Double Tie/SF + 1 help

[Goseki1 637]

That's a great list man. If I had a Lambda it's definitely something I'd experiment with more. Who are you normally giving the Hux condition to? 

I'm quite happy with my Upsilon build, but the Aggressor has had me thinking of other lists. I posted a nice list with a 31 point Kestal earlier  (VI, LWF, TLT) which I think is good, but doesn't gel hugely with her ability. I wonder if Synced Turret would be better with FCS and Targeting Synchronizer on both SF's? If she can focus for her action and keep enemies in arc (I'd try and keep at range 3 as much as possible) then she gets to reroll 2 Dice and hopefully spend the focus to push damage through. 

However, this leaves her very vulnerable defensively, with only 3 green Dice, no autothrusters and low health she'll probably pop quickly, especially against a Kanan /Biggs 4 TLT rolls.

I wonder then if Kestal really needs a support ship (like the Upsilon/tie shuttle) to hand out extra actions/tokens. Hmm.

In the meantime I have the below list. Double edges ability is great, but that low pilot skill is killer...  

TIE/sf Fighter: · "Quickdraw" (29)
Adaptability (Increase) (0)
Fire Control System (2)
Lightweight Frame (2)
Special Ops Training (0)
Targeting Synchronizer (3)

TIE/sf Fighter: · "Backdraft" (27)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Fire Control System (2)
Lightweight Frame (2)
Special Ops Training (0)
Targeting Synchronizer (3)

TIE Aggressor: · "Lieutenant Kestal" (22)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Synced Turret (4)
Lightweight Frame (2)
-- TOTAL ------- 100p. --

[Bonza 199]

I took this list to a store championship last weekend:

Quickdraw: Expertise, FCS, Title, LWF

Backdraft: VI, FCS, PA, Title, LWF

Omega Leader: Juke/Comm Relay

97 Points - this was to catch out Fen, but the biggest bid I saw from a Fen list on the day was 99, so probably and overkill TBH, 98 seems safe. 

Lost to Rey/Norra and Triple Jumps. I threw away the Rey/Norra game with some atrocious flying, Triple Jumps was an extremely close game, came down to wire and some lucky dice from my opponent. Pretty solid list, though Pattern Analyzer was a lot less useful than I though it would be, only coming in handy twice across 5 games. I will be dropping it from Backdraft and throwing a hull upgrade on Omega Leader, who was almost always the first target.   

[Alekzanter 442]

8 hours ago, Goseki1 said:

That's a great list man. If I had a Lambda it's definitely something I'd experiment with more. Who are you normally giving the Hux condition to?

 

It depends; if out-PSd, I use it on the highest PS enemy, and it really depends on who gets the most benefit from it. "Quickdraw" may get to double tap with it, and so could "Backdraft" if the engagement unfolds favorably. The condition remains until the end phase. I once used the "Backdraft" auxiliary arc to add a crit and turn a focus to a Hux hit, that after I'd hit the same target with Snap Shot that had been rerolled using a Targeting Synch lock that "QuickDraw" set the previous turn. The list has a lot going on, and it's a little difficult to remember all the little interactions, but it's been just as confusing to my opponents. 

It all boiled down to me wanting to have better control of my maneuvers and of the first engagement. Snap Shot has deterred my opponents going for range 1 attacks; SpecOps Title allows me to add 1 die to it. If I dropped Targeting Synch from "Quickdraw", I'd maybe put Snap Shot on her, but that reduces the number of dice mods the list has in favor of potentially getting 3/4 attacks every turn from both s/f with excellent maneuvering and conditions when at close ranges.

Edited June 16, 2017 by Alekzanter

[ArbitraryNerd 1,009]

3 hours ago, Alekzanter said:

It depends; if out-PSd, I use it on the highest PS enemy, and it really depends on who gets the most benefit from it. "Quickdraw" may get to double tap with it, and so could "Backdraft" if the engagement unfolds favorably. The condition remains until the end phase. I once used the "Backdraft" auxiliary arc to add a crit and turn a focus to a Hux hit, that after I'd hit the same target with Snap Shot that had been rerolled using a Targeting Synch lock that "QuickDraw" set the previous turn. The list has a lot going on, and it's a little difficult to remember all the little interactions, but it's been just as confusing to my opponents. 

It all boiled down to me wanting to have better control of my maneuvers and of the first engagement. Snap Shot has deterred my opponents going for range 1 attacks; SpecOps Title allows me to add 1 die to it. If I dropped Targeting Synch from "Quickdraw", I'd maybe put Snap Shot on her, but that reduces the number of dice mods the list has in favor of potentially getting 3/4 attacks every turn from both s/f with excellent maneuvering and conditions when at close ranges.

Snap Shot is a secondary weapon (it doesn't use your primary attack value), so Spec Ops does NOT trigger.

[ArbitraryNerd 1,009]

On 5/22/2017 at 3:26 AM, CRCL said:

Are we all missing the obvious (if somewhat boring) choice?

35 Quickdraw w/ ASTS, FCS, SensorC, LWF, Title.
34 Backfart w/ VI, FCS, SensorC, LWF, Title.
29 Omnicron w/ Col Detect, Palp.
2 Inintiative.

 

 

Back...fart?

Also, the Palp shuttle isn't going to pull its weight enough. You want that third option to be able to offer consistent attacks. Another negative, the Shuttle bleeds points and is an easy/obvious target. Sure, they're not tearing up your SFs, but it doesn't take THAT long to burn through Lambdas anymore.
 

Maybe swap for Hux and Vader for a gruesome early engagement? I was trying to get a Jendon/Title/Vader thing going, but the Lamda just doesn't pull its weight in a meta featuring Fenn, even WITH Vader on board.

[Iksentrik 108]

I've been flying this and have had perfect run with it so far

 (100)

"Quickdraw" (39) - TIE/SF Fighter
Expertise (4), Fire Control System (2), Sensor Cluster (2), Special Ops Training (0), Lightweight Frame (2)

"Backdraft" (35) - TIE/SF Fighter
Opportunist (4), Fire Control System (2), Special Ops Training (0), Lightweight Frame (2)

"Omega Leader" (26) - TIE/FO Fighter
Juke (2), Comm Relay (3)

backdaft is usually target one as once they see what opportunist can do they hate him even more than the other 2. If they don't see it, it's usually too late

 

 

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

I'd prefer a bid on double SF because they're so arc-dodging dependent

even with LWF making them not quite pre-x7 defenders, their statline burns down quick

so a good basic OL is probably the best wingman for them since you get a hefty 3 point bid running the named SF with FCS, primed, LWF (VI on Backdraft, expertise on Quickdraw)

but Double Edge with TLT and crackshot is also 26 points, if you want to vary things up

 

 

or, if you wanna go all in one SF because they're so **** cool, an Omega Specialist with Crackshot and FCS leaves you with 1 point which gives you a bid over Rau Scouts

Edited June 18, 2017 by ficklegreendice

[Iksentrik 108]

I've been finding that the ps contest hasn't really been an issue and vi is wasted on backdraft. I've been playing a variation of this list for months now and have tried every iteration imagined. I just don't find high ps is needed and backdraft with opportunist is amazing.

 

if I was to drop anything I'd drop sensor cluster off QuickDraw for a 98 pt bid, but like I say the list doesn't really require it to work

 

i made top table in local tourney with a slight variation of this and only lost final game due to my sheer stupidity and terrible flying 

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

Vi is astounding/ essential you ever run into

Dengar

Tel

Rau

Terry

Dash

Norra

Miranda 

 

And other sf

 

shooting before/simultaneously with priority targets is a huge advantage, especially when Backdraft can pull game winning crits (esp weapon's failure and blinded pilot) out of his literal ***.

Edited June 18, 2017 by ficklegreendice

[Iksentrik 108]

I've not had any issues so far and have faced all that you mention without vi or adaptability and can beat them. I wasn't able to beat the worlds winning list but was able to go to time and take them both to half health, on another try against that list I'm sure I can take it down 

 

each to his own but I found higher fire power trumped ps every time. 

[thespaceinvader 17,568]

On 16/06/2017 at 3:48 PM, Alekzanter said:

that after I'd hit the same target with Snap Shot that had been rerolled using a Targeting Synch lock that "QuickDraw" set the previous turn

You can't reroll dice during Snap Shot even using someone else's TL.  The only ways a player can modify the dice on one of his ships' Snap Shots are via M9G8 or Palpatine on another ship in the list.

[Goseki1 637]

How often is opportunist triggering? I've find it really difficult to trigger. 

[Iksentrik 108]

9 minutes ago, Goseki1 said:

How often is opportunist triggering? I've find it really difficult to trigger. 

I'd say if you pick the correct ship it's pretty much every round. Sometimes that means picking a different ship than one you've been trying to focus fire down but I've found it's more than worth it when you're doing 4 dice with a free crit out the butt or even 5 dice out the front R1. Expertise QuickDraw really helps to strip token and OL too as long as you're firing at a ship she doesn't have locked

 

[Alekzanter 442]

3 hours ago, thespaceinvader said:

You can't reroll dice during Snap Shot even using someone else's TL.  The only ways a player can modify the dice on one of his ships' Snap Shots are via M9G8 or Palpatine on another ship in the list.

The difference being...?

 

[thespaceinvader 17,568]

14 minutes ago, Alekzanter said:

The difference being...?

 

That Targetting Synchroniser lets the attacking ship reroll dice, whilst per FAQ, those two upgrades let the ship they're on modify the attacking ship's dice for it, which gets around Snap Shot's restriction where TS doesn't.

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

Edit: nvm

 

3 hours o sleep

Edited June 19, 2017 by ficklegreendice

[Flaren48 107]

A friend of mine flew this one. It can be insane if played well in formation. Tomax with infinite cool hand, always takes a focus or evade after use of fleet officer, wich gives the two sf a focus each. A focus acition on them makes their 3 green dice with sensor cluster and two focus an always 3 evade, and nobody can argue about tie/sf firepower!

TIE/SF Fighter: •"Quickdraw" (36)
  Lightweight Frame (2)
  Special Ops Training (0)
  Wired (1)
  Fire-Control System (2)
  Sensor cluster (2)

TIE Bomber: •Tomax Bren (30)
  Lightweight Frame (2)
  TIE Shuttle (0)
  Cool Hand (1)
  Fleet Officer (3)

TIE/SF Fighter: •"Backdraft" (34)
  Lightweight Frame (2)
  Special Ops Training (0)
  Wired (1)
  Fire-Control System (2)
  Sensor cluster (2)

Total:  100/100

[ArbitraryNerd 1,009]

1 hour ago, Flaren48 said:

A friend of mine flew this one. It can be insane if played well in formation. Tomax with infinite cool hand, always takes a focus or evade after use of fleet officer, wich gives the two sf a focus each. A focus acition on them makes their 3 green dice with sensor cluster and two focus an always 3 evade, and nobody can argue about tie/sf firepower!

TIE/SF Fighter: •"Quickdraw" (36)
  Lightweight Frame (2)
  Special Ops Training (0)
  Wired (1)
  Fire-Control System (2)
  Sensor cluster (2)

TIE Bomber: •Tomax Bren (30)
  Lightweight Frame (2)
  TIE Shuttle (0)
  Cool Hand (1)
  Fleet Officer (3)

TIE/SF Fighter: •"Backdraft" (34)
  Lightweight Frame (2)
  Special Ops Training (0)
  Wired (1)
  Fire-Control System (2)
  Sensor cluster (2)

Total:  100/100

Walk me through the "always 3 evade" if you could?

Roll dice. All three are blank. Sensor Cluster lets you change one blank result to an Evade... And you're done. You can't use Sensor Cluster more than once per opportunity, regardless of how many focus tokens you have. Even ignoring that rule, I don't see the third? Then there's the point that they won't always roll three green dice, but I guess that's not really the point.

Edited June 19, 2017 by ArbitraryNerd

[Rakky Wistol 2,903]

Lots of stuff to think of here.  I like it!

[Flaren48 107]

1 hour ago, ArbitraryNerd said:

Walk me through the "always 3 evade" if you could?

Roll dice. All three are blank. Sensor Cluster lets you change one blank result to an Evade... And you're done. You can't use Sensor Cluster more than once per opportunity, regardless of how many focus tokens you have. Even ignoring that rule, I don't see the third? Then there's the point that they won't always roll three green dice, but I guess that's not really the point.

My fault, it was an exitement "always" (i didn't know it could be used once only, also), but on the green dice you will always have at least one evade, even after a red manouver, see it like this. After all having 2 focus tokens, one for sensor and one for eye results on dice, is a good thing that even fenn rau would like to have

Edited June 19, 2017 by Flaren48

[ArbitraryNerd 1,009]

19 hours ago, Flaren48 said:

My fault, it was an exitement "always" (i didn't know it could be used once only, also), but on the green dice you will always have at least one evade, even after a red manouver, see it like this. After all having 2 focus tokens, one for sensor and one for eye results on dice, is a good thing that even fenn rau would like to have

I will heartily agree that it's a decent way to guarantee some damage mitigation, no doubts there!

[Hos 173]

Lots of fantastic ideas here!

Dengar and Tel, the Worlds winning list, how does one counter that? Two plasma torps can kill a focused lwf tie sf in one round of combat

 

 

[thespaceinvader 17,568]

7 hours ago, Hos said:

Lots of fantastic ideas here!

Dengar and Tel, the Worlds winning list, how does one counter that? Two plasma torps can kill a focused lwf tie sf in one round of combat

 

 

Init bid, don't be in range of two plasma torps in the same round.  Basically.

But, realistically, that's not trivial, and jumps are broken.

[Iksentrik 108]

11 hours ago, Hos said:

Lots of fantastic ideas here!

Dengar and Tel, the Worlds winning list, how does one counter that? Two plasma torps can kill a focused lwf tie sf in one round of combat

 

 

When I played against it I found that keeping your distance and making sure that when you engaged you were able to rush into R1 out of arc. It was very difficult but it is doable if you get your engagement right. I was only able to take them both down past 1/2 health. With a bit more practice I think I could beat it

[Jarval 1,530]

I've posted this elsewhere on the forums today, but I've been getting great results with the list below. (Winning a 30ish player Q2 kit tournament, a Store Championship, and a 10ish player weekday tournament evening without losing a game.)

  It's all about the opening exchange though, and a lot of the time you're flying it in a very aggressive way to get shots over arc dodging or keeping tokens for defence.  If you can PS kill a ship, that's the best form of defence of all...  Omega Leader is a great "closer" for the list - if she's going one on one against almost any ship, she can probably win the game for you, especially if that ship is worth 51 points or less.

"Omega Leader" (21)
Juke (2)
Comm Relay (3)

"Backdraft" (27)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Fire-Control System (2)
Homing Missiles (5)
Guidance Chips (0)
Special Ops Training (0)

"Quickdraw" (29)
Crack Shot (1)
Fire-Control System (2)
Homing Missiles (5)
Guidance Chips (0)
Special Ops Training (0)

Total: 98

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