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LionCub

More investigators?

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Will there be more investigators in the small packs or are they limited to the deluxe expansions? I do like having a lot of options for my chosen leader and I do hope they play around with the deck rules for future investigators some more then they have. That said, having an investigator in each small pack would probably get out of control in no time =3 At the same time, I don't want to wait until next deluxe edition to have more investigators =p I'm guessing the next deluxe expansion is a 4-6 months away from seeing the light of day.

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So far it looks like investigators will only appear with the deluxe expansions (based on the one expansion we've seen).  LOTR LCG went the other route and after 5 years there are 93 heroes to select from.  Sure, you get to use up to three at a time but that's still a drop in the bucket.  So I'm actually please that they will be rolling them out for AH at a slower pace.

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3 hours ago, ricedwlit said:

So far it looks like investigators will only appear with the deluxe expansions (based on the one expansion we've seen).  LOTR LCG went the other route and after 5 years there are 93 heroes to select from.  Sure, you get to use up to three at a time but that's still a drop in the bucket.  So I'm actually please that they will be rolling them out for AH at a slower pace.

Very good point! Can't argue with that. Thanks

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There is one other investigator that so far has only been available as a promo card for people who pre-ordered the Investigators of Arkham Horror book: Marie Lambeau.  But I'm fairly certain you could find the images/stats/text online fairly easily.

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2 hours ago, mwmcintyre said:

There is one other investigator that so far has only been available as a promo card for people who pre-ordered the Investigators of Arkham Horror book: Marie Lambeau.  But I'm fairly certain you could find the images/stats/text online fairly easily.

Nice! She seems pretty cool. Tried searching for her on ebay, but no hits. Guess no one is selling her =p

I figure I will just print her out myself then until they actually put her up for sale. Not super fan of exclusive stuff - when I get into anything, I want everything inn it - don't mind paying as long as its not a pain to get (though to be fair, everything arkham horror is being a pain to get lately..)

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16 hours ago, LionCub said:

Will there be more investigators in the small packs or are they limited to the deluxe expansions? I do like having a lot of options for my chosen leader and I do hope they play around with the deck rules for future investigators some more then they have. That said, having an investigator in each small pack would probably get out of control in no time =3 At the same time, I don't want to wait until next deluxe edition to have more investigators =p I'm guessing the next deluxe expansion is a 4-6 months away from seeing the light of day.

In addition to stuff mentioned above, the mini-card for each investigator presents a practical difficulty to including them in a mythos pack.

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After playing some Eldritch Horror tonight... it makes me sad that investigators won't be coming out as quickly as in LOTR, because that means mah man CHARLIE KANE won't be released anytime in the near future.

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2 hours ago, Hedgehobbit said:

What's the over/under on how long before they add a new class deck? 

A new class? I'd say about 3,720 to 1. A new class would be years away, there's way too much deckbuilding space to explore. Bear in mind that LOTR has been around for 6 or 7 years, and hasn't added a single sphere yet (not counting the Saga-specific Heroes, which have like 2 or 3 cards each but otherwise are Neutral).

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There's also the fact that investigators aren't really locked into one class in this game - their deckbuilding rules can provide really different experiences by allowing you to use different combinations of cards without ever adding a new class.

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21 hours ago, Network57 said:

A new class? I'd say about 3,720 to 1. A new class would be years away, there's way too much deckbuilding space to explore. Bear in mind that LOTR has been around for 6 or 7 years, and hasn't added a single sphere yet (not counting the Saga-specific Heroes, which have like 2 or 3 cards each but otherwise are Neutral).

AH:TCG isn't really like the LOTR card game (or Magic which also has 5 currencies), in that AH:TCG is built more like an RPG. Each deck isn't just an army or bundle of complementary cards, but the combination of a character's skills, equipment, and personality. So it isn't as important that each investigators deck be different, but that each deck has a different feel and theme. Simply adding cards to each of the five current class decks will dilute, rather than improve the experience. 

Not only that, but there are only 20 combinations of the five existing classes plus the five single-class investigators of Dunwich. FFG will be running out of ways to make investigators unique pretty soon.

I'm willing to be that by the time of the third large expansion (with Dunwich being the first), we'll see a new class deck added. Either included in the expansions (and themed to that cycle's story) or as a standalone investigator expansion. 

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I don't think they'll run out very quickly. There are what... 52 investigators in the Arkham Files? They said in an interview they didn't know if they would get through all of those, plus they already shown they will be branching out with Marie who focuses on a card type rather than a class, so there will be probably an entire round of investigators that focus on card type. (Marie's deck building is Spells 0-5, Mystic 0-3, Neutral 0-5, Occult 0, up to 5 other level 0 seeker and/or survivor) So even with just 5 classes, they have room to mess around without adding in a new class type. 

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1 hour ago, Hedgehobbit said:

AH:TCG isn't really like the LOTR card game (or Magic which also has 5 currencies), in that AH:TCG is built more like an RPG. Each deck isn't just an army or bundle of complementary cards, but the combination of a character's skills, equipment, and personality. So it isn't as important that each investigators deck be different, but that each deck has a different feel and theme. Simply adding cards to each of the five current class decks will dilute, rather than improve the experience. 

Not only that, but there are only 20 combinations of the five existing classes plus the five single-class investigators of Dunwich. FFG will be running out of ways to make investigators unique pretty soon.

I'm willing to be that by the time of the third large expansion (with Dunwich being the first), we'll see a new class deck added. Either included in the expansions (and themed to that cycle's story) or as a standalone investigator expansion. 

Except you're forgetting Marie Lambeau. Nothing says FFG has to create Investigators that are single-class, or primary+secondary class. There's so many ways to create a unique Investigator within the 5-class system that comes off as something wholly different than others in that class.

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25 minutes ago, Khudzlin said:

I'm not even sure what you mean by that. Decks are associated with investigators, not classes.

That's exactly my point. The class system is very loosely bound by the game rules themselves, only having any impact on game play during the deckbuilding process. This is unlike M:TG or LotR, where the different card types have a clear affect on gameplay (in which currency is earned and what currency is needed to spend). To me, this appears as a deliberate design choice to allow a new class of player cards to be added with negligible impact on the gameplay of the current investigators. At worst, some investigators might have access to a handful of new cards but this is true any time new player cards are added. 

Again, I'm not saying that FFG can't continue to crank out Investigators that are just slight variations of the same 5 classes forever. They most certainly can. Just that adding in a new class will allow them to create Investigators that feel significantly different from the ones currently available in order to add life to the product a couple years from now. 

Edited by Hedgehobbit

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Adding a new class would have to involve creating a lot of cards associated with it, so it can compete with existing classes. Also, consider that FFG seldom adds new factions, even in games with undifferenciated currency (like AGoT or NetRunner). In some of their games (AGoT 1st edition, Star Wars and Conquest - of these, Star Wars has [loosely] differentiated currency and the others had undifferentiated currency), the Core Set did not support all the factions they planned for (they were announced, though). These games never received any extra faction beyond the ones that were hinted at in the Core Set (Tyranids and Necrons appear in the alignment wheel for Conquest; all factions had a faction card in AGoT 1st edition and Star Wars). AGoT 1st edition received a neutral faction card and Android: Netrunner (undifferentiated currency) received neutral runner identities, but no extra factions. Conquest stopped after 3 cycles, but AGoT 1st edition ran for 12 cycles, Star Wars is in its 6th cycle and Netrunner is going to start its 7th (the last one before rotation kicks in). So precedent suggests there won't be any new classes for a long time, if ever.

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14 hours ago, Khudzlin said:

In some of their games (AGoT 1st edition, Star Wars and Conquest - of these, Star Wars has [loosely] differentiated currency and the others had undifferentiated currency).

For the uninitiated, what does differentiated and undifferentiated currency mean in the context of an LCG?

Thanks!

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Undifferentiated currency means you are dealing with only a single type of resources to pay for cards (gold in AGoT, credits in Netrunner, resources in Conquest). Differentiated currency means you are dealing with multiple types resources to pay for cards, like in LotR (you need to pay for a card with resources from a hero of the card's sphere - each hero gets resources separately) or Magic's 5 types of basic lands. Star Wars is somewhere in-between: when paying for a card of a specific faction, only 1 resource has to come from a card of that faction.

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On 2/15/2017 at 2:42 PM, Hedgehobbit said:

So it isn't as important that each investigators deck be different, but that each deck has a different feel and theme. Simply adding cards to each of the five current class decks will dilute, rather than improve the experience.

Huh? Wouldn't 'adding cards' to each class help make each deck have a 'different feel and theme'? I'm not sure how each class having more cards wouldn't do exactly what you're calling for. 

Quote

Not only that, but there are only 20 combinations of the five existing classes plus the five single-class investigators of Dunwich. FFG will be running out of ways to make investigators unique pretty soon.

Well that's 15 more investigators which would take us right through to the 4th cycle. And you're not accounting for the fact that there is pretty substantial design space for making new investigators and for making them all feel different. 

You've got:

- All the 'basic' class combinations

- Signature cards and signature weaknesses 

- Traits in deck building

- Using levels to design deckbuilding limitations 

Quote

I'm willing to be that by the time of the third large expansion (with Dunwich being the first), we'll see a new class deck added. Either included in the expansions (and themed to that cycle's story) or as a standalone investigator expansion.

As discussed, not even including more innovative design of Investigators (which we know is happening - because of Marie) they have enough to take them to the 4th cycle, not the 3rd. I'm not saying outright that there won't ever be a new class, but it'd surprise me, because:

- There's plenty of existing design space

- The existing classes are specifically design to encapsulate and cover all of the Arkham Files investigators

- The entire design ethos of AHLCG seems to have been one of future-proofing the core system for years to come

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On 14.2.2017 at 3:49 PM, Hedgehobbit said:

What's the over/under on how long before they add a new class deck? 

How many possible class archtypes are there for Arkham to begin with? I mean, doesn't the five classes already cover all "aspects" an investigator could have? I'm just wondering since I'm no expert on the lore =)

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4 hours ago, LionCub said:

How many possible class archtypes are there for Arkham to begin with? I mean, doesn't the five classes already cover all "aspects" an investigator could have? I'm just wondering since I'm no expert on the lore =)

In previous AH games, there is just a bunch of investigators, all with individual abilities. The Card Game classes are more or less arbitrary distinctions (although in part inspired by factions in the Cthulhu LCG) with no equivalent in the Lore/Background. And while classes seem to have certain themes and mechanisms associated with them, there are no hard rules for what belongs in what class and what a class can cover.

So the five classes potentially cover everything there is and ever could be. The designers could decide that more classes would improve the game, but there is no imperative need.

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5 hours ago, LionCub said:

How many possible class archtypes are there for Arkham to begin with? I mean, doesn't the five classes already cover all "aspects" an investigator could have? 

I was thinking about an investigator like Charlie Kane or Harvey Walters. A sort of Benefactor class primarily for 4 player games that focuses on helping the other investigators do their thing.  Like allowing other investigators to use your Resources to play cards. Stuff like that.  A "Lead Investigator" that's actually leading the investigation. 

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