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N-1 Naboo Starfighter for X-Wing

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13 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

I see this a lot and I just don't get it. The aethersprite is just a triangle with no distinguishing features. Why does everyone seem to like it so much? Even if I don't agree with the people that like the Arc and the gunboat, I can at least comprehend liking them, but the aethersprite is the most boring ship design in Star Wars. There isn't anything TO like about it. 

I'll admit it's probably one of my less favorite designs from the prequels.

But it's still better than some of the EU designs *cough* punisher *cough* kwing.

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38 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

I see this a lot and I just don't get it. The aethersprite is just a triangle with no distinguishing features. Why does everyone seem to like it so much? Even if I don't agree with the people that like the Arc and the gunboat, I can at least comprehend liking them, but the aethersprite is the most boring ship design in Star Wars. There isn't anything TO like about it. 

It looks to me like an A-Wing, with sleeker, sharper lines and with a built in droid. 

It has the point that the A-Wing is missing, and like I've mentioned before about my TIE Interceptors, I like ships that look like they want to stab you.

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3 hours ago, SabineKey said:

Lol! Soooo many problems with this analogy.

You and several other people have joined to say you don't want the N-1, but are still not the majority opinion. Meaning the choir is more than half made up of "atheists".

This is also up on the main page where everyone can see it. If someone sees this thread and passes it by, it is likely that they don't care enough to join the conversation. That indicates not much caring one way or another about the N-1 coming into the game. If you are right, we should be swimming in negative comments, instead of them being the minority in this thread. 

Like I pointed out before, one can dislike the prequels and still be alright with elements of such. Ewan McGregor was a part of the prequels, and yet I keep hearing people expressing a desire for a solo Obi Wan movie with McGregor staring. 

And finally, your narrow view of what a Star Wars fan is rather shameful. People can enjoy the prequels and still be Star Wars fans, just as a person who has just played the games or read the books can be a Star Wars fan, or someone who just likes the Original Trilogy. Those who advocate for more prequel ships in X-Wing aren't atheists. They are, at most, Presbyterians to your Baptists. (Well, Catholic and Protestant might be a better analogy.)

They're more like Christians to Jews, or Mormons to Christians. They want to add a bunch of stuff that someone who is traditional wouldn't see as valid.

Only liking good Star Wars content isn't a narrow view. The Alien series of movies is better without Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection , and if a sequel to Aliens were to come out that ignored Alien 3 and 4 and had Signourney Weaver, Michael Beihn , and Carrie Henn reprising their roles as Ripley, Hicks, and Newt respectively, the series would be better. The small amount of fans that like Alien 3 should just be disregarded.

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On ‎4‎/‎7‎/‎2017 at 6:44 PM, DailyRich said:

We've already got prequel characters mixing with OT and new characters in Destiny, so it wouldn't be without precedent.

That's because CCG players will gobble up anything.

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4 minutes ago, Turbo Toker said:

They're more like Christians to Jews, or Mormons to Christians. They want to add a bunch of stuff that someone who is traditional wouldn't see as valid.

Only liking good Star Wars content isn't a narrow view. The Alien series of movies is better without Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection , and if a sequel to Aliens were to come out that ignored Alien 3 and 4 and had Signourney Weaver, Michael Beihn , and Carrie Henn reprising their roles as Ripley, Hicks, and Newt respectively, the series would be better. The small amount of fans that like Alien 3 should just be disregarded.

Eh, I still think the Protestant and Catholic analogy is better (you know, the older organization saying that the newer isn't valid, then later admitting they are.)

I'm not saying that just liking the Original Trilogy makes anyone less of a Star Wars fan. If you prefer your personal Star Wars experience to just be those three movies, that is completely up to you and have fun with it. But in the end, that preference is an opinion. Other people have other opinions about what is a part of Star Wars. Why should your opinion of Star Wars be held above the others? You don't like the N-1, don't get it or play with it. Let others who do like it have their fun. Plus, you get the opportunity to now blow up what you don't like. That sounds like a win-wing scenario. 

As for your Alien example, Alien 3 and Resurrection still exist. And those who enjoy them can do so without bothering those who don't, who can ignore those two movies as they see fit.

And finally, you are pushing that your opinion on Star Wars as the only one, which this very thread disproves. Why should anyone respect your opinion if you do not respect theirs?

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17 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

Wow, that response is just sad.

It makes sense that the people who can gobble up that game's stupid and random sales model would also be the same kind of people that can tolerate crap Star Wars movies in their game.

All a bunch of former Magic players that want to get back into it, but since it says Star Wars on it, they go for Destiny instead. Something about that obnoxious sales model and being able to out money people by buying $200 tarmogoifs or whatever it's called draws them in.

Edited by Turbo Toker

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6 minutes ago, Turbo Toker said:

It makes sense that the people who can gobble up that game's stupid and random sales model would also be the same kind of people that can tolerate crap Star Wars movies in their game.

All a bunch of former Magic players that want to get back into it, but since it says Star Wars on it, they go for Destiny instead. Something about that obnoxious sales model and being able to out money people by buying $200 tarmogoifs or whatever it's called draws them in.

That just made it sadder. You made up your mind about CCGs, and you are projecting it out on other people. Is it so hard to recognize that deserning can like CCGs? Or that Destiny works because it scratches an itch some people have? Just because you don't have that itch doesn't mean it is useless or stupid.

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Sabinekey - don't even bother. Every single one of his posts have been nothing but bitching and whining and spewing venom all over the place. He hasn't contributed one constructive idea in 60 posts, he just wants to shout how everything is crap but would be so much better if people listed to him. 

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3 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

Sabinekey - don't even bother. Every single one of his posts have been nothing but bitching and whining and spewing venom all over the place. He hasn't contributed one constructive idea in 60 posts, he just wants to shout how everything is crap but would be so much better if people listed to him. 

Yeah, I've come to that conclusion myself. 

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14 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

Sabinekey - don't even bother. Every single one of his posts have been nothing but bitching and whining and spewing venom all over the place. He hasn't contributed one constructive idea in 60 posts, he just wants to shout how everything is crap but would be so much better if people listed to him. 

Sabinekey, this is why no one will come in here and say that they don't want the N-1 and argue with pro-prequel ship people. They'll be perceived as complainers that are just raining on parades.

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2 hours ago, Forgottenlore said:

I see this a lot and I just don't get it. The aethersprite is just a triangle with no distinguishing features. Why does everyone seem to like it so much? Even if I don't agree with the people that like the Arc and the gunboat, I can at least comprehend liking them, but the aethersprite is the most boring ship design in Star Wars. There isn't anything TO like about it. 

The second part of your post makes it clear that you're asking rhetorical rather than genuine questions. So if you made up your mind, put all defenses in place and don't want to see it, then I don't want to spoil your party. But here goes:

The Aethersprite is a good design because it accomplishes several things. It is ambiguous between a weapon of war and an object of beauty: it's shape suggests sleekness and speed, but also the piercing power of an arrow. It looks like a fast ship, but also like a star destroyer. So it appears to have a leg in the past and is also a reference to the future. The design is at the same time unambiguous in another sense: you see it and immediately grasp what it is, how it moves, and what it is supposed to do. It's like a sports car, you immediately think: "yes, that thing's fast!" It is also important to note that the cockpit is at the back of the craft, which is again a reference to star destroyers, but it is also a psychological effect. Vehicles where the pilot is behind most of the machinery have a different feel than vehicles which have the pilot in front. My interpretation is that in the OT, many vehicles had the pilot in a kind of 'head' at the front, like they were in charge of events. The prequels had more pilots behind the machine, like events were leading them to some destiny.

So it speaks on several levels, and good design does that. Not bad for something that is little more than a triangle.

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30 minutes ago, Verlaine said:

My interpretation is that in the OT, many vehicles had the pilot in a kind of 'head' at the front, like they were in charge of events. The prequels had more pilots behind the machine, like events were leading them to some destiny.

That's an interesting level of interpretation. 

Doesn't change the fact that it could have had SOME details added to it to give it some visual interest though. S-Foils that fanned out to give it the wedge shape, an indentation on the sides (which would reinforce both the arrowhead and star destroyer connections you see), something. 

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6 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

That's an interesting level of interpretation. 

Doesn't change the fact that it could have had SOME details added to it to give it some visual interest though. S-Foils that fanned out to give it the wedge shape, an indentation on the sides (which would reinforce both the arrowhead and star destroyer connections you see), something. 

My guess is that lack of detail works better in the asteroid chase scene. This is purely something that feels right to me on a visual level, but I find that "intuitive + visual" comes close to a short description of how Lucas directed Star Wars, so it would be the kind of explanation we should probably be looking for.

A good design is not something that is pretty, makes you go "yeah!" or even catches your eye. Good design contributes to what you want to achieve, it communicates what you want to communicate (which suggests the problem with some legends designs - they don't say much more than "we really love Star Wars!")

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5 minutes ago, Verlaine said:

A good design is not something that is pretty, makes you go "yeah!" or even catches your eye. Good design contributes to what you want to achieve, it communicates what you want to communicate

I would argue that that is merely adequate design. Good design does both.

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If FFG puts the N-1 into the game, I kind of envision it as being a bit like the F-104. The ship is rather fragile, has a huge profile from the top and bottom, and a minimal profile from the front/back. The thing is built to either be running right at an opponent or running directly away. Arc dodging and sharp turns are only going to open it up to getting hit on the top or bottom (like the one hit on the bottom by the Trade Federation AAT). So the rule of the day is gotta go fast and straight. Give it red hard turns ('banking with intent to turn'), a white K-Turn and maybe make like the Protectorate fighter in that if it is being shot at from its primary arc or a non-weapon secondary arc, it gets an extra green die.

Edited by flyboymb

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2 hours ago, Turbo Toker said:

Sabinekey, this is why no one will come in here and say that they don't want the N-1 and argue with pro-prequel ship people. They'll be perceived as complainers that are just raining on parades.

Turbo Tank, I think it was your delivery more then your arguing against it. I'm not a big fan of the prequels, but I can also still enjoy them. The way your posts read, it makes it sound like it's your way or the highway, and that anyone who likes anything about the prequels is an idiot or bellow you. I've mentioned that I've never seen a ship in Star Wars that I don't like, be it from the prequels, OT, TFA, R1, or the shows, not to mention all the other media, so that's one of the things I can enjoy in the prequels. I can also appreciate the scale of the battles and the dogfighting scenes. Heck, the asteroid chase is one of my favorites. My point is that even though I like pretty much everything else other than "the special that shall not be named" better than the prequels, I can enjoy them, and shouldn't basically be told I'm not a true fan because of it. 

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I'm going to echo sf1raptors thoughts.

It was less your opinion and more the arrogant assumptions you made in addition to how you represent and 'enforce' (for lack of a better word) your opinion. The impression I got from what you said is that it's your way and no way. A very childish attitude to take. This comes from when you said you'd quit the game if they introduced the N-1 which does come off as childish and petty that one ship just being included can change so much.

This was then supplemented with your (incorrect) assertion that the game would die if they introduced prequel era ships when evidence to the contrary exists within the game as people point out.

It's perfectly fine to not like the N-1 and you don't want to see it in the game...saying you'd quit the game over it and the game would die if it included it is taking that to a whole new level.

We get it, you don't like the prequels. However, to some people, those are the films they remember, those are the films they grew up with. Their Star Wars is equally as valid as your Star Wars and trying to deny someone something from 'their Star Wars' just because it upsets you is very selfish. You have 35 or whatever other ships in the game, 10 of those ships came from the era of Star Wars that you enjoy...but god forbid someone gets one or even two ships from their Star Wars in a game they also love. It is a clear arrogant sign that only your worldview matters and screw everyone else.

Edited by Ebak

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14 minutes ago, Ebak said:

We get it, you don't like the prequels. 

It's not just the N1 or the prequels. Since he started posting a few days ago he has been viciously attacking the entire game in general, FFG and its designers, the film industry in general, Lucas Star Wars, Disney Star Wars and anybody who tries to defend them is an undiscriminating apologist who is too ignorant to see the truth. 

Since the invention of message boards I have never put anyone on an ignore list until today, but this guy seems totally uninterested in doing anything except badmouthing anything he doesn't like, which seems to be everything. 

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4 hours ago, Turbo Toker said:

Sabinekey, this is why no one will come in here and say that they don't want the N-1 and argue with pro-prequel ship people. They'll be perceived as complainers that are just raining on parades.

Both @sf1raptor and @Ebak put my general position quite well. It is not necessarily your stance of not wanting the N-1 in X-Wing that I am arguing against. Several people have said that same thing simply, giving their preference, and that was it. You don't see me debating with them. Where you go wrong is your attitude and assumption that having the N-1 in X-Wing will spell the end of the game. Trust me, X-Wing has survived and will survive worse things. 

If you prefer to enjoy a certain subset of Star Wars and ignore the rest, that is your right, and I genuinely wish you happiness in what you enjoy. Just let other people have what they enjoy too. We are all Star Wars fans. Just because we have different tastes doesn't mean one has to be right, and the other wrong. 

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3 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

It's not just the N1 or the prequels. Since he started posting a few days ago he has been viciously attacking the entire game in general, FFG and its designers, the film industry in general, Lucas Star Wars, Disney Star Wars and anybody who tries to defend them is an undiscriminating apologist who is too ignorant to see the truth. 

Since the invention of message boards I have never put anyone on an ignore list until today, but this guy seems totally uninterested in doing anything except badmouthing anything he doesn't like, which seems to be everything. 

1
 

In an attempt to play devil's advocate and give everyone a fair trial; He certainly has been negative in what he says...but that isn't necessarily a crime. He did make a comment about someone who was statting up clone era Y-Wings:

"That's an uglier, prequel version of the Y-Wing. Instead of being a Y-Wing, it's an ugly rounded 1999 Ford Taurus blob Y-Wing. No."

While to me it seems like he merely jumps on anything that even suggests the word 'Prequel' that is still his opinion to have. He didn't belittle someone in that comment he merely gave his opinion, why he disliked it and made his decision of 'no'.

Furthermore he called into question the dice design choice in Imperial assault and said that X-Wing is fine until you bring mitigation mechanics like Autothrusters and Palpatine into the equation. I do see his point with that and while Autothrusters are a necessary evil I do personally fear the amount of dice mitigation mechanics that exist in X-Wing to the point where rolling the dice merely becomes trivial.

So it's not all doom and gloom from him, he is just giving his opinion although I do admit that he could be more respectful of other peoples opinion.

....

I don't like the guy, but I think people deserve a fair crack of the whip and being negative is not a crime in itself. It's a very unhealthy way to live your life...but it's not illegal.

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