4,209]

Best of luck! I have tried 2 BT ISD-1's and they are going to (I am calling it now) meta defining for wave 6. Just remember that you need to bank a squad token round 1 with each ship to trigger boarding troopers, which means you may need to nav turn 2. And watch out for someone running a dark horse Ion Cannon Battery ship to discard your SQ token. You typically see that upgrade on Interdictors.

[KrisWall 966]

1 minute ago, BrobaFett said:

Best of luck! I have tried 2 BT ISD-1's and they are going to (I am calling it now) meta defining for wave 6. Just remember that you need to bank a squad token round 1 with each ship to trigger boarding troopers, which means you may need to nav turn 2. And watch out for someone running a dark horse Ion Cannon Battery ship to discard your SQ token. You typically see that upgrade on Interdictors.

Good point.  The tournament is 7/15.  I'll try to remember to post how things work out.

[KrisWall 966]

Question on Boarding Troopers...  my Squadron value is obviously a 4.  What happens if I use the ability on a ship with only three defense tokens?  Can I spend all three and then spend one of them again, discarding it?

 

[Visovics 1,675]

4 minutes ago, KrisWall said:

Question on Boarding Troopers...  my Squadron value is obviously a 4.  What happens if I use the ability on a ship with only three defense tokens?  Can I spend all three and then spend one of them again, discarding it?

 

Only the three, and if you have Avenger, it'll most likely die

[KrisWall 966]

14 minutes ago, Visovics said:

Only the three, and if you have Avenger, it'll most likely die

Right, because no ship has more than 4 and I'm spending 4.  If they had already spent some defense tokens from a prior attack, would me spending them cause them to discard?  I'm thinking yes, but want to check.  I don't play often.

[Visovics 1,675]

Just now, KrisWall said:

Right, because no ship has more than 4 and I'm spending 4.  If they had already spent some defense tokens from a prior attack, would me spending them cause them to discard?  I'm thinking yes, but want to check.  I don't play often.

Yes

Spending means that a refreshed token becomes exhausted, and an exhausted would be discarded

Differently from cards that limit it, such as OP,which only ehausts, so nothing happens to exhausted.

 

[Megatronrex 2,867]

1 minute ago, KrisWall said:

Right, because no ship has more than 4 and I'm spending 4.  If they had already spent some defense tokens from a prior attack, would me spending them cause them to discard?  I'm thinking yes, but want to check.  I don't play often.

Yes if you spend their red defense tokens they're discarded.

[KrisWall 966]

Ok, so here's the new plan...

• ISD-I w/Jerjerrod, Minister Tua, Boarding Troopers, Leading Shots, Avenger, Reinforced Blast Doors
• ISD-I w/Boarding Troopers
• ISD-I w/Boarding Troopers

It's 378 points, which should be enough to get first player almost every time.  I can't see most people doing a 22 point bid.  Seems like 15 is the highest I ever see.

[Karneck 1,990]

Kriswall,

Your list has inspired me to craft something similar. I'm not quite sure what your tactics would be in dealing with bomber heavy or MSU MC30's or Corvette spam.
My fear is that those ships will simply speed 4 past you, drop speed and stick on your rear where you can't out turn them, even with Moff J.

here's something I cooked up to try and use some hammer and anvil tactics using your list as a base.

10 point bid for 1st. I think going 1st is the biggest benefit you can get out of a list like this. However, if out bid for 1st and going 2nd, I feel like these objectives will be better for it, I'm still torn on Dangerous Territory or Superior Positions for the nav Objective.

Advanced Gunnery because none of the Destroyers will have a gunnery team, this gives you great strength to the ISD, or hell even the Vic 2, if your opponent is silly enough to choose it. 
Fleet Ambush to get some ships to start closer to you. Allowing you to get to work.
Dangerous Territory so you don't have to worry about crashing into obstacles and pulling the damage or a face up card if it's an asteroid. Obstacles will not protect your opponent, go barrel right into them.

As discussed, Squadron turn one for the token, Moff J is going to give you the yaw clicks when you need them without having to waste nav commands for them, instead being able to use Con Fire or Repair when needed.
Token fighter force to provide some ability to lock down enemy fighters/bombers from chasing capital ships once their carriers are dead. They are meant to sacrifice themselves to buy time to table your opponent. 

The ISD 1 is the nose punch, it should be deployed facing the juiciest, largest ship, or the ship that is absolutely going to give you the most trouble out of the fleet. This is your hammer. I feel like if it is possible, attempt to deploy on the outside of your ship formation and start it at speed 2 or 3 depending, while deploying the vics out to one side or the other to help cover one of the ISD's flanks, and to also be in place for when that ISD does drive the enemy's ships towards them.
The Vic 2 is meant to provide long range fire support for follow up damage if the Avenger couldn't kill its target, or to harass ships on the flank or jumping over the ISD to hit it's rear. Middle placement in the formation so it can support either the ISD or the Vic 1 as needed. Likely fly at speed 2, anything trying to jump past the ISD is GOING to be going faster than speed 2, or it'll just get blasted apart by the ISD.
The Vic 1 is the Anvil, If anything wants to try and skirt around this bad boy, or if the opponent thinks he can just throw a few flankers at him to chew him up fast they will be in for a surprise.  Rocking him at speed 1 or speed 2, he's the solid edge of your screen formation. Nothing must get past him or he should be able to badly hurt it when it does. Tossing out reasonable fire to soften up ships on approach, or anything that is avoiding him and diving straight at the Vic 2.

As for the Goz, depending on spacing and if you're facing an MSU or a bomber heavy fleet, have him block a flank for either your ISD or your Vic 1 so an MC30 or Demo can't get into a double arc, or be there to toss AA dice at squadrons.

Place the fighters with whatever ship that seems like it will be swarmed with bombers. If it's possible to use a Vic to activate them to move them if you want, otherwise keep them to the squadron phase. I'd rather have all the ships Con firing early on, and then spamming repairs to stay in the game for later rounds.
 

Moff J nose punch 
Author: Karneck

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 390/400  

Commander: Moff Jerjerrod

Assault Objective: Advanced Gunnery
Defense Objective: Fleet Ambush
Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

 

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Moff Jerjerrod  ( 23  points) 
-  Avenger  ( 5  points) 
-  Minister Tua  ( 2  points) 
-  Boarding Troopers  ( 3  points) 
-  Reinforced Blast Doors  ( 5  points) 
-  Leading Shots  ( 4  points) 
= 152 total ship cost

 

Victory II-Class Star Destroyer (85 points)
-  Disposable Capacitors  ( 3  points) 
-  Quad Battery Turrets  ( 5  points) 
= 93 total ship cost

 

Victory I-Class Star Destroyer (73 points)
-  Ordnance Experts  ( 4  points) 
-  Quad Battery Turrets  ( 5  points) 
-  External Racks  ( 3  points) 
= 85 total ship cost

 

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
= 23 total ship cost

 

3 TIE Fighter Squadrons ( 24 points) 
1 Valen Rudor ( 13 points) 
= 37 Points

Edited July 11, 2017 by Karneck

[Plagueis 211]

The issue is the activation system in the game, someone with 5/6 activations can force your hand to the point even being first player you don't end up getting the range one shot you want, as much as 3 isds are epic to see the likely hood is they  will be hamstrung. I can't remember the last time I saw a list under 4 activations on a table. I roll out my 2isd indic list for fun games when people are not maximising there lists at a store champs it might be a bit to stressful... also rebel bombers are mean and nasty vs a poor ISD

[Visovics 1,675]

Just in case, this is my version of this strategy

TRIPLE ISD CRAZYNESS 
Author: Visovics

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 400/400  

Commander: Admiral Motti

Assault Objective: Blockade Run
Defense Objective: Fleet Ambush
Navigation Objective: Solar Corona

 

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Admiral Motti  ( 24  points) 
-  Avenger  ( 5  points) 
-  Admiral Montferrat  ( 5  points) 
-  Boarding Troopers  ( 3  points) 
-  Spinal Armament  ( 9  points) 
= 156 total ship cost

 

Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Boarding Troopers  ( 3  points) 
-  Spinal Armament  ( 9  points) 
= 122 total ship cost

 

Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Boarding Troopers  ( 3  points) 
-  Spinal Armament  ( 9  points) 
= 122 total ship cost

 

 

Card view link

Fleet created with Armada Warlords

[KrisWall 966]

1 hour ago, Visovics said:

Just in case, this is my version of this strategy

TRIPLE ISD CRAZYNESS 
Author: Visovics

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 400/400  

Commander: Admiral Motti

Assault Objective: Blockade Run
Defense Objective: Fleet Ambush
Navigation Objective: Solar Corona

 

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Admiral Motti  ( 24  points) 
-  Avenger  ( 5  points) 
-  Admiral Montferrat  ( 5  points) 
-  Boarding Troopers  ( 3  points) 
-  Spinal Armament  ( 9  points) 
= 156 total ship cost

 

Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Boarding Troopers  ( 3  points) 
-  Spinal Armament  ( 9  points) 
= 122 total ship cost

 

Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Boarding Troopers  ( 3  points) 
-  Spinal Armament  ( 9  points) 
= 122 total ship cost

 

 

Card view link

Fleet created with Armada Warlords

And no worries with being the second player?

[Visovics 1,675]

13 hours ago, KrisWall said:

And no worries with being the second player?

No, so I'm trying to take  full profit of what I can take

[KrisWall 966]

I like your list, but I might swap Motti for Jerjerrod.  Those ISDs just turn SO SLOW.

[KrisWall 966]

So, the tournament happened.  I went 1 and 2.  I ended up going with this...

• ISD-1 w/Jerjerrod, Minister Tua, Electronic Countermeasures, Boarding Troopers, Quad Laser Turrets
• ISD-1 w/Montferrat, Leading Shots, Avenger, Boarding Troopers, Quad Laser Turrets
• ISD-1 w/Boarding Troopers, Quad Laser Turrets
• Blockade Run, Solar Corona, Planetary Ion Cannons

My first game was against the guy who ended up winning the tournament.  I was second player and he chose Blockade Run.  His list was an ISD-2 Avenger with Boarding Troopers and the rest of the cards you'd expect to see on an ISD-2.  He also had 3x Raiders with External Racks and a Gozanti.    The Raiders were brutal.  They came in first and put the hurt on my ships.  I killed them, but they did their work.  After that, his Avenger rolled in and with some really great dice rolls, outright killed two ISDs with a dual front arc Gunnery Teams pair of shots.  It was brutal.  Pretty much max damage on each with no real defense tokens available.  I lost 3-8.  My last ISD made it into the end zone for 20 points.  On the upside, his squadrons engaged, took some real damage from my anti-squadron and counter 1 and spent the rest of the game running away.  I lost the game, but won the squadron sub-game with no squadrons. 

My second game was pretty much a worst case scenario.  I played against a veteran player (me being somewhat of a noob) with a pimped out Ackbar MC80 and a heavy complement of bombers.  He also had two Flotillas and a CR90.  He took second player and I, having grossly misread the mission and having never played it before, chose Advanced Gunnery.  I now realize how dumb that was.  I angled all three ISDs straight towards the MC80, but just could not make any damage stick.  I didn't roll ANY accuracies on any attacks over a three round period.  With his flotillas feeding him tokens and taking Engineering commands every turn, I got him down to zero defense tokens remaining, no shields and only two remaining hull.  He killed two of my ISDs.  That double side shot into the same ship is brutal with Ackbar and a loaded MC80.  Given that he got double points for one of my ISDs and I only killed 2 X-Wings, he won soundly at 10-1.

The last game was great fun.  My opponent has two ISD-2's, loaded up with Motti, Reinforced Blast Doors and other defensive stuff.  He also had a Gozanti and a literal swarm of TIE Fighters.  I was second player again and he picked Blockade Run.  He deployed both of his ships one one side, so I deployed across from him, set to speed 3 across the board.  I was able to lock the 5 ships together, making it so that noone could move without ramming.  The Gozanti was able to get around...  but it's a Gozanti.  It's not a real military threat against an ISD.  I ignored it.  His TIE Fighters mostly died in two rounds against my counter 1 and a single salvo of anti-squadron.  The rest of the game was just shooting and ramming between the ISDs.  In round 5, his one ISD (with Gunnery Teams) finished off two of mine and was then able to move forward...  leaving me an open, dual arc shot on his other ISD.  I had medium range.  That works out to a grand total of 5 red dice and 2 blue dice between the two arcs.  The arc I could see had 2 shields and the ISD had 4 hull remaining, with no defense tokens left.  I needed 6 damage.  The side arc (two red) got only a single damage, leaving me needing 5 damage on 3 red and 2 blue.  I rolled and got two damage on the reds and 1 damage on the blues.  Ugh...  But Wait!  I have a lone concentrated fire token.  I burnt it to reroll a red and got 2 damage.  The ISD went down, taking Motti with him...  which also took out the other ISD as it could no longer handle the 12 damage cards it was sitting with.  This won me the game.  Round 6 was just my ISD and his Gozanti running from each other.

I would definitely make some changes.  I think two ISDs and some small ship support is the way to go if you want to run boarding troopers.  I'm considering two ISD-1's, a Quasar and maybe a Gozanti.  Add in some squadrons...  probably Defenders?  I'll be working on a new list to run this coming weekend.

Edited July 17, 2017 by KrisWall