Why Rogue One is THE Best Star Wars Film Since Return Of The Jedi

[Iceeagle85 495]

On 2.8.2017 at 8:36 AM, Ravncat said:

I don't think it makes sense for Vader to know that a guy in the dim-lit halls has a small disk in his hand, he doesn't wave it and say look what I have. I'd agree with you if Vader knew one of those guys was actually carrying the plans. Why would vader know who has the plans or where they are - since he is only aware that they were transmitted to the ship.

If we assume vader doesn't know, then it makes sense that Vader is focused on all the combat guys, cutting them down.  I love how vader rips open the jammed door with the force as if it was no trouble at all.

Well we don't know how bad the lights were, we could see but that of course doesn't mean the characters in the movie could, but I'm quite sure he could have noticed that one guying trying to get something trough that closing door. And if he went in there thinking I'm going to kill all of you rebel scum he would have done that in my mind in mere seconds. The scene was nice but it was there to show a awesome close escape. But they way I'm sure he know the plans were on the ship so he shouldn't let anyone get away and I think we all can agree that he has the power to easily do that, so in my opinion its was just there to show Vader fighting and give us a close heroic escape that leads to A New Hope.

[BenderIsGreat 685]

28 minutes ago, Iceeagle85 said:

Well we don't know how bad the lights were, we could see but that of course doesn't mean the characters in the movie could, but I'm quite sure he could have noticed that one guying trying to get something trough that closing door. And if he went in there thinking I'm going to kill all of you rebel scum he would have done that in my mind in mere seconds. The scene was nice but it was there to show a awesome close escape. But they way I'm sure he know the plans were on the ship so he shouldn't let anyone get away and I think we all can agree that he has the power to easily do that, so in my opinion its was just there to show Vader fighting and give us a close heroic escape that leads to A New Hope.

To be fair, though, he has to run into that kind of thing all the **** time. Even his underlings are terrified of him.

I mean, c'mon now. 

[Hawkstrike 5,410]

Came across the following video on YouTube, and it finally explained why I was so dissatisfied with the beginning of Rogue One and the end of TFA, where conversely I enjoyed the beginning of TFA and th end of Rogue One.

 

[Porkchop Express 387]

Rogue One just doesn't have likeable main characters, and the supporting characters that do come across well, don't have enough screen time or character development to actually make their deaths emotional.

I felt it more when Raddus and General Merrick died than Jyn and Cassian, who I didn't really care that they had died. Neither was likeable and the film didn't really give me a reason to.

Had they introduced less characters, and given them more to do on screen, their deaths might have been more effective.

[Verlaine 1,647]

2 hours ago, Porkchop Express said:

Rogue One just doesn't have likeable main characters...

Speak for yourself! Jyn is exactly the kind of girl I would secretly have a crush on for years. Maybe that doesn't make her 'likeable' but still.

I had some discussions about films just the other night. Some people have strange criteria for what makes a good film. The Godfather didn't have likeable characters. 2001 didn't have method acting, or hardly any on-screen emotions for that matter (and quite some wooden dialogue/performance). I get the idea that for some, everything has to be like those superhero flicks.

[Boom Owl 13,236]

Sooooo......opinions in no particular order. I like watching all of them besides the 2nd two prequels which are unwatchable garbage. 

New Hope - Easily the best of all the movies. 

Empire - Needs no explanation. I prefer initial character development to middle act pay off but this is one of the greatest movies of all time. 

Return - Palp/Vader/Luke showdown is close to my favorite scene in any Star Wars movie the first time I saw it. Without Ewoks the trilogy would have been nearly perfect.

Phantom Menace - Its a bad Star Wars movie. No debate. But I still enjoy watching this movie anytime it is on ( applies to Force Awakens as well ). Its not at all like what any of us wanted but the 2nd two Prequel movies are awful emo nonsense by comparison. This one is actually kind of super fun if you just watch it as a Sunday morning cartoon, set in a very different universe, and lighten up for a little while while ignoring the plot and character development of anyone besides Obi Wan and Amadala. 

Force Awakens - If New Hope never existed this movie would have been incredible. But New Hope does exist, which means Force Awakens is kind of awkward but still incredibly enjoyable. They created a cool looking movie that avoids being shallow only because Rey/Finn/Poe are so enthusiastic its hard not to root for them. That said i stopped caring about the movie for a few minutes the moment Han Solo makes a joke about the death star when looking at starkiller base since it felt like Disney knows they can get away with basically anything and intentionally broke the 4th wall there. Finn is the best character in Force Awakens by a mile. The idea of a Storm Trooper defecting and becoming good is awesome. I hope Finn ( not Rey, Poe, or Kylo ) becomes the main protagonist of the movies. If Kylo stays on the dark side and converts Rey to the Dark Side only for Finn to become a Jedi and defeat them both.....I will look back on Force Awakens with a lot more admiration. 

Rogue One - Space ship battles, cool space ship battles. If i fast forward to the Battle of Scarif its "ok" but also a little boring since i dont care about the two main characters ( Jyn and Cassian). Most of the movie made me cringe. Hated just about every character besides Jyn's father and Krennic, they seemed to have real "natural" motivations at least. Galen can build an atom bomb so instead of not building it he builds it so he can give it a flaw. Thats a neat idea, makes sense, and makes him a sympathetic tragic character. Krennic is good for the opposite reasons, he is the "inverse" of Galen. They are basically one character and they form the back bone of the movie. They are more important characters in the film not Jyn or Cassian who are incredibly boring and lack interesting motivation by comparison. Jyn...you killed my father....yea boring dont care. Cassian...is barely a character, he is a gun. 

The use of CGI Tarken legitimately ruined entire chunks of the movie for me since it was unnecessary to the plot for us to see him, we could have simply heard him. It looked terrible and broke the immersion in an unrecoverable way. Even the use of Darth Vader was mishandled. Less is more!! The last scenes incredible sure but his scene talking to Krennic is just as bad as Tarkin and takes away from the intimidation of the character with crap dialogue confusing jokes and no real explanation for why they need to meet in person for 2 minutes. The meeting itself makes no sense just like a lot of the rest of the movie. You have a nearly perfectly cast and written villain in Krennic that Disney forces to share screen space with Vader and Tarkin for very little reason and it takes away from things. Its ultimately a cool looking but incredibly shallow movie that lacks heart or spirit. Every dramatic beat feels forced and the main characters Jyn and Cassian belong in a video game instead of a Star Wars movie. "Rebellions are built on hope"....saying thats not enough for it to be true.  
 

Edited August 12, 2017 by Boom Owl

[Porkchop Express 387]

2 hours ago, Verlaine said:

Speak for yourself! Jyn is exactly the kind of girl I would secretly have a crush on for years. Maybe that doesn't make her 'likeable' but still.

I had some discussions about films just the other night. Some people have strange criteria for what makes a good film. The Godfather didn't have likeable characters. 2001 didn't have method acting, or hardly any on-screen emotions for that matter (and quite some wooden dialogue/performance). I get the idea that for some, everything has to be like those superhero flicks.

2001 is one of my favourite movies so I hardly need "everything to be like a superhero flick".

If you are going to try and present a film where we should be feeling sad when main characters die, the audience need a connection to those characters. Jyn and Cassian are boring, and have no real likeable traits. Light hearted moments delivered by needless support characters should have been reserved for the main heros to hrlp create that connection. Instead a boring character with little charisma, and a guy who just comes across as a dislikeable person die and we are expected to feel for them.

[Verlaine 1,647]

11 minutes ago, Porkchop Express said:

If you are going to try and present a film where we should be feeling sad when main characters die, the audience need a connection to those characters. Jyn and Cassian are boring, and have no real likeable traits. Light hearted moments delivered by needless support characters should have been reserved for the main heros to hrlp create that connection. Instead a boring character with little charisma, and a guy who just comes across as a dislikeable person die and we are expected to feel for them.

You're talking about two different things here - 'likeable' and 'having a connection to'. Apart from the subjective issues here - I'm more interested in Jyn Erso than I am in Rey - the rest doesn't really follow. Have you asked why you think you're supposed to feel for them? Is it somehow the movie's fault if I as a viewer don't feel sad for Cassian, who has proven himself a rather callous murderer?  I can deduce what some of your expectations are, but don't blame others if these are not met.