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drkpnthr

Firestorm: Hvy Xbowmen + Fire Rune

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I think this could be a devastating combo in the right hands. Move up, fire xbows on 5, then bath the enemy in righteous fire. I think I have my perfect Daqan army, and strangely I feel I've found the equivalent on my 40K Imperial Guardsmen... more dakka!

32 pts - Kari

4x 37 pts - Heavy Crossbowmen (3x1 trays) + Fire Rune + Close-Quarters Targeting

20 pts - Oathsworn Cavalry (2x1 trays)

 

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Could probably get away with dropping close-quarters targeting on one or two units. Maybe do a 3x2 with shield wall and greyhaven channeler? Getting more of those 4 unstable rune turns could be killer.

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The important question is of the tactics. Would an army like this be able to function? I think it might run into problems with the anemic attack dice in the Heavy Crossbowmen, which have a charge action and bonus damage, but worse probability of damage than Reanimate Archers in melee without the bonus.

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13 minutes ago, drkpnthr said:

The important question is of the tactics. Would an army like this be able to function? I think it might run into problems with the anemic attack dice in the Heavy Crossbowmen, which have a charge action and bonus damage, but worse probability of damage than Reanimate Archers in melee without the bonus.

As long as you can make sure that they are not making attacks while flanked "Close-Quarters Targetting" will allow them to make ranged attacks while engaged. They won't get an extra die from flanking though.

My biggest worry about running something like this is how homogeneous it is.  If you hit anything that the Crossbowmen struggle with you are in for a rough match.

I'm going to assume that undead will get cavalry and elves will be melee infantry around the same time that Crossbowmen get released.

Edited by WWHSD

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If you're playing with objectives, then an all-shooting army is going to struggle, I think. The biggest movement advantage a melee unit has is that free attack after the charge, but your crossbow men can't move and attack which makes them very static. If they do get into melee, they're outclassed by dedicated melee units, and you don't have much that can come to their rescue, or block enemy melee units from getting to you in the first place.

But the biggest drawback of the crossbows is their price, which means you just can't put as many wounds down on the table. These guys lose the war of attrition.

I definitely see these guys as a supporting unit, rather than main line forces.

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I agree, they'll be an interesting addition and in particular situations much better than reanimate/deepwood archers, but they'll be just a help for other units in many games.

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@Elliphino Actually, these crossbowmen CAN move and attack! They have charge on their dial, and +1 damage modifier for melee attacks. They are just limited to one blue dice for melee, so think soft charges... with pillows.

With Close-Quarters Targeting, they can use their full ranged power in melee combat, making them a bit more deadly.

Edited by drkpnthr

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7 minutes ago, drkpnthr said:

@Elliphino Actually, these crossbowmen CAN move and attack! They have charge on their dial, and +1 damage modifier for melee attacks. They are just limited to one blue dice for melee, so think soft charges... with pillows.

With Close-Quarters Targeting, they can use their full ranged power in melee combat, making them a bit more deadly.

Well yeah, I guess technically one blue dice is an attack... technically. :D

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21 minutes ago, drkpnthr said:

@Elliphino Actually, these crossbowmen CAN move and attack! They have charge on their dial, and +1 damage modifier for melee attacks. They are just limited to one blue dice for melee, so think soft charges... with pillows.

With Close-Quarters Targeting, they can use their full ranged power in melee combat, making them a bit more deadly.

No! they can attack and THEN move. It's a slight but very important difference.

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I think their movement is still very situational. It's hard for me to imagine why you would ever want to charge instead of shoot, or move after shooting instead of adding a surge.

I'm not saying it wouldn't ever happen. Maybe moving into terrain after dispatching its inhabitants? Maybe a flank charge into an already engaged and weakened target would be better than risking the panic by shooting into melee? Maybe there's an objective grabbing reason to want to charge or move instead of shooting with a surge? These things could come up, but they seem rare.

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13 minutes ago, Elliphino said:

I think their movement is still very situational. It's hard for me to imagine why you would ever want to charge instead of shoot, or move after shooting instead of adding a surge.

I'm not saying it wouldn't ever happen. Maybe moving into terrain after dispatching its inhabitants? Maybe a flank charge into an already engaged and weakened target would be better than risking the panic by shooting into melee? Maybe there's an objective grabbing reason to want to charge or move instead of shooting with a surge? These things could come up, but they seem rare.

The surge is essentially a blank result if you are at range 4-5. The one move lets you get into range to use your surge ability if you've got an enemy pinned down. 

I can actually see some utility out of that 1 march on the right dial if you've got the Marching Cornicen equipped. It would allow you to fire, and then move forward and change the angle of your arc in anticipation of either a charge you expect to receive to your flank or to be able setup shots in the following round that would be block by a melee unit that hasn't moved yet.    

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46 minutes ago, Elliphino said:

I think their movement is still very situational. It's hard for me to imagine why you would ever want to charge instead of shoot, or move after shooting instead of adding a surge.

I'm not saying it wouldn't ever happen. Maybe moving into terrain after dispatching its inhabitants? Maybe a flank charge into an already engaged and weakened target would be better than risking the panic by shooting into melee? Maybe there's an objective grabbing reason to want to charge or move instead of shooting with a surge? These things could come up, but they seem rare.

For example, to roll 2 red dice in combat if you find the option to charge rear or flank, which do better damage than red+blue. Or maybe against other ranged units. For example ankaur maro is a lot worse in close combat. Reanimate archers or deepwood archers as well... Just an extra choice, nothing too interesting.

Their interesting point is that they will want to advance, so being able to charge is a good addition.

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52 minutes ago, druchii7 said:

For example, to roll 2 red dice in combat if you find the option to charge rear or flank, which do better damage than red+blue. Or maybe against other ranged units. For example ankaur maro is a lot worse in close combat. Reanimate archers or deepwood archers as well... Just an extra choice, nothing too interesting.

Their interesting point is that they will want to advance, so being able to charge is a good addition.

I think that's what it boils down to: from time to time a weird situation will come up and you have a little bit more flexibility.

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1 hour ago, druchii7 said:

Daqan have a lot of hard stuff that is better than the waiqar homologues, but not always. And I think that crossbows will be one of those cases.

I don't think you can call the xbows "better" when they are so wildly different.

They're a damage base. Archers are a support base.

I think they're well balanced. Will give the Daqan an answer to my ranged game, but nothing about them outclasses the way the reanimate archers synergize with other units, and Daqan doesn't have a way to bring them back from the dead, unlike Maro.

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On 5/14/2017 at 9:44 AM, Darth Matthew said:

3x1 Xbows, Artifact Bearer with the no-line of sight item, Rank Discipline and Fire rune.

Shooting twice while hidden safely behind your own units, with re-rolls.

 

-Matt

3x1s can't take champions (Artifact Bearer/Fallen Hero) Unless your using Maro and Ardus.

And if I am taking a champion, I would do Lance Corporal for the red damage.

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On 5/8/2017 at 7:19 PM, drkpnthr said:

I think this could be a devastating combo in the right hands. Move up, fire xbows on 5, then bath the enemy in righteous fire. I think I have my perfect Daqan army, and strangely I feel I've found the equivalent on my 40K Imperial Guardsmen... more dakka!

32 pts - Kari

4x 37 pts - Heavy Crossbowmen (3x1 trays) + Fire Rune + Close-Quarters Targeting

20 pts - Oathsworn Cavalry (2x1 trays)

 

I had a similar idea today: 2 times 3x1 Crossbowmen with Fire Rune and Rank Discipline. (Could be more of course but I currently plan on "only" getting 3 boxes).

+ Kari and a Big unit of Deepwood Archers ( can't wait for the point costs to be revealed). For the Rest of the points, one could add some 2x1 Spearmen (as Blockers) or some Cavalry with Fire Rune for a Heavy Ranged Army.

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On 5/29/2017 at 10:52 AM, Rentner65 said:

I had a similar idea today: 2 times 3x1 Crossbowmen with Fire Rune and Rank Discipline. (Could be more of course but I currently plan on "only" getting 3 boxes).

+ Kari and a Big unit of Deepwood Archers ( can't wait for the point costs to be revealed). For the Rest of the points, one could add some 2x1 Spearmen (as Blockers) or some Cavalry with Fire Rune for a Heavy Ranged Army.

Archers point cost has been spoiled.  https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/6/5/protecting-the-deepwood/ 

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Oaths with firerunes would be a really bad idea.
Theyre more expensive than Spearmen (barely but they are), in that small a number the cavalry are actually pretty easy to remove, and they dont have a white Skill icon, its blue and on the main dial. The Cavalry would almost never get to use the fire rune unless they are in that tiny window where they couldnt charge, but can shoot. Not worth it imo, moving forward + armormod is way more important.

Its one thing i have against the oaths right now....equipment is pretty much only Tempered Steel for them since their Skill is really difficult to get use out of and i dont want mastercrafted weapons over tempered steel in the slightest, rather take the inspiration token over 2 surges for a hit.
Im expecting that to change fairly soon. If my rune golems werent hogging the wind runes i'd put those on there since then they can atleast REFORM for a change lol

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