Combining starship pilot specialisations, which specialisations is more fun?

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

What starship specialisations go great together? I want help on deciding on how to build my pilot. I want to make a character that makes his ship more survivable and do damage. One of my ideas is to make a BB-8 droid that is a rigger and modder, or rigger and operator. I also like the idea of using the manipulate force power that lets you repair things.

[2P51 33,416]

Pilot/Hotshot.

Defensive Driving, Skilled Jockey, Shortcut, Brilliant Evasion, Tricky Target, Master Pilot, Natural Pilot, Improved Dead to Rights, Showboat, Improved Corellian Sendoff, Second Chances, Koiogran Turn, High G Training.  All kinds of stuff to make you a bad @$$ on the stick.

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

7 hours ago, 2P51 said:

Pilot/Hotshot.

Defensive Driving, Skilled Jockey, Shortcut, Brilliant Evasion, Tricky Target, Master Pilot, Natural Pilot, Improved Dead to Rights, Showboat, Improved Corellian Sendoff, Second Chances, Koiogran Turn, High G Training.  All kinds of stuff to make you a bad @$$ on the stick.

That is indeed a great one. Though squadron commander/ gambler / hotshot might be even better. In case that you are short on xp over the course of your campaign or want outstanding skills or just want to focus on the gambler aspect more, just gambler/hotshot. Naturally squadron commander / hotshot would be another reasonable combination, you still get very appreciated defensive driving, tricky target and brilliant evasion talent, but can combine this better with leading a squadron and getting tons of use out of showboat that way. Showboat is amazing, even a little silly as you when leading minion squadron as you basically gain a second attack, but it has as well great synergies with the improved field commander. The Pilot and Squadron Commander with Hotshot combination are relatively tame, they have a solid set of defensive tools, but hotshot alone and even more so the gambler/hotshot combination alone lives and dies by its strain. Showboat every turn, potentially with double evasive maneuvers will eat your strain and your ships strain up within a few turns. Still, hotshot really is a great piloting spec which burns bright until it burns out. All the pilot specs are very thematic. 

Speaking of thematic, rigger is great as well, but in total different ways. Unlike the above mentioned aces, rigger builds his survivability more from the fact a riggers and modders ships can be incredibility sturdy, even more so if you combine the specs and add the two hardpoints. But those flyboys really prefer different typs of ships, not the nimble and agile fighters, but rather sturdy ships with solid armor which can take already a hit before they start modifying them. The maneuvering thruster talent helps here to make those sturdy ships agile enough to have at least a chance to avoid some fire via GtA, meanwhile if you take for example a Aka'jor shuttle, add two hardpoints from modder, strap an enhanced durasteel armor on it, get the bolstered armor talent from the rigger tree and have a sil 3, armor  6, handling +3, HT 26, SS 17 with the massive 1 quality. Single success hits from TIE fighters shake the ship, but don't damage the ship anymore and you are able to take 13 hits with three success from medium laser cannons and still be on your way. Add a good damage control roll it the life span extends even more. Meanwhile the parties gunner can shoot from the added ventral laser turret …
Now this combination is absolutely dependent on its signature ship, but it can do amazing things with that singular ship. Building that small mando shuttle into a fortress or upgrading a transport like the Gozanti to something which resembles more of a frigate is absolutely possible. But it is a rather mono-task build. With two specs which revolve all around that signature vehicle your other options are rather limited, you can have that one singular amazing autofire blaster on top, but outside that you are reduced to your skills, which in this case hopefully are great.

Now speaking of great, Rigger combines extremely well too with gunner, meanwhile gunner fits with nearly everything. Gunner is a little bit of a backseat position, if someone else can do the flying you can basically pair it really with anything, you still can fly great, you are just no fighter jockey hotshot as you lack most of the survivability talents for fighter combat, unless you have the ace signature talents. But you are working great together as a flight team with another pilot who has the talents or as gunner on a larger ship. It one of the great specs for a pilot / astromech team and fits as well into a Y-Wing crew or similar great. Rigger/Gunner, Rigger/Scientist or Mechanic/Rigger are some of the prime astromech combinations. Perfect support for the ace: hotshot/pilot who is doing all the loopy loops while you allow him to do them in the first place as you are the source to keep the ship together. The damage control action restores one system strain per success + ranks of fine tuning which helps enormous to keep a pilot or hotshot in battle, meanwhile enemy weapons can be disabled via slicing hostile ships and hull repairs can keep a ship operational. Even Rigger/Saboteur would actually work rather well if you are looking for a pilot with a hang for explosives on the ground as well. Same for the gunner options, which can go from from Saboteur, Commando, Sharpshooter and tons of other non-pilot options. 

As well there is always the option to pick the smuggler: pilot as career first, which alone does round up the character more, and while you lose the typical ace signature talents which are incredible good in starfighters, you do gain the as well amazing smuggler signature talents. 

So TLDR: For a starfighter pilot you want to really focus on the piloting part, be it rigger/modder, hotshot/pilot or surprisingly hotshot/gambler,  meanwhile in bigger ships which don't just explode in one good roll or when you are just the co-pilot going along with less monotask specs is a lot of fun.

Lastly a word to astromechs: Astromechs usually are part of a team, they gain the unique ability to have some amazing offensive and defensive abilities and enhance the ship past its original specs. That is one of the reasons they are so good riggers which does the same. If you build an astromech rigger and set him into an astromech socket that astromech gains the ability to use the "Watch my Back" and "Target Lock" actions, watch my back can be a perfect replacement for defensive driving as it increases the defense significantly if your droid has a great computer skill. Furthermore as a maneuver the droid can increase the speed of a sil 2 or 3 vehicle by one which is an amazing advantage for gain the advantage actions of the pilot. Astromechs are truly best when they work as a team with their pilot and are very versatile with their support abilities.  

Our Rigger/Scientist Astromech is for example amazing. She can hack anything, build anything, fly anything, shoot anything and repair anything. Does not matter if she is flying her gozanti-cruiser which really can rival any imperial cruiser or is sitting in astromech socket of a fighter and assisting the pilot or just playing mobile gun platform with her shoulder mounted railgun on the ground. Support on all fronts. Well, except on the social ones, but she build protocol droid to assist us with that. ;-)

 

Edited February 22, 2017 by SEApocalypse

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

3 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

That is indeed a great one. Though squadron commander/ gambler / hotshot might be even better. In case that you are short on xp over the course of your campaign or want outstanding skills or just want to focus on the gambler aspect more, just gambler/hotshot. Naturally squadron commander / hotshot would be another reasonable combination, you still get very appreciated defensive driving, tricky target and brilliant evasion talent, but can combine this better with leading a squadron and getting tons of use out of showboat that way. Showboat is amazing, even a little silly as you when leading minion squadron as you basically gain a second attack, but it has as well great synergies with the improved field commander. The Pilot and Squadron Commander with Hotshot combination are relatively tame, they have a solid set of defensive tools, but hotshot alone and even more so the gambler/hotshot combination alone lives and dies by its strain. Showboat every turn, potentially with double evasive maneuvers will eat your strain and your ships strain up within a few turns. Still, hotshot really is a great piloting spec which burns bright until it burns out. All the pilot specs are very thematic. 

Speaking of thematic, rigger is great as well, but in total different ways. Unlike the above mentioned aces, rigger builds his survivability more from the fact a riggers and modders ships can be incredibility sturdy, even more so if you combine the specs and add the two hardpoints. But those flyboys really prefer different typs of ships, not the nimble and agile fighters, but rather sturdy ships with solid armor which can take already a hit before they start modifying them. The maneuvering thruster talent helps here to make those sturdy ships agile enough to have at least a chance to avoid some fire via GtA, meanwhile if you take for example a Aka'jor shuttle, add two hardpoints from modder, strap an enhanced durasteel armor on it, get the bolstered armor talent from the rigger tree and have a sil 3, armor  6, handling +3, HT 26, SS 17 with the massive 1 quality. Single success hits from TIE fighters shake the ship, but don't damage the ship anymore and you are able to take 13 hits with three success from medium laser cannons and still be on your way. Add a good damage control roll it the life span extends even more. Meanwhile the parties gunner can shoot from the added ventral laser turret …
Now this combination is absolutely dependent on its signature ship, but it can do amazing things with that singular ship. Building that small mando shuttle into a fortress or upgrading a transport like the Gozanti to something which resembles more of a frigate is absolutely possible. But it is a rather mono-task build. With two specs which revolve all around that signature vehicle your other options are rather limited, you can have that one singular amazing autofire blaster on top, but outside that you are reduced to your skills, which in this case hopefully are great.

Now speaking of great, Rigger combines extremely well too with gunner, meanwhile gunner fits with nearly everything. Gunner is a little bit of a backseat position, if someone else can do the flying you can basically pair it really with anything, you still can fly great, you are just no fighter jockey hotshot as you lack most of the survivability talents for fighter combat, unless you have the ace signature talents. But you are working great together as a flight team with another pilot who has the talents or as gunner on a larger ship. It one of the great specs for a pilot / astromech team and fits as well into a Y-Wing crew or similar great. Rigger/Gunner, Rigger/Scientist or Mechanic/Rigger are some of the prime astromech combinations. Perfect support for the ace: hotshot/pilot who is doing all the loopy loops while you allow him to do them in the first place as you are the source to keep the ship together. The damage control action restores one system strain per success + ranks of fine tuning which helps enormous to keep a pilot or hotshot in battle, meanwhile enemy weapons can be disabled via slicing hostile ships and hull repairs can keep a ship operational. Even Rigger/Saboteur would actually work rather well if you are looking for a pilot with a hang for explosives on the ground as well. Same for the gunner options, which can go from from Saboteur, Commando, Sharpshooter and tons of other non-pilot options. 

As well there is always the option to pick the smuggler: pilot as career first, which alone does round up the character more, and while you lose the typical ace signature talents which are incredible good in starfighters, you do gain the as well amazing smuggler signature talents. 

So TLDR: For a starfighter pilot you want to really focus on the piloting part, be it rigger/modder, hotshot/pilot or surprisingly hotshot/gambler,  meanwhile in bigger ships which don't just explode in one good roll or when you are just the co-pilot going along with less monotask specs is a lot of fun.

Lastly a word to astromechs: Astromechs usually are part of a team, they gain the unique ability to have some amazing offensive and defensive abilities and enhance the ship past its original specs. That is one of the reasons they are so good riggers which does the same. If you build an astromech rigger and set him into an astromech socket that astromech gains the ability to use the "Watch my Back" and "Target Lock" actions, watch my back can be a perfect replacement for defensive driving as it increases the defense significantly if your droid has a great computer skill. Furthermore as a maneuver the droid can increase the speed of a sil 2 or 3 vehicle by one which is an amazing advantage for gain the advantage actions of the pilot. Astromechs are truly best when they work as a team with their pilot and are very versatile with their support abilities.  

Our Rigger/Scientist Astromech is for example amazing. She can hack anything, build anything, fly anything, shoot anything and repair anything. Does not matter if she is flying her gozanti-cruiser which really can rival any imperial cruiser or is sitting in astromech socket of a fighter and assisting the pilot or just playing mobile gun platform with her shoulder mounted railgun on the ground. Support on all fronts. Well, except on the social ones, but she build protocol droid to assist us with that. ;-)

 

Which book has the gambler spec.? And what stats should I upgrade at character creation if I play a bothan, squib, or cathar squad leader/hotshot? Squib and cathar can be found in a link to a pdf on these forms somewhere. 

 

Edited February 22, 2017 by Trigger Happy Droid

[Darzil 778]

Fly Casual.

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

4 minutes ago, Darzil said:

Fly Casual.

I have ordered that book at the game store. It's on backorder.  Can someone privately message me the stats and price for the stealth coating from Fly Casual? I will own that book soon!

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

13 minutes ago, Darzil said:

Fly Casual.

I have ordered that book at the game store. It's on backorder.  Can someone privately message me the stats and price for the stealth coating from Fly Casual? 

 

Edited February 22, 2017 by Trigger Happy Droid

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

25 minutes ago, Trigger Happy Droid said:

Which book has the gambler spec.? And what stats should I upgrade at character creation if I play a bothan, squib, or cathar squad leader/hotshot? Squib and cathar can be found in a link to a pdf on these forms somewhere. 

 

It's under Alien Species.

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

Is a force sensitive pilot's any good? Hotshot/Force Emergent,  Armorer/Starfighter Ace, and Armorer/Hotshot?

Edited February 22, 2017 by Trigger Happy Droid

[2P51 33,416]

It's all good depending on how much xp.  I also find PCs interests transform over time and by the time they have the xp for these multi spec ideas they've decided to go off in a completely different direction.  I'd pick a good career with a pilot option you like, and once you're Pilot 5 and gotten the good Talents from that tree, re-assess.

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

2 hours ago, Trigger Happy Droid said:

Which book has the gambler spec.? And what stats should I upgrade at character creation if I play a bothan, squib, or cathar squad leader/hotshot? Squib and cathar can be found in a link to a pdf on these forms somewhere. 

As previously mentioned fly casual, and without looking into the races itself, the squad leader / hotshot combo works rather well with an high agility value. Don't make my mistake and go overboard, 4 should be sufficient, you get a dedication soon enough. Outside of that, a high presence value can certainly substituted by high skill values, though you could say the same about the high agi value, especially in the less focused gambler/hotshot build. 

If you expect to play the character for a long time, basically anything goes, from genius  int 5 pilot, who is only dedicated to his flying and this invest all the skill points piloting, gunnery, etc after character generation to the equally charming and agile pilot who focus all his xp on talents and dedication and comes along with agi 5, presence 5, and some meager skills. They all play different, they all feel different, but in the end they are all good. As long as you roll a fist full dice on the core abilities you like to do, it really does matter little if they come from characteristics or skills or if they are green or yellow. Naturally if you focus on just a few things the results will be more spectacular, but the character will be less broad. That kind of questions are really more a question of what kind of character you want to roleplay. 

Speaking of broad, that is as well the impression I have from the warrior: Starfighter ace. Has some amazing talents, screams for a fully build enhance, can reach force rating 2 rather easy and commit those force dice either for defensive purpose or enhance his agility in their air or his brawn for his lightsaber skills and personal scale combat, his social checks via influence, etc 

The force powers eat a lot of xp, but come with a lot of utility, all this XP requirements make it imho hard to pick it up as a secondary non-career spec, specially if you come from a non-force career and need to go over force emergent or or force exile. It would be a rather slow, but continuous growth … not that this would be bad thing, but you would expect to follow your "dream" character for a long-time, play it for a long time and grow it into something rather nice in the end. You might call it the corran horn build, with pilot, force emergent, starfighter ace, and finally, after 700 xp or so into the jedi stuff for another 600 xp or so.  That is the kind of organic development 2P51 is speaking off, but I would assume it is rarely something you plan for. 

Just don't get overboard imo, it is rarely worth it to put starting xp into a characteristic to bring it to 5. You usually get two points in two other characteristic instead for that amount of xp. And upgrading a dumpstate of a species twice or even thrice creates a solid 3 into something which you can invest dedication later on to make it your solid secondary or even primary characteristic. And suddenly you have a very human like 4 3 3 2 2 1 stateline on some alien for 90 xp, or 4 3 3 2 2 2 for 110 

Edited February 22, 2017 by SEApocalypse

[bradknowles 4,449]

6 hours ago, Trigger Happy Droid said:

I have ordered that book at the game store. It's on backorder.  Can someone privately message me the stats and price for the stealth coating from Fly Casual? 

The problem with the Stealth Coating is that it is something you can’t turn off.  So, if you ever have to land at any place that is remotely legit in any way, they’re likely to be asking a lot of questions as to why you need a Stealth Coating, and that may take a lot of bribe money to cover up.

The Stealth Coating is the sort of thing that you only want to add to your ship if you can guarantee that you will only ever land at pirate facilities and other uncaring outer rim locations where the Empire and BoSS are nowhere to be found.

[Kaigen 826]

Also worth considering is what kind of starship you'll spend most of your time flying. Hotshot really shines with high speed, low system strain interceptors like the A-Wing, which have a hard time Punching It up to maximum speed without shorting out their systems and don't need Full Throttle to keep up with TIE Fighters. On the flip side, with only one rank of Skilled Jockey, it has a hard time coping with the handling penalties of less maneuverable ships (and then you have fighters like the B-Wing, which are unmaneuverable and have low system strain which really benefit from a dual-spec approach).

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

Is the Lancer-Class pursuit craft any good for a hotshot character?

[Tom Cruise 1,278]

Ion weapons will make you cry, but it is pretty speedy and the weapon loadout is nice.

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

Yeah, Ions make you cry, but for a sil 4 vessel it is pretty hot, gambler/hotshots might be the only combination which can actually trigger all 5 hits from the combined 5 laser-cannons when the targeting system is on and the tractor beam certainly helps to control enemies and keep them at bay, the hotshot is all about forcing himself out of arc of his opponents and tractor beams help with that tremendously. The fire-control system of the the lancer-class pursuit craft allows to fire the tractor beam as part of your regular weapon, so you can stop your target from chasing you, when you move afterwards with a maneuver out of its weapon arcs. To get rid of the beam a piloting action is needed which prevents the target from firing at you that turn. Control over the battle achieved. Now if someone else does the shooting and you can concentrate and maneuvers and GtA and lure a few squadrons into an debris or asteroid field … the ship should really work like a charm against multiple opponents. Though if you have a crew I would say the aggressor patrol boat is a lot better than the lancer-class pursuit craft. Especially the ions are fantastic and even without the overdrive you have a better handling. -1 falls right into the wanted ballpark of the hotshot. Still, the fire-control system of the lancer is fantastic if you are operating without a crew. NPC nemesis characters might move this.

[themensch 3,092]

One question worth asking - is your pilot doing anything but piloting?  Having gone down the Ace Pilot road, I found the focus pretty narrow.  I might suggest like others have to cross-spec into the Gambler, the Charmer, or another career with some synergy with your group.  Otherwise, you're just stuck in the ship running spools of cable while the action heroes are off adventuring.

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

50 minutes ago, themensch said:

One question worth asking - is your pilot doing anything but piloting?  Having gone down the Ace Pilot road, I found the focus pretty narrow.  I might suggest like others have to cross-spec into the Gambler, the Charmer, or another career with some synergy with your group.  Otherwise, you're just stuck in the ship running spools of cable while the action heroes are off adventuring.

Take a jetpack, a sniper rifle or even better a heavy gunnery long-range weapon, and you are a pretty decent sniper support. You basically always have the high-ground with a jetpack or drop suite. There are pretty good reasons to take schmuggler/pilot or smuggler/gambler instead of pilot:ace as career spec, but combat efficiency is certainly not one of them. In an AoR campaign you might actually giving the repulsor tank the drop suite treatment and keep an eye on the group while running your spools of cable, just to drop into the action when needed. The focus is still pretty narrow as the ace career is basically a vehicle soldier, so as I said rounding it with something else works fine, Squadron Commander and Gambler both bring some nice skill sets of career skills for a little bit of non-combat action, and especially gambler has some really amazing synergies with squadron commander and hotshot. The pure ace is still tons of fun in an AoR setting. 

[themensch 3,092]

10 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:

The pure ace is still tons of fun in an AoR setting. 

Definitely true, as you've demonstrated.  I guess I prefer to have some ability to solve problems that aren't at the end of a barrel, so those social synergies work best for my play style.  

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

In the end it comes all down what kind of character you want to play. Stumbling from one faux pas into the next on a diplomatic soirée has its own charm. But charming everyone there, taking the girl home and freezing her boyfriend in carbonite. Now that really requires a cape.

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

What stealth mod won't cause as much trouble?

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

33 minutes ago, Trigger Happy Droid said:

What stealth mod won't cause as much trouble?

IIRC they are all illegal, though you can achieve the sil 1 if you take a protectorate fang fighter and install an ecm attachment. Or go with the sil 2 hapan Miy'Til and add the ecm. Add tricky target and you are down to sil 0. Only the A-Wing needs the nightshadow coating … well only the A-Wing out of the three A-Wing like ships. And the Miy'til basically needs a player astromech on top as his base speed is just 4, the mech can increase it to 5 as maneuver. So out of the three the Miy'til is the most flexible as well.  

Edited February 23, 2017 by SEApocalypse

[Trigger Happy Droid 10]

The game that I am in, we always need two transport ships. We have around 6 players, a jedi mentor, and a pilot/mechanic. I don't know his specialisations. The mechanic has 6 assassin droids. Plus the second freighter is almost permanent scrap. I want a good stealthy freighter or combat ship that can hold some players and cargo? Our characters go to Illum a lot and we have joined the rebellion. Will most GM's let me take the debt obligation to buy a ship?

[Kaigen 826]

Are the assassin droids being counted as passengers or cargo? Because that's going to make a big difference in terms of what kind of transport you can use. If they're passengers, then there are only a handful of silhouette 4 vehicles that can accommodate that many; I'd take a good look at the ILH-KK Citadel Class (EotE Core), as it has the capacity, is fairly well-armed for its size, and is still reasonably customizeable. If you can count the assassin droids as cargo, that opens up your options, but honestly, it's hard to beat a YT-1300 or YT-2400, considering both come equipped with 2 turrets and have 6/5 Hard Points on top of that. Or you could just snag a Lambda-class Shuttle. In any event, the "stealthy" portion is going to depend a lot more on your pilot and your attachments than any stock quality of the ship, unless by "stealthy" you mean "blends in easily," in which case go for a light freighter you can pass off as innocuous shipping traffic.

I have no idea what most GMs will do as far as taking Obligation to get a ship. I know I've done that in the past, but I wouldn't do it in every campaign. If you're working for the Rebellion, you might be able to wait for your next Contribution Rank increase and use the reward to get a good ship.

Edited February 25, 2017 by Kaigen

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

6 PCs, make two of them astromechs, take a HWK-290 or Aka'jor and a Z-95 Headhunter and everyone fits, for hyperdrive you just dock with the HWK-290 or Aka'jor. Kickass space superiority and the assassin droids are stored as cargo, which they will hate, but obey … for now at least. ;-)

That should be well within the groups starting resources. Mind you, the Aka'jor is most likely without weapons in the stock version as the version from friends like these has mentioned that the weapons were modifications to the original shuttle and so where the shields. So this checks out, but comes with only light weapons and would be hard to use for space combat encounters. 

But there is another option: Take a Gozanti, use the assassin droids as gunners, use a copilot and pilot for flying, the tech deals with damage control, the jedi mentor says in the back and say "oh dear", while the rest mans the com station,  and can launch from the ship's retrofitted hangar into space to clear the path or prevent hostile ships hide aft from most of the guns. ;-)
That should definitely eliminate the need for the second freighter outside of events when the party need to split up and both the 290 and the Aka'jor  fit into that retrofitted hangar bay. But the Gozanti is admittedly more expensive than a starting resource, so a lousy Penumbra Stealth Freighter or the classic two YTs should do for a start. 

We updates btw with our latest contribution rank update to a  a C-ROC Gozanti, so we are using ourselves basically the configuration I suggested with the Gozanti, fighters and npc gunners. We had done the same before for 18 months or so in a VCX-100, which was our first ship upgrade from our starting Lambda, paid with player money, meanwhile the fighters on the flight came from the alliance as contribution rewards. And as mentioned, a HWK-290 fits into a retrofitted hangar. Depends really how far in the game you guys are.