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Kanpeki

Plastic glue -- now you tell me...

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So, apparently the Plastic Glue made by a certain other company that -- um -- really HAMMERS their WAR games -- is kind of proprietary? I got my shiny new starter kit for Runewars and grabbed a bottle of Plastic Glue off the shelf next to it at my FLGS. Only after I got home did I read the Waiquar painting guide and found somewhere deep within that tome that Runewars miniatures "semi" soft plastic doesn't respond to Plastic Glue. So, I've got a whole afternoon set aside for assembly and NO superglue to be found. Grrr...

 

Will the plastic glue REALLY not work? Or just not work as quickly as it does for the other plastics? I mean, it's still plastic, it'll still melt, right?

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Plastic glue isnt glue, its literally a chemical reaction to slightly melt the plastic so it bonds that way rather than glue. I hate the stuff, its not only very picky on the type of plastic but its impossible to remove if you goof or wanna repose or something.

Always, always use super glue. I just buy the cheapo little packs from walmart. Dont last long, but the less a bottle of super glue is opened the less likely it'll seal itself with its own glue so i prefer them over larger bottles.

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Thanks for the product tips, folks. In my past playing games from other companies I have seriously injured my hands having to cut them apart (with one of those modelling knives) after supergluing my fingers together all the way down to the knuckle. Ouch...

 

Anyway, I was hoping the plastic glue would solve this dilemma since it won't bond skin. Then I read the painting guide and cursed the Rune gods...

So -- update -- the plastic glue may actually be working. I've just had to let the spearmen sit a while and I think the plastic did eventually get melty and is now reforming together. I'll test the bond shortly and maybe post some pics.

 

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I put together my waiqan with plastic glue and I see no issues with it bonding and joining the pieces as good as anything else.

As ppl have said though, it does melt the plastic somewhat and can lead to unwanted shapes if applying too much force when joining the pieces.

Also it takes some time to dry, but this is a feature I prefer since it means I can get the pieces aligned perfectly. Sometimes with superglue, the pieces join before you've managed to get them into position and you have to break it apart, file the glue away and redo it.

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I usually just stick with super glue, although I also use a tiny amount of Gorilla Glue for metal models. Usually it's just some of the very dramatic Infinity models so it shouldn't be needed for Runewars.

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"Plastic glue" is for polystyrene plastic such as you would get in GW plastics and hobby model kits. The way it works is by oxidizing the plastic and essentially melting it together.

The plastic used in Runewars is PVC, it does not melt the same way as polystyrene does with "plastic glue". If you use plastic glue, it will form a poor, but probably workable bond for minis purposes, but it will take a long time to dry and won't work very well. Instead you need to use a cyanoacrylate based glue that forms a surface bond. As others have mentioned, this is Super Glue, Loctite, etc. This glue is typically harder to work with, but works on a variety of surfaces.

Finally, for your basing materials such as sand, rocks, and static grass, it won't hold well with either plastic glue or Super Glue. You'll need to use PVC glue, aka white school glue, like Elmer's, or wood glue.

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Further update -- the joins did not hold. The Spearmen arms came right off after I let them sit for about 4 hours. Womp Womp...

I got some Loc Tite and will reassembly everything tomorrow, LOL!

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honestly, except for some of the Waiqan pieces (shield arms), the models stay together without glue pretty well so im not even going to glue them at all until i paint them. I cant stand trying to paint models that are fully assembled, atleast when theres overlapping pieces such as a 2handed weapon or holding the weapons right up against their body. Both the larger models i'd be fine painting in 1 piece, but theyre solid enough where i could get away with never gluing them i bet rofl.

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4 hours ago, Elliphino said:

"Plastic glue" is for polystyrene plastic such as you would get in GW plastics and hobby model kits. The way it works is by oxidizing the plastic and essentially melting it together.

The plastic used in Runewars is PVC, it does not melt the same way as polystyrene does with "plastic glue". If you use plastic glue, it will form a poor, but probably workable bond for minis purposes, but it will take a long time to dry and won't work very well. Instead you need to use a cyanoacrylate based glue that forms a surface bond. As others have mentioned, this is Super Glue, Loctite, etc. This glue is typically harder to work with, but works on a variety of surfaces.

Finally, for your basing materials such as sand, rocks, and static grass, it won't hold well with either plastic glue or Super Glue. You'll need to use PVC glue, aka white school glue, like Elmer's, or wood glue.

Agree with all except the last bit.  Super glue works great for sand and rocks, though how it works with static grass might vary depending on the consistency.  I've been using super glue alot more in the last couple years for sand and rocks because it works so fast that I can paint the bases in minutes rather than waiting hours for PVA to dry.

 

I assembled the Daquan from 2 boxed sets last weekend.  I cut most of the arm puzzle-piece-parts down to pegs to allow for arm swapping and alternate angles on the 32 Spearmen.  Took a bit more time, but they look alot more varried in post now.   Will have some pics soon.

I love solvent (I often use straight MEK) glue for polystyrene figures but for the Runewars PVC I used water-thin superglue. Even with the mods, there was more than enough contacting surface for the glue to work fast and strong.  Water thin is great in that you can push the models together and then drip some on the join. Capillary action will draw the glue into the crevase and the join will be strong and -as long as you don't use much- it dries faster than gel superglues.  Will get alot less on fingers as well.

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2 hours ago, Kanpeki said:

Further update -- the joins did not hold. The Spearmen arms came right off after I let them sit for about 4 hours. Womp Womp...

I got some Loc Tite and will reassembly everything tomorrow, LOL!

Really? Mine holds up perfectly, I would break the plastic far before the glue joint gave in.

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"Plastic" glue, often labelled polystyrene glue, works by a solvent action. The glue is a solution of relatively short chain polymer in the appropriate organic solvent. The solvent partially dissolves, or softens the two surfaces and the polymer chains intermingle to form a very strong bond once the solvent has all evaporated.

How well it will work on a non polystyrene plastic depends on how soluble that plastic is in the glue solvent. The less soluble it is, the less mingling of molecules, and the longer the solvent will take to "soak" into the plastic. This will give a weaker bond, and longer setting time. 

Test the glue you have by putting some on an unimportant bit of the plastic in question, and after half a minute or so try scraping gently with a knife to see if any softening, or dissolving is happening - the more the better.

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23 hours ago, Lyraeus said:

Yes. I use it for everything 

Seriously, pewter, plastic, resin. That stuff holds everything for nigh eternity. And when I mean hold, I mean to the point that trying to disassembled anything means breaking it.

 

I learned that the hard way with an old 40k plastic/pewter ravener. Thankfully, it glued right back together with a little touch-up paint to hide the break. The stuff is practically a fundamental force of nature...like duct tape.

 

In fact, it may be liquid duct tape.

Edited by Deathseed

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1 hour ago, Deathseed said:

Seriously, pewter, plastic, resin. That stuff holds everything for nigh eternity. And when I mean hold, I mean to the point that trying to disassembled anything means breaking it.

 

I learned that the hard way with an old 40k plastic/pewter ravener. Thankfully, it glued right back together with a little touch-up paint to hide the break. The stuff is practically a fundamental force of nature...like duct tape.

 

In fact, it may be liquid duct tape.

If you find yourself in need of disassembling super glue (Cyanoacryliate, aka CA) assmbled models, I recommend putting them in the freezer.  Once they get good and cold the glue often becomes very brittle (or the glue and model material react differently to the cold) and can be easily broken apart.

If you're dealing with metal models, then acetone or MEK will disolve the super glue. Acetone and MEK will also disolve plastic, but sometimes you can drip it into the joins and break the bond without damaging the surrounding model much.

If you're willing to sacrifice the paint job then tossing the model into a vat of Purple Power (or any other  degreaser with 2 butox-ethanol) will break down the superglue bond and the parts will easily come apart.  Of course it will also remove the paint.

As an asside, the strength of superglue also depends on the shape of the surfaces invovled. If you've got a multi direcitonal and matching surfaces like the puzzle piece runewars models, superglue will be super strong.  If you use superglue on two surfaces that are flat or mostly flat but not even, the bond won't be nearly as strong. Superglue has massive strength when you are pulling it apart, but much less "shear" strength.

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On 4/13/2017 at 3:13 PM, Kanpeki said:

Thanks for the product tips, folks. In my past playing games from other companies I have seriously injured my hands having to cut them apart (with one of those modelling knives) after supergluing my fingers together all the way down to the knuckle. Ouch...

 

Anyway, I was hoping the plastic glue would solve this dilemma since it won't bond skin. Then I read the painting guide and cursed the Rune gods...

So -- update -- the plastic glue may actually be working. I've just had to let the spearmen sit a while and I think the plastic did eventually get melty and is now reforming together. I'll test the bond shortly and maybe post some pics.

 

Use nail polish remover or rubbing alcohol if it gets on your fingers. I believe those two work well.  Been a while since I worked it it. 

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Super glue goes bad!

Grabbed an old bottle and was halfway through the undead before I noticed it wasn't holding,  just a gooey mess.

Luckily I also bought an army painter starter set.  So wiped off the old and on with the new and the day was saved!

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