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Lobokai

[Blog] Is FFG on pace to trade places with GW?!

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40k just tagged out X-Wing as the player friendly, streamlined for balanced play, community involved game... putting X-Wing out to pasture as the exhausted, bloated, sluggish game with power creep and lore breaking game play... how on earth did this happen?

edit: added a sentence to my opener to make this really clear that I'm comparing and contrasting conversations and perceptions in my local scene and how they've changed. 

Edited by Lobokai

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You've made me smile wuth 'Paizo, the publisher of Pathfinder, has had a reputation of great communication and interaction with its fan base'. My experience from the early days of Sean K. Reynolds and Pathfinder beta has been completely contrary.

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Actually...it seems real. I'm happy for the new GW, we must see if it will continue. But this is strange for FFG. I think...mmm...not sure about that but is possibile that FFG want to change some packs because they don't like where the game is going? I know it sounds weird, but...

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No offence to the author, but I entirely checked out the moment it became a rant about ships. I disagreed with the thoughts on Armada, but the X-wing comments read more like an old salty Starcraft forum complaint. 

It's nice to see GW fixing their plethora of problems built up over the last two decades, but they have a long way to go.

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The FFG Star Wars games are bolted firmly to this massive thing called Star Wars (that's no moon).

40k, on the other hand, has an Auschwitz-analogue-powered Emperor (I'm not kidding, read the fluff) and fat stormtroopers. And those are the good guys, and it just gets worse from their. I'm interested in the 40k reboot, getting back into with my Tau and am high on schadenfreude as fanatical neckbeards watch their codexes burn (but didn't that happen every year?), so I don't really have any complaints. But it's never going to be as popular an IP as Star Wars. In fact, kids coming to 40k now are going to be like: cool! These look like stormtroopers! Wait, I have to paint all this stuff?

Edited by Lampyridae

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While your criticism of Pathfinder (3.5 was already a bloated mess and Pathfinder has only added more and more rules) is on point I disagree with your read of X-Wing.

When I hear the complaint of "Luke and Wedge should be commonly flown rebel aces! How did they get left behind by the power creep meta!?" I always think back to when I started the game back in Wave 3.

The sad truth is that Luke and Wedge were never stellar choices even back in the 'pre power creep days'.  It didn't help that a good number of the EPT options in those days were pretty bad (Expose anyone?).  The designers could either balance everything against the X-wing and end up releasing a bunch of ships that couldn't stand up to TIE swarms (which is what they did for several waves) or they could start to bring the power curve up to the level of TIE swarm efficiency (which is what they started doing wave 4 and beyond).

Another point I would make is that to a lot of people ships like the Ghost and the Protectorate Starfighter are just as iconic as X-wings and TIE fighters.  A young person just getting into star wars is going to be exposed to all of those ships at the same time and all of them are canon.  Star Wars is a lot of different things to different people.  Just because the meta isn't what you want it to be does not necessarily mean that the game is broken or needs to be rebuilt from the ground up.

I do agree with you on the Jumpmaster 5000 though.  It was a mistake.

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I enjoyed the read. It is of course very subjective, but it does have a point. Of course it is a bit of a rant at some points, but its to me undeniable that a part of our community wishes for a more direct interaction with ffg.

I feel its rather frustrating that ffg undeniably reads these forums and makes use of our collective minds, at least through playtestwrs, but does not share at least part of their thought process with us. Simple statements or threads like "we are aware of recent complaints about XXX and are working on a solution. Design contest: What would you do?" Would be really uplifting.

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3 hours ago, Stay On The Leader said:

Man, I'm sorry I ever started reading that.  Even the if you had a core point about how bad FFGs community relations are it was wrapped up in way too many personal opinions held up as unarguable facts.

Well poorly written on my part if you thought this was an empirical piece or claiming to be. I kinda felt that titling it a "musing", not listing anything as a fact other then maybe the direct use of "the fact that" in the metaphorical sense of meaning "the state of this being". 

No offense, but I guess I should go back and highlight the first couple sentences that almost nobody apparently read or comprehended. 

As it says, this is comparing how my local gamers perceived and talked about the various games then and now. It's not even my opinions. I said and it is my shock at how perceptions and conversations have changed locally. 

The very bottom is me asking how this happened? Cool down read slower and I  guess to myself, bold and more clearly explain the intent of the next piece. 

Edit: I do in general terms agree with some of the thoughts. But these are neither my chief complaints (I've watched Rebels and know who Miranda is) nor have I ever taken some of these positions (I've been over the moon on Armada since day 1). 

Edited by Lobokai

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33 minutes ago, Lobokai said:

Well poorly written on my part if you thought this was an empirical piece or claiming to be. I kinda felt that titling it a "musing", not listing anything as a fact other then maybe the direct use of "the fact that" in the metaphorical sense of meaning "the state of this being". 

No offense, but I guess I should go back and highlight the first couple sentences that almost nobody apparently read or comprehended. 

As it says, this is comparing how my local gamers perceived and talked about the various games then and now. It's not even my opinions. I said and it is my shock at how perceptions and conversations have changed locally. 

The very bottom is me asking how this happened? Cool down read slower and I  guess to myself, bold and more clearly explain the intent of the next piece. 

Edit: I do in general terms agree with some of the thoughts. But these are neither my chief complaints (I've watched Rebels and know who Miranda is) nor have I ever taken some of these positions (I've been over the moon on Armada since day 1). 

I shared it with my local gaming group, and they agree on a lot of things you bring up.

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No, I read the full thing. Your group's opinion is just that. An opinion. One that I find rather hilarious and after reading it, shows that they do not have the same mentality of most other players I know, so not worth investing more time into. Yeah I'm being kinda snide, but as someone who's played from day one (ok right before wave 1 actually hit) I find most of your comparisons utterly wrong. Keep writing though, as some have voiced they do find solace in your article. I though will look else where for musings.

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3 hours ago, Lampyridae said:

The main reason X-Wing has managed to penetrate the Married Life barrier.

Yup. Married, 2 kids, demanding job. No time for prepping/assembling/moding/priming/painting/sealing figures. But I can swap a cardboard base token from time to time. 

 

If GW has changed their wicked ways, then good for them. The last time I touched their stuff was for a local Mordheim revitalization back in 2005 or so.  After that I never really looked back.  

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Married, no kids but still not that much time for hobbies. Would rather put it into playing the game over painting and assembling for one.

The two things that drew me to x-wing:

1. Star Wars

2. Pre-printed

 

The only game I could see myself ever falling victim to is maybe Armada, for the same teo reasons.

 

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39 minutes ago, Hujoe Bigs said:

... I though will look else where for musings.

Certainly do. I don't blog for popularity, just sharing thoughts as I have them. I enjoy hearing others and maybe make the errant assumption that others might like reading mine. 

I tend to enjoy the occasional echo chamber too, but I watch and read news (sometimes translated) from other countries, often directly talk to people with different sectarian and political views, and find both the local and the international fascinating in business, politics, and gaming. 

Yesterday I was just hanging at the club painting a Horus Heresy Iron Hand while sitting at a table next to a couple pairs of X-Wing players. 

It was like a twilight zone moment for me. Usually I don't paint at the club because it's a little annoying to have someone take some shot at GW every ten minutes, like they expect me to disagree (I rarely do, stupid company most days... but after playing a game for over 20 years at a solid competitive level, you ignore the worts a bit). But I enjoy hanging near the X-Wing action and I've got a couple squads with me in my gaming tackle box should I get tired of painting or someone's looking for a game. I don't even bring 40k stuff as the game is almost unplayable right now IMO and very tricky to teach. 

But yesterday everyone who walked by was at worst skeptically optimistic and often excited for the changes coming down the pipe. Meanwhile the half dozen so people talking X-Wing were mostly doom and gloom. Conversations were as I put in the blog: impotence of early but iconic ships, bloat and power creep, nothing on May the 4th etc. and it started me thinking about how much the other games that dominate my play time have changed in how people talk about them casually.

How a generally loathed company is generating excitement and how the local darling is suddenly reviled, to me, that was note worthy. Sorry that your reaction to that is snide  

Edited by Lobokai

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10 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

It baffles me how someone could say the relatively simple game X-Wing is is bloated.

Having not played other games I only have X-Wing to compare it to.

It has felt bloated ever since Wave 9 came out.

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I'm sorry, but: 

Mr. Lobokai, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this message board is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Heh. I would say it's more of a rant than a muse. 

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Just now, Djaskim609 said:

I'm sorry, but: 

Mr. Lobokai, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this message board is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Heh. I would say it's more of a rant than a muse. 

That is pure ad hominem and uncalled for, even in jest.

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Just now, Lampyridae said:

That is pure ad hominem and uncalled for, even in jest.

I suppose I could have described in detail the absurd hyperbole in the post and why it hurt the author's credibility. 

But I didn't want to. And given that it's a movie quote and not something I made up for the OP, it's not over the top. 

But I will nerf myself. 

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