Rebel crit build

[Hockeyzombie 619]

I've been playing Imperials almost exclusively, so I want to give Rebels another go. Here's what I'm thinking. 

 

MC80 Battle Cruiser (flagship)

-General Dodonna

-Gunnery Team

-Leading Shots

-XX-9 Turbolasers

-X17 Turbolasers

-Mon Karren

 

MC30c Torpedo Frigate

-Ordnance Experts

-Advanced Projectors

-Assault Proton Torpedoes

 

MC30c Torpedo Frigate

-Ordnance Experts

-Advanced Projectors

-Assault Proton Torpedoes

 

GR-75 Medium Transports

-Leia Organa

 

Shara Bey

Tycho Celchu

Wedge Antilles

YT-2400

 

Precision Strike

Jamming Barrier

Superior Positions

 

Obviously, the goal is to pummel them with critical effects and just pick the most damaging card available. I play Gladiators often so I'm pretty confident I can get my MC30s up close and personal. The GR-75 will just trail behind the Mon Karren to help me change plans if the situation doesn't develop the way I expect it to. My usual opponent isn't big on bomber lists so I'm fine with a light screen as long as I take out anything that can reliably hurt a ship. I'm also happy with first or second player, so I don't mind spending most/all of my points. (Edit: I miscounted; thought I had 2 points left but I'm at 400 with the list as it's shown) (Edit of my edit: I actually was at 398, forgot that I'd removed Ahsoka but there's an updated version of the list a few posts down anyway)

 

I'm not sure about Jamming Barrier. My thinking was that I could use it to prevent the torpedo frigates from taking too much damage on the way in but I've never used that objective. I also considered Hyperspace Assault and Planetary Ion Cannon. Precision Strike seems like an obvious choice with two ships launching APTs at people and Superior Positions lets me deploy my entire list after my opponent so I like it. Of course, I'm open to suggestions. 

Edited March 29, 2017 by Hockeyzombie

[chr335 658]

Add Luke as he ignores shields when attacking ships and has a black bomber dice giving another crit generator.

[Hockeyzombie 619]

48 minutes ago, chr335 said:

Add Luke as he ignores shields when attacking ships and has a black bomber dice giving another crit generator.

I like the idea but with only four squadrons what are the odds he gets more than one attack on a ship? I could switch him in and drop Wedge but I'm already pretty light on squadrons, and Wedge will be better at evening the odds there. 

[chr335 658]

Yeah you are pretty tight on points

[Johnnyreb 81]

Go for the MC30 titles over advanced projects they are both better....

[Hockeyzombie 619]

6 hours ago, Johnnyreb said:

Go for the MC30 titles over advanced projects they are both better....

Only have the points to make that change on one of them, but I'll give Foresight a try. 

[Rettere 247]

How about comms net on the Leia transport?

Also I would reconsider the xi7... when you already have mon karren the xi7 isn't buying you much. I'd rather have dual turbolasers, or spinal armament (drop advanced projectors to pay for it).

[Hockeyzombie 619]

54 minutes ago, Rettere said:

How about comms net on the Leia transport?

Also I would reconsider the xi7... when you already have mon karren the xi7 isn't buying you much. I'd rather have dual turbolasers, or spinal armament (drop advanced projectors to pay for it).

Opened the list up in a builder and realized I'm actually right at 400, so I'd have to drop something for Comms Net. Dual Turbolasers are always good, might switch them in. I've only used X17s once or twice so I'll probably try them out before I change them. My usual opponent really likes his Victory-classes so between X17 and at least one Accuracy result I might be able to basically disable all his defence tokens. Against other people I'll probably just go straight to DTTs instead. 

[Rettere 247]

I guess my point is that you get maximum value from Mon Karren (an expensive title) when it is the only token control you are using. As an example, if you have Xi7 and a natural accuracy vs. the VSD, then Mon Karren is actually giving you nothing for that attack. So I would either use MK or Xi7 but not both.

 

 

[Darth Sanguis 6,327]

May be silly advice, but with this build I'd try very hard to squeeze in an Intel officer on mon karren. If the defender can only use one defense token, and can only redirect one point... then they're probably gonna take brace (if they have it).... either way, with an Intel officer you can take out a brace very early.... That can spell the end of bulkier ships like ISDs and is more effective than depending on accuracy icons as ECMs is fairly common.

My 2¢

Edited March 29, 2017 by Darth Sanguis

[Hockeyzombie 619]

5 hours ago, Rettere said:

I guess my point is that you get maximum value from Mon Karren (an expensive title) when it is the only token control you are using. As an example, if you have Xi7 and a natural accuracy vs. the VSD, then Mon Karren is actually giving you nothing for that attack. So I would either use MK or Xi7 but not both.

Good point. For some reason I kept doing my math as if stopping the brace token was somehow effected by whether I had both upgrades or just one. For some reason it just now sunk in that either way I need an accuracy result to stop the brace. I mean, he can redirect the damage to the sides but my torpedo frigates are totally fine with that. 

1 hour ago, Darth Sanguis said:

May be silly advice, but with this build I'd try very hard to squeeze in an Intel officer on mon karren. If the defender can only use one defense token, and can only redirect one point... then they're probably gonna take brace (if they have it).... either way, with an Intel officer you can take out a brace very early.... That can spell the end of bulkier ships like ISDs and is more effective than depending on accuracy icons as ECMs is fairly common.

My 2¢

And while we're on the subject of removing brace tokens...I was going to set this idea aside for another list but after looking it over I'm loving the look of Intel Officer+X17. Since it seems Mon Karren is a bit redundant with what I'm doing I'll leave that part aside to try later. For now I'll use X17s instead of Mon Karren because that way I can basically dismiss redirect tokens as not important, which will make it much easier to determine which tokens to name with Intel Officer and get through them a lot faster. 

 

Current build is 

MC80 Battle Cruiser

-General Dodonna

-Intel Officer

-Gunnery Team

-Leading Shots

-Medical Team

-XX-9 Turbolasers

-X17 Turbolasers

 

MC30c Torpedo Frigate

-Ordnance Experts

-Assault Proton Torpedoes

-Foresight

 

MC30c Torpedo Frigate

-Ordnance Experts

-Advanced Projectors

-Assault Proton Torpedoes

 

GR-75 Medium Transports

-Leia Organa

 

Wedge Antilles

Shara Bey

Tycho Celchu

YT-2400

 

Precision Strike

Jamming Barrier

Superior Positions

[Darth Sanguis 6,327]

looks fierce! 

[Rettere 247]

I still think Leia wants a comms net. 2 points to turn your emergency dial into an emergency dial+token is HUGE...

[Hockeyzombie 619]

7 hours ago, Rettere said:

I still think Leia wants a comms net. 2 points to turn your emergency dial into an emergency dial+token is HUGE...

I actually have gone back and found room, though in doing so I redid my entire fighter group. I've been wanting to use my Z-95s anyway, so I dropped the Medical Team from the MC80 and all my squadrons. Now the fighters are as follows:

Lt. Blount

Z-95 x3 

YT-1300 x2

No idea how it'll go but 7 hull with Escort and Counter 1 actually seems pretty good, and the low speed isn't that bad since the Headhunters are pretty slow themselves. Altogether this leaves me with 6 points in my list, so I'm just kind of mulling over what might be useful. I'll probably just put an Engineering Team on the MC80, since it's going to be taking the most fire. 

[Admiral Theia 610]

Blount with an escort can seriously wreck face, all those red dice rerolls, but he really wants a core of 5-6 Z's flying with him.  Drop both YT's, take an x-wing and two more z-95's.  I say drop the YT's because Z's are slow enough as it is, you don't need to pull that down even more, and when you get to shoot you'll get to do a bit more damage.  With rerolling two dice on Z's I routinely get 3+ damage.  It's pretty nice.

[Hockeyzombie 619]

2 hours ago, Admiral Theia said:

Blount with an escort can seriously wreck face, all those red dice rerolls, but he really wants a core of 5-6 Z's flying with him.  Drop both YT's, take an x-wing and two more z-95's.  I say drop the YT's because Z's are slow enough as it is, you don't need to pull that down even more, and when you get to shoot you'll get to do a bit more damage.  With rerolling two dice on Z's I routinely get 3+ damage.  It's pretty nice.

I don't have any more Z-95s, otherwise I'd probably have pinned all my hopes on one X-Wing as an escort. I didn't have a lot of trouble keeping the swarm together today, but that was partly because my opponent only had squadrons to keep enemy squadrons in check so he was perfectly content to meet me for glorious battle with our cheap squadrons. 

 

I lost my first game with this list but to be fair Victory Is with X17s are an effective counter to my MC30s, since I'm not used to effectively having no defence tokens at close range. I made a miscalculation and lost the Advanced Projectors MC30 early on and had trouble getting Foresight to do anything productive. The MC80 was tearing it up, shredded the flagship (a Victory II) and would have killed a Victory I if I hadn't been forced to use my second shot to put the last point of damage on the first target. Unfortunately I did have to use both attacks on the same ship and the Victory I that would have died instead managed to kill the MC80. I think I would have been better off as first player but I'm used to having Demolisher to make it easy to smash people with black dice regardless of who moves first. Next time I play this list I'll take first player if I get the choice. I also didn't use my MC30s that well but I think I learned enough to not fly them so badly next time. 

[jamie nasmyth 602]

My preference for them MC80L is Star Cruiser and Spinal armament, boosts to up to 8 dice (still 4 Red) for 3 points more. You can still include the XX7 and drop XI7s. 

[Hockeyzombie 619]

On 4/3/2017 at 11:53 AM, jamie nasmyth said:

My preference for them MC80L is Star Cruiser and Spinal armament, boosts to up to 8 dice (still 4 Red) for 3 points more. You can still include the XX7 and drop XI7s. 

X17s make it really easy to push damage past a Redirect token, which are something I see a lot of on opposing ships. Against a more diverse playgroup I may take you up on that, but currently I see a LOT of Victory class Star Destroyers and they've basically just got that one Brace token against anything with X17 Turbolasers. 

[Admiral Theia 610]

Dodonna is fun, but if you can squeeze out the points, upgrade to Madine, then spam nav tokens hard.  Even with JJ those Vics (and even ISD's) can't keep up and you slip right into their rears.  If they're not getting front arcs then they're not getting their money's worth with XI-7's.

[draco193 491]

You might consider dropping the Advanced Prone tors for the Admonition title. Same points, but far more effective at the Torpedo Frigates preferred range. 

[Hockeyzombie 619]

2 hours ago, Admiral Theia said:

Dodonna is fun, but if you can squeeze out the points, upgrade to Madine, then spam nav tokens hard.  Even with JJ those Vics (and even ISD's) can't keep up and you slip right into their rears.  If they're not getting front arcs then they're not getting their money's worth with XI-7's.

I'd be more likely to modify the list a bit from there, since my guiding principle here was "wow, this damage deck is not ****ing around" and I wanted to utilize that. Not to say I dislike your suggestion, just that you'd be more likely to see that in a different thread with a list similar to this one. 

 

40 minutes ago, draco193 said:

You might consider dropping the Advanced Prone tors for the Admonition title. Same points, but far more effective at the Torpedo Frigates preferred range. 

I want to but I'm at 400 points and can't decide what to drop for the extra two points I'd need. Although given how badly I need close range to actually achieve anything, I might be farther ahead to use Admonition over Foresight. I tried the list out with Foresight because it seems overall better, but I seriously underestimated how fast I can close the gap with a target. The improved Evade from Foresight was literally never relevant, but Admonition might have been. 

[draco193 491]

 

7 minutes ago, Hockeyzombie said:

I want to but I'm at 400 points and can't decide what to drop for the extra two points I'd need. Although given how badly I need close range to actually achieve anything, I might be farther ahead to use Admonition over Foresight. I tried the list out with Foresight because it seems overall better, but I seriously underestimated how fast I can close the gap with a target. The improved Evade from Foresight was literally never relevant, but Admonition might have been. 

Ah yep. Brain fart on my part as I was thinking redundant shields was what you had. 

[Admiral Theia 610]

11 minutes ago, Hockeyzombie said:

I'd be more likely to modify the list a bit from there, since my guiding principle here was "wow, this damage deck is not ****ing around" and I wanted to utilize that. Not to say I dislike your suggestion, just that you'd be more likely to see that in a different thread with a list similar to this one. 

 

I was just saying that would be the best way to deal with the vics, not necessarily trying to change your list.  I agree that Admonition can be a big help for survival, but really with 30's (and any other rebel small base ship, it's mostly about speed.  You can do it with just navigates, and accepting that you won't shoot until turn 3.

[Hockeyzombie 619]

2 hours ago, draco193 said:

 

Ah yep. Brain fart on my part as I was thinking redundant shields was what you had. 

On the plus side, it did make me think about Admonition and see why people kept telling me it's good. For some reason I kept thinking I would actually want those Evades after I got into the range I want to be in. From my first game, I can already conclude that if I'm not getting the MC30s in range, I'm probably losing anyway so the Evades aren't really important except for the first round of fire aimed at the torpedo frigates. 

2 hours ago, Admiral Theia said:

I was just saying that would be the best way to deal with the vics, not necessarily trying to change your list.  I agree that Admonition can be a big help for survival, but really with 30's (and any other rebel small base ship, it's mostly about speed.  You can do it with just navigates, and accepting that you won't shoot until turn 3.

Ah, I see. I admit I keep hyping the threat of Victorys but that's just because it's what he owns the most of (it's mostly two of us, with a couple of maybes that I'm trying to turn into regulars). He hasn't yet discovered Demolishers power, but he does frequently mix it up and throw small ships in here and there. Less threatening than a Victory, but still something I need to beware of. He also has an ISD (who doesn't, really?) but X17 nullifies two of his tokens, XX-9 nullifies the Contain, and Intel Officer means he gets two uses of Brace at most (or he never uses it against the Liberty, which is what I wanted anyway). Obviously still not a good idea to play shot-for-shot with an ISD but the MC30s can either distract his fire or get in close and feed him damage cards. 

Basically I like Dodonna in this list because he's more affordable and I get a lot of opportunities to pick the crit that helps me most, so I'm willing to sacrifice the mobility of Madine. Madine's cool as hell though, I'll be revisiting him once I get some experience with the MC30. 

[Admiral Theia 610]

Even without Madine, play the Fast and the Shrimpiest with your MC30's.  Run in at speed 3 or four (keep a banked token), get on his rear, and stay there; preferably with first turn.  Like I said, you won't get to shoot until turn 3, but once you get good at doing it, you'll have your 30's living longer, and dealer more concentrated damage.  Of course, lining up on his side where you can fire both side arcs at once is fun too.