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noteclado

Rune Golem

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Hi guys let's talk about the Rune Golem

 

First question... is there any reason to use it as a single unit and not as a miniature upgrade?

As a single unit its lack of movility is very frustrating, also I think it is pretty fragile with only 2w.

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Just as a unit by itself it may not be the best. But if you can pair it with another or even a group of 4 I think it could become insane. Especially if the runes go in your favour (if you have a lot of stable runes) for me right now I keep the rune golem on the outside but when I get 4 unstable tunes charge in with a speed 4 charge. To me it seems pretty valuable 

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I have found the 1x1  to be decent. It gives you an extra deployment for 17 points, which allows you to out-deploy your opponent. At 4+ armor, it can be surprisingly difficult to kill, at times. If the runes go your way, it turns into a threat 3 machine of death with an early 4-speed charge. When they aren't your way, they can be a roadblock for your enemy. (Easier for you, since you can pass through single-tray units with no problem)

 

Basically, the biggest reason is to buy an extra deployment, with it acting as either some damage or a bullet magnet, depending on the opponent. It cannot be overstated how much value a deployment at such a low cost is.

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I've been having a difficult time finding a good use for the golems as their own unit. They have the attack and armor profile of a sort of escort or bodyguard role, but they can't keep up with the units they should be escorting. The 2x2 formation could be potentially used as a sort of a cheaper tank or tarpit, but again their limited mobility doesn't put them on the front lines as well as I'd like. Best use I can think of is some sort of objective guard.

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As playnwin said, single Golems for 17 points are nice deployment options, and they give you additional threat vectors to work with. Two red with 2-3 threat is decent damage, and if you can get off a flank charge then all the better. Their mobility is poor, but reform as a modifier is quite nice.

They can also tarpit decently well. Their special action to stun at initiative 3 combined with armoring up means whatever they're engaged with needs at least 5 damage to inflict a wound, and without modifiers. 5-6 armor and 2 wounds is squishier than it sounds, but if they can tie up a unit for a few turns it just might be a good trade. Attacking at initiative 5 means your enemy will frequently get to hit you before you reveal your dial, rendering your armor increase useless.

I'm interested in trying larger units, but haven't so far. A 2x2 with Wind Rune could be interesting, though they come with the option to shift 1 and reform on their dial. Doing it further and at initiative 3 may or may not be worth 6 points. So far none of the banner upgrades seem very useful, but that will surely change with time.

Edited by Bhelliom

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4 hours ago, Ywingscum said:

Stun is underrated.  My opponent used the golems stun on me yesterday for the first time ever.  It later was used to negate my turning charge on another unit . Which ended up costing me the game

Stuns might be crucial in the future when everyone is running casters in their formations that use Special Action modifiers to go pewpewpew or auto-wounds on Blighted targets and all other types of madness.

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Stuns are awesome! I like playing the long game, throw in some stuns early, then punch the damage thru turns after.

I like playing 3x3 spearmen formation, I think the single golem is a good flank guard

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I played 3 games last night with 2 units of 1 golems. They were MVP.

Whoever thinks that aren't maneuverable is wrong. They are actually more maneuverable than anything else. Their speed is random, so just don't ever plan a game winning action on needing 4 speed. 

Their stun and armor-up at low intiative is great. Get these small units into combat with another unit of yours and keep them stunned. 

And their damage potential is huge. With the reform after move making flanks pretty easy to line up you can easily be throwing 3 reds. That gives you a max potential of 18 damage in 1 swing. Granted that is very rare, but last night I got a 12 damage and several 9 damage attacks. I did 12 damage against their hero, granted he only had 1 wound left, but even if he was full HP, he'd have died. 

Also having multiple units helps mitigate blight. 

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I haven't seen the Golem do much offensively yet. But this week one held up Ardus for a while with a good defense bonus and then was able to stun him. All the while Kari was tossing arrows into the combat. So as a defense/tarpit unit it worked pretty good. I should also say though that he got super lucky with Rune casting and was able to move him really well.

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Golems can be used as tarpits, but a canny opponent will have a Lancer or Ardus around to blight and mortal strike them to dust. Watch out for those mortal strikes.

 

I don't think they're best matched against reanimates, though. Reanimates will consistently attack before them, and since they are hunting for morale more than damage anyway, often wind up winning.

 

I agree that the stun+def combo is good, particularly in that case, but again look out for worms. They don't give a ****.

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I think we may be looking at the rune golem with our 'Core Set' blinders on here. Obviously, we are still all at battle-box games stages, and I think when we start seeing more expansions and upgrade cards coming down the pipe this question will start becoming irrelavant to 'what do I give up if I put my points into a spearmen unit vs into a golem-only unit?"

One key difference (so far) is that the while both the runegolem and the spearmen units share the equipment upgrade and banner upgrade slots, the spearmen can get them at a smaller unit size (for less points) and have the option of taking the special upgrades that replace a figure in an infantry unit (though who knows, maybe we will see a runegolem with a massive heraldry held aloft in a few years?). Also, the spearmen have access to more upgrades than the golems.

Another key difference: the runegolems need to use a -LOT- less frontage to gain the same level of threat as an entire unit of spearmen. You can theoretically stick three runegolems side by side in a line and generate a lot more damage, with the typical glass cannon effect. Of course, you have to get them lined up so that they can all three slam into the same unit, and who will stay still for that is an idiot (or pinned by your other units). 

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I ran a unit of 2X1 rune golems and it was surprisingly effective.  the 4-5 threat was scary even though the rolls didn't pan out.  2X2 will be expensive but may be worth it for the survivability and reroll.

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12 hours ago, Klaxas said:

I ran a unit of 2X1 rune golems and it was surprisingly effective.  the 4-5 threat was scary even though the rolls didn't pan out.  2X2 will be expensive but may be worth it for the survivability and reroll.

I watched a battle report with a 2x2 Rune Golems unit. Only one figure was removed the entire game and it did its fair share of damage to the Reanimates it was engaged with. Definitely seemed survivable, as you suspected.

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On 2017-5-1 at 1:23 AM, noteclado said:

Hi guys let's talk about the Rune Golem

 

First question... is there any reason to use it as a single unit and not as a miniature upgrade?

As a single unit its lack of movility is very frustrating, also I think it is pretty fragile with only 2w.

As a waiqar player I both fear and fear envy for the golem.

It's a 1000 times better choice as a siege upgrade, because carrion lancer upgrade only works while unengaged (typically turns 1-2) but siege golem works every turn and it's perfect to reinforce de spearmen, as they are not too killy (red+blue is not enormous damage dealer)

And as a standalone unit it can be both easily whipped out or almost invincible, thanks to that insane defense. And their brutality makes them work really well as a damage dealer in all conditions, taking into account that it's very cheap (solo carrion lancers can merciless destroy if you ar blighted but are quite *** if you are not).

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Having a unit with Grayhaven Chaneller is well worth it for the ability to re-cast a couple of Energy tokens to increase the chance of favourable Energy Pools for your Golems.

 

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Man Golem was a beast today.  I used that wizard upgrade to recast runes.  I was able to have 4 unstable runes more often then not.  Move 4 allowed me to get in position against archers and a worm and just destroyed them.  I think used wisely thing can win games.  

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I'm moving more and more towards the 2x1 option for Golems. Generally I reach for them when I want to increase my unit count and support my other units, so a single Golem is ENOUGH, but the second is just so cheap! And increases the health pool - 2 is just a little too easy to burst down, whereas 4 takes much more effort to remove in my experience. My greatest frustration with Rune Golems has been the lack of rerolls! And actually, looking at the numbers, a 1x2 under Hawthorne has pretty similar expected damage to a 2x1. A little lower on turns with 1 stable rune, a little higher on turns with 2, but more predictable in general. I might have to try that.

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Key thing about golems is theyre not a tank, people keep thinking they are and they fold quickly.

Golems are the second force. While your spearmen are tying up a large blob of enemy forces, the Golems slip by and poke at the smaller ones or flank to assist the spearmen. They are also great bodyguards for your heroes since theyre pretty random on how fast they charge some people wont want to take the risk that the golem got a speed4 init4 charge at the worst possible time for them when theyre trying to get at your hero.

In a 2x1, they can take wind runes and that completely negates their mobility issue, if you call it that. Golems dont have a mobility issue, they have an odd form of mobility that takes time getting used to. Wind Runes however give them such a crazy trick, barring nature runes, that its almost autoinclude worthy.

The thing to remember about 4 armor is you need threat to even damage it, and Threat2 still needs good dice rolls to get through it. Come turn 5-6 if the golem isnt hurt yet it becomes rather difficult to hurt at all. Using Hawthorne to revert their formation to a 1x2 is actually pretty valid since they still have threat2-3 anyway (as oppose to 3-4), but now they have a reroll and i'd hold that higher value than +1 threat since red dice have a habit of blanking out alot.

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So having played with the Rune golem several times now…

 

I’m not enthused.

And they are not that tough. I seem to lose them quickly without much gain. They are slow when I need them to be fast and fast when I don’t care about the speed. They tank poorly, and do not seem to hand out that much damage.

 

I’m not feeling them.

 

But that said..

 

I’m going to buy the pack to give me 4.  And I intend to try to field that 4 pack with  a small spearmen with a Grey channeler and see if I like them better.

 

I think I would like to see a Hero that helps Golems. Perhaps one that can manipulate the Runes like Megan can.

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I suspect that since the daqans even have rune golems someone must be a very powerful wizard/sorcerer in their ranks. Call him the "Runeshaper" and he can heal or flatout revive damaged/fallen golems (not adding trays like Maro, restoring lost ones).

Especially when seeing the Threshers have 5hp...i really dont get why the Runegolem has 2. 4 armor isnt that hard to pen, its just difficult to 1shot without a huge block of trays or mortal strikes (which means about 30% of a list probably cant kill a golem in 1 swoop, while the rest doesnt even have to try)
If the Golem had a quicker attack its defense mod would actually do something. But at Init5, everything swings first or has an Initiative conflict so he attacks second some times (and usually thats when he dies)
And using his init3 action to get a quick armor boost rarely ever prevents damage. At best it prevents the 2nd wound, but typically that doesnt happen anyway unless again its a mortal strike or a huge blob which would still double out his armor anyway.

Edited by Vineheart01

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Yep, I'm seeing the same things. And at 17 points, I'm not sure they should be doing more, but at times its hard to see them doing less. And really they have too many variables. Variable on speed, on damage. If they had a Yellow speed 3 or 4 mark I'd be so much happier, even if it was init 9 or even init 10. 

 

I don't mind them having some randomness, but so much randomness makes them hard to like for me.

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Run them as a 4x1 (with Lord Hawthorne) and they are working off threat 5/6.   If you also have a channeller, then they will get four red runes on average half the time.  And if you equip the RGs with Raven Tabards, then when these come up you get a speed 4 charge at in initiative 3 to do some serious damage. 

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