Edgehawk

Proper disposal of Dark Side artifacts

28 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

I added the post below to a seemingly appropriate thread, about a week ago, but the beginner forum evidently receives (comparatively) little traffic; it concerns the weapon from the end of the beginner set adventure Mountaintop Rescue:

 

Quote

Regarding the ancient sith sword, and similar artifacts: is there canon example for the appropriate disposal, or purification, of such items?

The blade must be (for example):

  • "cleansed in the pure snows atop Mount Tellec" or
  • "destroyed in the lava of Mustafar" or 
  • "tossed into the bottomless cenote of the jedi temple."

Any precedent for what should be done? 

Also: any Star Wars rpg equivalent to the old D&D notion of "intelligent weapons?"

Just curious about what is already out there, or what others have done, before me.

 

I know this is more a fantasy trope, but I can't imagine that the subject hasn't been broached in the past.

 

Edited by Edgehawk
typo

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My main frame of reference is Legends novels and most artifacts ive come across are holocrons, so take this for what that is worth to you, but in this regard the Star Wars universe doesn't seem to have that trope you're talking about.

Holocrons are immensely powerful objects but can be crushed in ones fist, or under heel. No great un-making required other than what would be required of the normal material it consists of. There temples and tombs simple stone, or steel, decaying and ruined. Sith artifacts (possessions of great members of their order) are simply stolen by pillagers and lost to all time. Tomes must be diligently cared for. No mystical unbreakable magic, just the materials that they are. Sith Alchemy is probably the most fantastic, mystic thing I've come across, and it still has very real limits and vulnerability.

As for intelligent weapons, holocrons are the obvious parallel. Again though they are nothing more than tiny highly intricate crystalline sculptures (imbued with the Force), so putting one on a weapon (pommel?) seems ill advised, but could certainly be done. There's your intelligent weapon?

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The Muur Talisman had the spirit of an ancient Sith Lord in it that took over people in the Legends Canon. As for how to destroy such artifacts I don't know if there were specific rituals to destroy them, I do know that the Jedi Order hoarded such artifacts so that they wouldn't fall into the wrong hands.

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I imagine most dark artefacts are items wielded directly by a person of great evil that leaves a ripple or a tear in the force that makes them exhibit properties some might consider unnatural. It leaves a imprint that either bestows limited version of abilities but more likely is designed to corrupt anyone who picks it up.

 

Usually I find shooting them into a sun works.

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7 hours ago, Lotr_Nerd said:

 ...I do know that the Jedi Order hoarded such artifacts so that they wouldn't fall into the wrong hands.

This seems like a terrible idea... and thus perfectly in line with much conventional Jedi wisdom. Any references for this?

 

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8 hours ago, emsquared said:

My main frame of reference is Legends novels and most artifacts ive come across are holocrons, so take this for what that is worth to you, but in this regard the Star Wars universe doesn't seem to have that trope you're talking about.

Holocrons are immensely powerful objects but can be crushed in ones fist, or under heel. No great un-making required other than what would be required of the normal material it consists of. 

As for intelligent weapons, holocrons are the obvious parallel. Again though they are nothing more than tiny highly intricate crystalline sculptures (imbued with the Force), so putting one on a weapon (pommel?) seems ill advised, but could certainly be done. There's your intelligent weapon?

  • Perhaps [hand wave] this is not the trope I am looking for.
  • So fragile?!?! I truly had not realized.
  • I had considered the holocron pommel, but may need to rethink it.

Thanks for the response!

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If you're talking proper disposal, then just tossing it into a volcano or powerful enough incinerator (or under a hydraulic press) is probably good enough. Ejecting it into a star or black hole should be reserved for those particularly dangerous ones, but that may be a bit overkill.

I would think purification is a more interesting route, though. For purification, I would say a character needs to dedicate several hours[1] to meditation with the object, and then make a Knowledge (Lore) check[2], adding their Force rating to the pool. If purification is the ultimate goal, then the character would probably be required to only use light side points to succeed, or at the very least, dark side points introduce complications or strain. To maybe expand the concept further, purifying with light side points may change the effects of the artifact to something more 'positive/good'; using a mix of dark and light points may produce a more neutral effect, or remove all effects permanently; using dark side points may instead increase the potency of the artifact, while also increasing the Conflict gain for use/activation. Of course, YMMV on this.

[1]: By that, I mean multiples of 6 or `12 hours, not 1 or 2. Excess success can reduce the required time by # of hours.

[2]: The difficulty should probably be hard at minimum, daunting on average. Formidable or impossible being reserved for very potent artifacts. I'd probably hold off on adding Setback dice, but definitely upgrade twice or more. It might be interesting to modify the difficulty based on the Morality of the character. A Paragon is going to have better claim at purifying a dark side object than a neutral or dark sider, and may reduce or downgrade the difficulty, while a dark sider may upgrade or increase the difficulty.

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1 hour ago, Blackbird888 said:

I would think purification is a more interesting route, though. For purification, I would say a character needs to dedicate several hours[1] to meditation with the object, and then make a Knowledge (Lore) check[2], adding their Force rating to the pool. If purification is the ultimate goal, then the character would probably be required to only use light side points to succeed, or at the very least, dark side points introduce complications or strain. To maybe expand the concept further, purifying with light side points may change the effects of the artifact to something more 'positive/good'; using a mix of dark and light points may produce a more neutral effect, or remove all effects permanently; using dark side points may instead increase the potency of the artifact, while also increasing the Conflict gain for use/activation. Of course, YMMV on this.

[1]: By that, I mean multiples of 6 or `12 hours, not 1 or 2. Excess success can reduce the required time by # of hours.

[2]: The difficulty should probably be hard at minimum, daunting on average. Formidable or impossible being reserved for very potent artifacts. I'd probably hold off on adding Setback dice, but definitely upgrade twice or more. It might be interesting to modify the difficulty based on the Morality of the character. A Paragon is going to have better claim at purifying a dark side object than a neutral or dark sider, and may reduce or downgrade the difficulty, while a dark sider may upgrade or increase the difficulty.

The Dawn Temple, from the beginner set and follow-up adventures, may actually be the perfect setting for something like this. 

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Here is the thing keeping Sith Artifacts is in of itself not an issue.

Giving in to the temptation to use them is a much more serious problem.

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It's an obscure canon answer, but nullification resin is a sort of gel that the Old Jedi Order would use to contain artifacts they couldn't or wouldn't destroy that offers macguffin potential. 

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14 hours ago, Valik said:

It's an obscure canon answer, but nullification resin is a sort of gel that the Old Jedi Order would use to contain artifacts they couldn't or wouldn't destroy that offers macguffin potential. 

Thanks for this, but anything powerful enough to dampen even a Sith Lord's pedicure set, would be certain to wreak havoc with game balance.

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On 3/6/2017 at 10:41 AM, Stan Fresh said:

Just toss it into a star.

Pretty much this.  If the end goal is to try and actually prevent people from finding the thing, toss it into a star is your best bet.

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Posted (edited)

On 3/6/2017 at 4:56 AM, LordBritish said:

Usually I find shooting them into a sun works.

I find that a Black Hole works as well. Even if the artifact is not destroyed, retrieving it is very, very, very^3 difficult.

Edited by Desslok
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To answer my own question:

Quarantine World III, in Kallidahin Space, appears to house dangerous items in safety deposit boxes of a sort. In the most recent Doctor Aphra comic, two Polis Massans receive a relic and place it in a container. It is then taken by a droid, to be housed in stacks not unlike the data storage stacks in Rogue One.

Doctor-Aphra-6_Archived.png

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On 3/6/2017 at 10:41 AM, Stan Fresh said:

Just toss it into a star.

Toss into a Star is always a solid idea...unless the item is solar-powered and proofed...

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35 minutes ago, GandofGand said:

Toss into a Star is always a solid idea...unless the item is solar-powered and proofed...

Solar-powered doesn't mean what you think it means :P

 

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I have a cursed ancient sith Kyber crystal, and the only canon disposal of one of those created a supernova the crew had to outrun (Rebels) any ideas?

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Posted (edited)

put in in an escape pod (or torpedo, which would be cheaper, and be safer for you in the event you crash before you replace it) and launch it into the nearest sun or for style points, black hole.

 

a black hole isn't going to nova

Edited by EliasWindrider
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On 4/17/2017 at 6:38 PM, EliasWindrider said:

put in in an escape pod (or torpedo, which would be cheaper, and be safer for you in the event you crash before you replace it) and launch it into the nearest sun or for style points, black hole.

 

a black hole isn't going to nova

My concern with destroying it (at least without purifying it), is that you could be releasing the dark side energy to wander the universe and find a new host.  The Jedi may have viewed it as safer to "jail" the artifacts, and know that the energy and spirits are contained, rather than release them and endanger the galaxy.  Of course, this leads to people stealing the artifacts, or worse, containment failure (aka Ghostbusters or Warehouse 13).

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4 hours ago, Edgookin said:

My concern with destroying it (at least without purifying it), is that you could be releasing the dark side energy to wander the universe and find a new host.  The Jedi may have viewed it as safer to "jail" the artifacts, and know that the energy and spirits are contained, rather than release them and endanger the galaxy.  Of course, this leads to people stealing the artifacts, or worse, containment failure (aka Ghostbusters or Warehouse 13).

Hmm, I may try to strike a deal with this spirit then. I don't like the idea of freeing it.

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On 4/17/2017 at 2:28 PM, GandofGand said:

In this case I meant something that gets stronger when exposed to the heat of a star...

Wasn't the Suncrusher stashed away in a star?

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Dun think so, I  just know it ate stars for breakfast...or something...and could puncture through a capitol Starship like deflating a Water-balloon...stupidest weapon of mass destruction in the setting...8P 

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