How would you put rebel ships into tiers?

[Kanelbullen 0]

As a new player it's pretty hard to visualize what ships are worth buying and what i should avoid, ive run 4 A-wings with success (against another noob though) and its probably my favourite ship visually and mechanically. But i'd just like to know how you guys perceive the "meta" of the game if you can use that term.

 

So if there's tiers from 1-5, how would you divide the ships into tiers? Please keep in mind both competitive and casual play (best balance between the two.) Thank you 

Edited January 15, 2017 by Kanelbullen

[Marinealver 8,068]

Well here is how I categorized not ships but list into tiers.

Top Mid and Casual.

 

Top tier is pretty much the net list. These are so good the win local tournaments and are compose nearly 50% of regional lists. However each category also has a top leaning subsection and a low leaning subcategory

• High Leaning are the list that win Regionals Top 8 at Nationals and Top 4 at Worlds. High Top Tier list get the most exposure and are often the next target for counter lists.
• Low Leaning lists are more of the Top lists of yesteryears. Builds that were competitive back in the day but have been replaced by more powerful (and creeping) builds.

 

Mid Tier are attempts at a competitive build but has yet to be refined. However mid tier is often the testing ground for potentially high tier builds. However due to Accretion this is also the largest category and is expanding rapidly. Many lists here are not bad as they were built to be competitive, they are just not as efficient as Top competitive lists are.

• High Mid are usually counter builds to the lists that can be found in the Top of the meta. However because of their design they have little success against builds they were not design for (such as an Anti-palp build meeting TLT-wings). Because of the lack of general power they don't make it into the Top.
• Low Mid Tier is usually testing a concept or mechanic (such as scum cloaking device, or missiles) They may not make it to the Top but they may help in identifying a pilot or upgrade that has the chance of making it into a Top list.

Casual isn't as much as a competitive tier as it is just a place to put lists that aren't competitive. These could be theme lists (such as Omega Squadron), or some sort of joke/gimmick lists (such as an ion-bomb Y-wing swarm). Either way any list that wasn't made to be competitive is placed here. That doesn't mean that these list can't be played competitively.

Edited January 15, 2017 by Marinealver

[StevenO 2,996]

There's another weakness with trying to just place "rebel" ships into tiers and that is that things other than the ship may be as important if not more important.  A Star Viper is something that most tournament players are going to need even if it never sees a stand simply because of the upgrades that come with it.  There may be ship builds that are good but knowing that really doesn't help with purchases because that build takes piece from a half dozen expansions or more.

[Karhedron 1,865]

I prefer top, mid or low tiers. 5 levels is perhaps too granular and you risk people arguing over a single placing. The other thing to remember is that pilots play a big role in a ship's competativeness. T65s are pretty far down the competitivness scale but Biggs turns up so often you would think that Camino retrieved his body after Vader shot him down. Wes, Tarn and sometimes even Wedge can still put in a showing.

Similarly the Outrider is pretty strong, particularly when run in "Super Dash" configuration but I don't think I have seen a Wild Space Fringer.

[Schu81 733]

From just reading tournament results, I'd say:

 

-- Tier 1 --

 

K-Wing - Miranda Doni

Ghost - Kanan Jarrus

X-Wing - Biggs Darklighter

E-Wing - Corran Horn

 

-- Tier 2 --

 

ARC-170 - Norra Wexley

YT-2400 - Dash Rendar

T-70 XWing - Poe Dameron

YT-1300 - Rey

A-Wing - Jake Farrell

K-Wing - Warden Squadron (Bomber)

Y-Wing - Gold Squadron (TLT)

Y-Wing - Gold Squadron (Stresshog)

ARC-170 - Braylen Stramm (Stressmule)

YT-1300 - Fat Han

X-Wing - Wes Janson

Ghost - Lothal Rebel (Close Combat Bumper)

A-Wing - Green Squadron (Papercut - Swarm)

 

-- Tier 3 --

 

B-Wing - Keyan Farlander, Nera Dantels

T-70 - Ello Asty, Snap, Nien, Jess

Y-Wing - Horton Salm, Dutch Vander

ARC 170 - Shara, Thane

X-Wing - Wedge, Luke, Tarn Mison (M9G8 or R7 Astro)

Ghost - Chopper, Hera

K-Wing - Esege

U-Wing - Cassian, Heff

YT-1300 - Chewbacca

A-Wing - Tycho

 

-- Tier 4 & 5 --

 

B-Wing - Ten Numb, Blue Squadron, Dagger Squadron

T-70 - Blue Ace

X-Wing - Hobbie

 

and basically everyone else

 

 

But that's just my oppionion.

 

In fact it also depends on your local meta a lot!

For example: I am a terrible Ghost player and I have never had any success with that in my local meta

 

So a tier 1 ship maybe a lot worse than tier 3 ship for you personally in your meta.

You can use anything from tier 1 - tier 3 in a competitive environment.

[Kanelbullen 0]

I prefer top, mid or low tiers. 5 levels is perhaps too granular and you risk people arguing over a single placing. The other thing to remember is that pilots play a big role in a ship's competativeness. T65s are pretty far down the competitivness scale but Biggs turns up so often you would think that Camino retrieved his body after Vader shot him down. Wes, Tarn and sometimes even Wedge can still put in a showing.

Similarly the Outrider is pretty strong, particularly when run in "Super Dash" configuration but I don't think I have seen a Wild Space Fringer.

 

 

Everyone is welcome to use any tier system they want, mine was just a suggestion. And i forgot to add it but id be ineterested to hear your rough estimates about the ships, including their pilots. Like a tier 1 ship would have pilots that are almost all good and the ship would work with many upgrades and lists etc. And a tier 5 ship would come with no good pilots at all and its pretty much trash with any upgrade and lists. I know that in this game its difficult to place ships into tiers like that, but id just want to know your rough estimates so i could get an overall summary what ships are "in".

[Kanelbullen 0]

From just reading tournament results, I'd say:

 

-- Tier 1 --

 

K-Wing - Miranda Doni

Ghost - Kanan Jarrus

X-Wing - Biggs Darklighter

E-Wing - Corran Horn

 

-- Tier 2 --

 

ARC-170 - Norra Wexley

YT-2400 - Dash Rendar

T-70 XWing - Poe Dameron

YT-1300 - Rey

A-Wing - Jake Farrell

K-Wing - Warden Squadron (Bomber)

Y-Wing - Gold Squadron (TLT)

Y-Wing - Gold Squadron (Stresshog)

ARC-170 - Braylen Stramm (Stressmule)

YT-1300 - Fat Han

X-Wing - Wes Janson

Ghost - Lothal Rebel (Close Combat Bumper)

A-Wing - Green Squadron (Papercut - Swarm)

 

-- Tier 3 --

 

B-Wing - Keyan Farlander, Nera Dantels

T-70 - Ello Asty, Snap, Nien, Jess

Y-Wing - Horton Salm, Dutch Vander

ARC 170 - Shara, Thane

X-Wing - Wedge, Luke, Tarn Mison (M9G8 or R7 Astro)

Ghost - Chopper, Hera

K-Wing - Esege

U-Wing - Cassian, Heff

YT-1300 - Chewbacca

A-Wing - Tycho

 

-- Tier 4 & 5 --

 

B-Wing - Ten Numb, Blue Squadron, Dagger Squadron

T-70 - Blue Ace

X-Wing - Hobbie

 

and basically everyone else

 

 

But that's just my oppionion.

 

In fact it also depends on your local meta a lot!

For example: I am a terrible Ghost player and I have never had any success with that in my local meta

 

So a tier 1 ship maybe a lot worse than tier 3 ship for you personally in your meta.

You can use anything from tier 1 - tier 3 in a competitive environment.

 

Thank you for your answer, it was very helpful. It's great to see that this game has so many viable options if you want to make a competitive list. (Not that im going to participate in the near future.)

Edited January 15, 2017 by Kanelbullen

[ficklegreendice 34,359]

There are no tiers, only Miranda and ships that can abuse regen

And then bomber Ks and r3a2 and Biggs

And then everyone else

 

 

because, really, those are the 4 big advantages rebels uniquely possess over everyone else

 

1.) Regen (that doesn't suck, Gonk/IG-88A), on ships that can also bring self sufficient damage mitigation (autothruster poe, ptl corran, ptl norra, Miranda w/c3po crew etc.) to abuse the hell out of it

 

2.) Sabine (crew specifically); advanced SLAM K-wing

 

3.) r3-a2, on a BTL-a4 Y-wing or a tactician/gunner ARC for double stress

 

4.) Biggs; Biggs

 

I guess Dash also qualifies because no one ignores obstacles like that, Havn't seen him in a dog's age, though

 

been greatly enjoying kanan ghost, though. If you can find a way to let him focus and evade in the same round, blighter becomes difficult to take down

Edited January 16, 2017 by ficklegreendice

[MenaceNsobriety 568]

I guess Dash also qualifies because no one ignores obstacles like that, Havn't seen him in a dog's age, though

This proves that local metas can vary wildly. In ATL Super Dash with Miranda are EVERYWHERE! I really hate that list because they kill one ship then run away for an hour lol

[ficklegreendice 34,359]

yeah, we got a lot of Rey over here for some bizarre reason

 

not even with Miranda, but with Poe/Norra

 

I'd take that matchup any day over dash

[Chivenger 36]

Thanks for the input. Need to find a tournament list I like and enjoy running and am a Rebel player. These are some fun options.

[Schu81 733]

It's true... there are no tiers actually.

 

But if you have a look at tournament results, you'll notice which ships are often played & do well there. That's how I made up this tier list.

 

Apart from this, you always have to ask yourself, if you are able to play the ship.

 

Let's have a look at Corran Horn for example. I think this ship has got a very good statline in comparison to other rebel ships. And it has got very good update options, such as astromech AND system slot.

But it's very expensive and might turn out to be half of your list... for a 5 hitpoints ship.

 

Anyway... if you know how to use Corran, it's a killer. It was in the worlds finals, so it can't be THAT bad

Edited January 16, 2017 by Schu81

[SEApocalypse 4,439]

As a new player it's pretty hard to visualize what ships are worth buying and what i should avoid, ive run 4 A-wings with success (against another noob though) and its probably my favourite ship visually and mechanically. But i'd just like to know how you guys perceive the "meta" of the game if you can use that term.

 

So if there's tiers from 1-5, how would you divide the ships into tiers? Please keep in mind both competitive and casual play (best balance between the two.) Thank you 

 

The longer the wingspan, the higher the tier. Which makes the K-Wing the highest tier, followed up by Arcs. °_° 

[Karhedron 1,865]

been greatly enjoying kanan ghost, though. If you can find a way to let him focus and evade in the same round, blighter becomes difficult to take down

 

I have been mulling the same problem and here is my solution. Unlike most Kanan builds it doesn't have Biggs (too short on points) but Rex is nearly as good, particularly as the meta seems to favour 2-3 ship builds at the moment. This should eat Dengaroo alive.

 

49 Kanan (35), Rec Spec (3), Lando (3), FCS (2), TLT (6), Ghost (0)

18 Zeb (18), Trick shot (0), Chopper (0), Phantom (0)

19 Ahsoka Tano (17), Captured Tie (1), VI (1)

14 Captain Rex (14)

100 Total

Kanan uses Rec Spec as his action and then Ahsoka spends her Focus token to trigger Lando at the start of the combat phase. Kanan can reduce incoming fire by 1 dice and so can Rex (as long as they are not shooting at Rex). Normally ships can be stripped down to 1 attack dice if they try to fire at anything apart from the 14-point distraction. Plus since Rex doesn't really care if he hits or not, that leaves him free to take an Evade action to keep him alive as long as possible.

Edited January 16, 2017 by Karhedron

[taulover55 354]

 

been greatly enjoying kanan ghost, though. If you can find a way to let him focus and evade in the same round, blighter becomes difficult to take down

 

I have been mulling the same problem and here is my solution. Unlike most Kanan builds it doesn't have Biggs (too short on points) but Rex is nearly as good, particularly as the meta seems to favour 2-3 ship builds at the moment. This should eat Dengaroo alive.

 

49 Kanan (35), Rec Spec (3), Lando (3), FCS (2), TLT (6), Ghost (0)

18 Zeb (18), Trick shot (0), Chopper (0), Phantom (0)

19 Ahsoka Tano (17), Captured Tie (1), VI (1)

14 Captain Rex (14)

100 Total

Kanan uses Rec Spec as his action and then Ahsoka spends her Focus token to trigger Lando at the start of the combat phase. Kanan can reduce incoming fire by 1 dice and so can Rex (as long as they are not shooting at Rex). Normally ships can be stripped down to 1 attack dice if they try to fire at anything apart from the 14-point distraction. Plus since Rex doesn't really care if he hits or not, that leaves him free to take an Evade action to keep him alive as long as possible.

 

 

Dammit, now I'm going to have to buy 2 Sabine's ties!!! 

[Firespray-32 5,424]

You can tier lists. You can't tier ships. The value of a ship is largely dependent on its wingmen and the list's tactics.

 

Tournaments pit lists against each other which gives us some comparative information but we have no way to isolate the effectiveness of a single ship.

Edited January 16, 2017 by Blue Five

[Admiral Deathrain 5,231]

I'll put tiers on wether the ship has at least one configuration that appears in a strong list and on how important it is. Outlier pilots are tiered seperately if they hit much higher over their ship.

 

Tier one: K-Wings (bombs and Miranda), VCX-100s (Rebel as the efficiency monster that keeps popping up, Kanan on the rise), Biggs Darklighter, Poe Dameron (PS8, kind of debateable, but I believe new tech works well for him).

 

Tier two: ARCs (Stress Braylen is very good, Norra is pretty good), Corran Horn, Dash Rendar, Y-Wings (just because of TLT access, again debateable).

 

Tier three: YT-1300s, Z-95s, A-Wings, Attack Shuttles, Tarn Mison.

 

Tier four: B-Wings (again debateable), X-Wings (both variants), HWK-290s, YT-2400s.

 

Tier five: Outer Rim Smugglers, E-Wings.

[iamfanboy 1,302]

You can tier lists. You can't tier ships. The value of a ship is largely dependent on its wingmen and the list's tactics.

 

Tournaments pit lists against each other which gives us some comparative information but we have no way to isolate the effectiveness of a single ship.

Foolishness.

 

If you "can't tier ships", then why is it that Luke Skywalker hasn't shown up in respectable numbers in three years? Or Fel's Wrath? Or Esege Toku? Or Ten Numb? Or Blue Ace?

 

Why is it that Omicron Group Pilot with Emperor Palpatine shows up in so many imperial lists, if you "can't tier ships"?

 

Why is it that Manaroo is suddenly such a huge part of so many Scum lists, if you "can't tier ships"?

 

How is it that Regen Corran Horn and Miranda Donei have stayed on the top playable Rebel ships for as long as they've been around, if you "can't tier ships"?

 

If you "can't tier ships", why don't people still run Contracted Scouts with torps even though they can't use Deadeye any more?

 

For competitive play there are many pilot cards that are never going to be viable, and a very small minority that are strongly viable in almost all cases - with a middle ground of "viable sometimes," and another group of "viable because it works well against what is strongly viable." This rating of viability is called tiering, and it exists for any competitive game.

 

X-Wing isn't a special flower that exists all on its lonesome because you happen to personally dislike tiering.

 

Yes, tiers can and well shift through time and development by the game's creators (Soontir Fel certainly isn't as viable as he used to be!) but that's part of how the system works.

 

 

That said, Schu81's list looks pretty good.

Edited January 16, 2017 by iamfanboy

[ficklegreendice 34,359]

 

been greatly enjoying kanan ghost, though. If you can find a way to let him focus and evade in the same round, blighter becomes difficult to take down

 

I have been mulling the same problem and here is my solution. Unlike most Kanan builds it doesn't have Biggs (too short on points) but Rex is nearly as good, particularly as the meta seems to favour 2-3 ship builds at the moment. This should eat Dengaroo alive.

 

49 Kanan (35), Rec Spec (3), Lando (3), FCS (2), TLT (6), Ghost (0)

18 Zeb (18), Trick shot (0), Chopper (0), Phantom (0)

19 Ahsoka Tano (17), Captured Tie (1), VI (1)

14 Captain Rex (14)

100 Total

Kanan uses Rec Spec as his action and then Ahsoka spends her Focus token to trigger Lando at the start of the combat phase. Kanan can reduce incoming fire by 1 dice and so can Rex (as long as they are not shooting at Rex). Normally ships can be stripped down to 1 attack dice if they try to fire at anything apart from the 14-point distraction. Plus since Rex doesn't really care if he hits or not, that leaves him free to take an Evade action to keep him alive as long as possible.

 

 

Lando is such utter garbage, though

 

could be rey instead

 

also

 

http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Rebel%20Alliance&d=v4!s!139:135,136,-1,-1,63,-1,-1:-1:25:;158:36,-1,-1,-1,201,198:-1:-1:;222:170:-1:29:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadron

Edited January 16, 2017 by ficklegreendice

[Karhedron 1,865]

49 Kanan (35), Rec Spec (3), Lando (3), FCS (2), TLT (6), Ghost (0)

18 Zeb (18), Trick shot (0), Chopper (0), Phantom (0)

19 Ahsoka Tano (17), Captured Tie (1), VI (1)

14 Captain Rex (14)

100 Total

 

Lando is such utter garbage, though

Well I think we all know your oppinion of green dice. But just remember that Lando only has a 14% chance of the dreaded double-blank (your mileage and dice may vary).

could be rey instead

Yes, or Jynn with the 2 fire arcs but these ladies will only provide you with Focus tokens. Stocking up Rey early on and then using Ahsoka to simply give Kanan and free Evade action might work if you prefer to do it that way.

Edited January 16, 2017 by Karhedron