Tractor Beam a Large Base Ship

[kempokid 868]

I didn't know where to put this, but I was just curious what others thought of this idea:

Modificaton card (4): your tractor beam tokens may be assigned to large ships. The second time a large ship receives a tractor token, the opposing player may choose to perform a boost or barrel roll action.

4 points is pretty steep for a modification slot, but I think it's fair if you get to reposition a large ship. 

Edited April 28, 2017 by jwilliamson12
Said ion but meant tractor beam

[TBot 589]

I don't even think you need to introduce a modification card. I think you could change the rules so that tractor beam tokens work like ion tokens on large ships.

[mkevans80 281]

Agreed, just amend the rule and make them work like ion tokens.  I could also see a "Heavy Tractor Beam" for large/huge ships only, that assigns 2 TB tokens and allows you to move large ships.

[thespaceinvader 17,538]

WAY too powerful.  There's a reason that tractor beams can't move large ships in the first place.  If they were ever goign to bring in a mod like this it would have been in the Quadjumper, and they didn't.

[kempokid 868]

44 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

WAY too powerful.  There's a reason that tractor beams can't move large ships in the first place.  If they were ever goign to bring in a mod like this it would have been in the Quadjumper, and they didn't.

 

Because it would be powerful, that's why I see it needing to come at a point cost and take up a modification slot.

Outside of Ketsu, it would be difficult for a ship to apply two tokens in one round, so you're making the decision to find ways to add two tractor beam tokens on a large ship, then be able to capitalize on it.

[AllWingsStandyingBy 4,570]

It would be powerful, and one of few things keeping tractor beams from wreaking havoc upon the meta is the fact that they are generally useless against Large Ships, so no one brings them much.

That being said, I would find is very unthematic if a little Scyk was literally pushing around a Decimator or a VCX.

Edited April 28, 2017 by AllWingsStandyingBy

[kempokid 868]

2 minutes ago, AllWingsStandyingBy said:

It would be powerful, and one of few things keeping tractor beams from wreaking havoc upon the meta is the fact that they are generally useless against Large Ships, so no one brings them much.

That being said, I would find is very unthematic if a little Scyk was literally pushing around a Decimator or a VCX.

A Scyk wouldn't be able to do it alone though. It would take two tractor beam tokens to move it. Would be unthematic to have two Scyks with tractor beams move a Decimator?

[Kdubb 6,642]

I'm totally on board with a full rule change that 2 tbeam tokens means you get to boost or roll a large base. There is nothing more deflating then piecing together a fun list focused on tbeams just to run into double Ghosts or double Decis. Its dumb it doesn't do anything against them.

 

And while we are at it, abilities that reduce agility (such as outmaneuver or tailgunner) should give you an extra die on attack if the target has a base agility of 0. Maybe that would be a bit extreme, but I find it really silly that depending on the match up, these type of effects can sometimes be 100% wasted points.

Edited April 28, 2017 by Kdubb

[kempokid 868]

11 minutes ago, Kdubb said:

There is nothing more deflating then piecing together a fun list focused on tbeams just to run into double Ghosts or double Decis. Its dumb it doesn't do anything against them.

 

 

This is what triggered my thought to make a post. At least ions can do something vs. large base ship, even if it is a different approach. For tractor beams to be 100% useless vs. a good number of ships makes me nervous to consistently fly a ship like the Shadow Caster, despite how awesome the abilities are if you are able to make it work.

[Stevey86 1,347]

18 minutes ago, Kdubb said:

There is nothing more deflating then piecing together a fun list focused on tbeams just to run into double Ghosts or double Decis.

That's why you make sure the rest of the list hits **** hard.

My Vessery, Ryad, OL list was built around Vessery tractor beaming first and then the squad throwing 8+ dice at the target. But a Deci would still die in 2-3 turns to it.

[BG_None 6]

3 hours ago, jwilliamson12 said:

A Scyk wouldn't be able to do it alone though. It would take two tractor beam tokens to move it. Would be unthematic to have two Scyks with tractor beams move a Decimator?

But if you want to make it work like Ion Cannons, curreent FAQ says you don't discard those tokens until you get the effect (Ion, or in case of this modification - Tractor Beam). But still, it would feel kinda weird to have small ships able to push something bigger than them.

[kempokid 868]

24 minutes ago, BG_None said:

But if you want to make it work like Ion Cannons, curreent FAQ says you don't discard those tokens until you get the effect (Ion, or in case of this modification - Tractor Beam). But still, it would feel kinda weird to have small ships able to push something bigger than them.

 

I don't necessarily want it to work like an ion token. Like you mentioned, ion tokens are removed after you resolve their effect. Tractor beam tokens are removed during the End phase. I don't think it would be fair for a large ship to go around with one less agility until you get a second token on it to resolve the effect.

This modification would let you lower the agility with the first tractor beam, but you would only be able to move it after the second tractor beam token is applied. This means you have to get two tractor beam tokens during one round of combat if you want to move the opponent's ship.

[Shenannigan 644]

Personally, I like the second token idea. 

 

Maybe a mod like this:

advanced tractor beam upgrade (mod), 2 points. 

"When applying a tractor beam token to a ship, if it is the second tractor beam token applied, treat as if the defending ship was a small based ship receiving its first token. "

 

---

affects large ships.

takes planning in the combat phase and list building phase  

can also be used against small ships. 

---

the cost is that to get it to trigger you're (generally) giving up two attacks. 

Edited April 28, 2017 by Shenannigan

[kempokid 868]

1 hour ago, Shenannigan said:

Personally, I like the second token idea. 

 

Maybe a mod like this:

advanced tractor beam upgrade (mod), 2 points. 

"When applying a tractor beam token to a ship, if it is the second tractor beam token applied, treat as if the defending ship was a small based ship receiving its first token. "

 

---

affects large ships.

takes planning in the combat phase and list building phase  

can also be used against small ships. 

---

the cost is that to get it to trigger you're (generally) giving up two attacks. 

 

Yeah, this is a pretty nice way to go about it. I understand how it looks overpowering to be able to move a large ship, but I think it evens out with you having to give up two attacks and make room for two tractor beams (unless you're Ketsu).

[wurms 5,044]

7 hours ago, Kdubb said:

I'm totally on board with a full rule change that 2 tbeam tokens means you get to boost or roll a large base. There is nothing more deflating then piecing together a fun list focused on tbeams just to run into double Ghosts or double Decis. Its dumb it doesn't do anything against them.

 

And while we are at it, abilities that reduce agility (such as outmaneuver or tailgunner) should give you an extra die on attack if the target has a base agility of 0. Maybe that would be a bit extreme, but I find it really silly that depending on the match up, these type of effects can sometimes be 100% wasted points.

My regionals list was Manaroo, Ketsu, and Old Teroch. Match #5 I go up against Double Ghost + Ywing all with ABT. I cant reduce there agility or tractor beam them around, they have no tokens for teroch to drop, and range 1 in arc means they roll 5 dice at me, lol. It was like a complete counter to my list. However, it was one of the most fun games and most rewarding wins I have had in Xwing. Adding a dice to range one to give Ketsu 5 dice would be a bit powerful.

 

I think a tractor beam on a large ship should kick in and work like Wes Janson's ability. So, it doesn't provide damage, but still an attempt to help push damage through and help the squad.

"If a large ship receives a tractor beam token and it's agility is 0, you may remove one focus, evade, or blue target lock token."

[Cpt Hellcat 16]

I'd like to see 2 TB tokens on a large ship move the ship the distance of a small base, so only half of a normal large ship boost or barrel roll.  This would leave open the possibility of a heavy TB that could fully move a large base ship.  The heavy TB would probably be able to move a small ship w the 2 template.  It could be nasty - not sure what the cost would be but a heavy TB should probably be limited to large or huge ships.

[Marinealver 8,068]

I can only see this working one of two ways:

1. Large Ship Only
2. Huge Ship Only

Seriously having a little Scyk throw around a VT-49 Decimator just seems silly. At least I can almost suspend my disbelieve if it was a YT-2400 tractoring a VT-49.

I changed my mind, Huge ship only, and by huge I mean Star Destroyer.

[kempokid 868]

8 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

I can only see this working one of two ways:

1. Large Ship Only
2. Huge Ship Only

Seriously having a little Scyk throw around a VT-49 Decimator just seems silly. At least I can almost suspend my disbelieve if it was a YT-2400 tractoring a VT-49.

I changed my mind, Huge ship only, and by huge I mean Star Destroyer.

If a small ship can tractor beam a small ship, then I could see how a large ship to tractor beam a large one. Like @Cpt Hellcat said, make it large ship only.

I'm not sure how many large ships will take this modification instead of engine upgrade or Gync.

I like @wurms idea as well. Just give me something for investing points into something with a tractor beam. It's really the only thing that something is immune to.

[JJFDVORAK 1,210]

45 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

I can only see this working one of two ways:

1. Large Ship Only
2. Huge Ship Only

Seriously having a little Scyk throw around a VT-49 Decimator just seems silly. At least I can almost suspend my disbelieve if it was a YT-2400 tractoring a VT-49.

I changed my mind, Huge ship only, and by huge I mean Star Destroyer.

Yeah, I agree. I think only a huge ship should be able to tractor a large ship. Maybe a "Tractor Beam Bank" or something. It should require a lot of energy to use(Obi-Wan on the Death Star comes to mind) and it should boost/barrel roll large ships one and small ships two. You could easily tractor a ship into the path of your huge ship. If the tractored ship shoots a missile/torpedo at the bank it looses it's effect in some way.(like Luke does in the Thrawn books) 

[boomaster 120]

19 hours ago, jwilliamson12 said:

A Scyk wouldn't be able to do it alone though. It would take two tractor beam tokens to move it. Would be unthematic to have two Scyks with tractor beams move a Decimator?

 

15 hours ago, jwilliamson12 said:

I don't necessarily want it to work like an ion token. Like you mentioned, ion tokens are removed after you resolve their effect. Tractor beam tokens are removed during the End phase. I don't think it would be fair for a large ship to go around with one less agility until you get a second token on it to resolve the effect.

This modification would let you lower the agility with the first tractor beam, but you would only be able to move it after the second tractor beam token is applied. This means you have to get two tractor beam tokens during one round of combat if you want to move the opponent's ship.

Ketsu crew fixes both of those issues (for scum).

It's the distance I have a problem with, moving a large base ship 1 forward or barrel roll is a very long way in comparison to moving a small base. I'd like to see tractor beams affect large base ships, but short of coming up with separate templates to move the large ships an appropriate distance the starting point should be the agility loss for having a token. 1 Agility Jumps and Dash start to notice damage, when you can hit them...