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Jban

Prince Imrahil Hero + Gamling

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Hi all,

 

I got a question towards tactics Prince Imrahil Hero and the shuffle back into your deck principle.

 

So we got Prince Imrahil,

Prince-Imrahil.jpg

 

and suppose he has obtained the Rohan trait by some card effect:

  • Nor am I a Stranger
  • Mutual Accord

In case we have Gamling on the table, 

 

Gamling.jpg

 

Is it allowed to return the ally to your hand? I guess this isn't allowed since there is no 'discard' worded on Prince Imrahil, but I wanted to make sure since for an ally to be reshuffled into your deck you have to discard it, right? In case it was allowed, some fancy draw mechanism can be used to get your big set of Rohan allies into play quickly. Since you basically need them all to make a Rohan deck be efficient.

 

Greetings, Jban

 

 

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You are correct, you can't use Gamling in this way.  You need the word "discard" on Imrahil.  The ally leaves play, but it is not placed in the discard pile.  There is even a difference between "discarded" and "destroyed" (destroyed allies are not discarded).  So yeah, always look for that specific word.

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Ok, so to make it clear. We got three options for allies to leave play:

  • Destroyed (Damage exceeds hitpoints, Triggers Horn of Gondor)
  • Discarded (If written specifically as discarded, eg. Westfold Outrider)
  • Other leave play possibilities: 
    - Return to hand (eg. Sneak Attack)
    - Return to deck (eg. Prince Imrahil Tactics)

Thanks, for the quick response.

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It's still a good trick, though.  If you grabbed a self-discarding Rohan ally or a Rohan chump blocker, then Gamling can nab them and put them in your hand.

 

Like GrandSpleen said, a chump blocker cannot be retrieved. Only allies that get discarded are a viable target for Gamling.

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Pity.  So Gamling with Rohan-combat-Imrahil can only work directly with Westfold Horse Breaker, Westfold Outrider, Hama, Grimbold, and The Riddermark's Finest (Hama and Grimbold are warriors, so don't need Imrahil to be Rohan).  Ride to Ruin and Helm! Helm! can also be used with the combo.

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Ok, so to make it clear. We got three options for allies to leave play:

  • Destroyed (Damage exceeds hitpoints, Triggers Horn of Gondor)
  • Discarded (If written specifically as discarded, eg. Westfold Outrider)
  • Other leave play possibilities: 

    - Return to hand (eg. Sneak Attack)

    - Return to deck (eg. Prince Imrahil Tactics)

Thanks, for the quick response.

 

Other leave play possibilities:

 - Weird encounter cards like Cruel Torturer (http://hallofbeorn.com/LotR/Details/Cruel-Torturer-EfMG)

Edited by Seastan

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I still think it's silly that "destroyed" is not a type of "discarded". What do you do with a character who has been destroyed? You discard them! But they aren't discarded, they just go from being in play to being in your discard pile--that's a totally different thing, I promise!

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Well, nowhere it is sais that you discard character that are destroyed... you move it to your discard pile, yes.

To be more precise, they are defeated

 

 

 

Any time one of these cards has 0 hit points, it is immediately defeated. Defeated characters are placed in their owner’s discard pile, and defeated enemies are placed in the encounter discard pile

 

So no, don't invent rules that doesn't exist, and stick to the formal language defined by the game as close as possible.

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Well, nowhere it is sais that you discard character that are destroyed... you move it to your discard pile, yes.

To be more precise, they are defeated

 

Any time one of these cards has 0 hit points, it is immediately defeated. Defeated characters are placed in their owner’s discard pile, and defeated enemies are placed in the encounter discard pile

 

So no, don't invent rules that doesn't exist, and stick to the formal language defined by the game as close as possible.

he's not inventing rules, just bemoaning them

Pity.  So Gamling with Rohan-combat-Imrahil can only work directly with Westfold Horse Breaker, Westfold Outrider, Hama, Grimbold, and The Riddermark's Finest (Hama and Grimbold are warriors, so don't need Imrahil to be Rohan).  Ride to Ruin and Helm! Helm! can also be used with the combo.

additionally, Hama can be shuffled back into the deck like Beorn instead of being discarded (for the scenarios when that would be more useful than discarding)

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