CC fleet building rules

[Parkdaddy 626]

So the initial fleet building rules for CC state that only a single upgrade may be attached to any ship. Ships are refitted, upgrades reassigned, and purchases made in the management phase. I think that some have misinterpreted this to mean that throughout the entire campaign, ships may only have 1 upgrade at a time.

So my question: during the management phase, can ships be assigned more than 1 upgrade each? The "1 per ship" stipulation is only worded to apply to the initial list building, so that is my thought process on it. And by this wording, the first round of battles would actually require the "1 per," as there has not been a management phase

I know there was a thread where several people were excited about the single upgrade limitation, but I really think that was a measure put in place to prevent oversaturation of upgrades in the opening phases of the game (and so that you aren't facing a full-fledged Clonisher/Landmonition in the very first round), so that you really have to earn those kitted out, efficient builds. Also, the Rebel fleet would be very obviously biased towards TRC90 swarms otherwise.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

As I've espoused in a few threads, the easiest way is to go:


Initial list build, 400ts, 1 Upgrade each Ship

 

After your first game:

500pts, 167pt Squadrons.

 

 

 

You can move and even remove (and store) Purchased upgrades.  

 

You cannot move Titles

 

You cannot sell upgrades or ships.

[Kanawolf 56]

Can you exchange upgrades with other Admirals?

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Can you exchange upgrades with other Admirals?

 

 

There are no rules to do so.  Your Fleet is YOUR FLEET.

[mysticknight 2]

"You cannot sell upgrades or ships."

Do I read this right that you can only add to your fleet? Lets assume that I do not lose any ships and start with 1MC80L, 2xFrigateEscort, and 1 CR90. Going forward I would not be able to drop one of the frigates and corvette for an assault frigste mkII?

[Undeadguy 5,749]

"You cannot sell upgrades or ships."

Do I read this right that you can only add to your fleet? Lets assume that I do not lose any ships and start with 1MC80L, 2xFrigateEscort, and 1 CR90. Going forward I would not be able to drop one of the frigates and corvette for an assault frigste mkII?

You have 500 points to work with. I'm not sure how the un-equiped upgrades work. Maybe they don't add to your fleet points since they are not equipped to anything, allowing you to fit in more ships or squads.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

 

"You cannot sell upgrades or ships."

Do I read this right that you can only add to your fleet? Lets assume that I do not lose any ships and start with 1MC80L, 2xFrigateEscort, and 1 CR90. Going forward I would not be able to drop one of the frigates and corvette for an assault frigste mkII?

You have 500 points to work with. I'm not sure how the un-equiped upgrades work. Maybe they don't add to your fleet points since they are not equipped to anything, allowing you to fit in more ships or squads.

 

 

 

Upgrades can be removed from your fleet and stored.  They're not part of your fleet, so you're not paying fleet points for them - but you have "access" to them...  

Think of each upgrade card as a physical thing....  Because when your ship explodes, all of those physical things explode with them...

 

 

Niow, if they're non-unique, you can buy them back...  But you still have to buy them back.

 

Buying one set of XI7s does not mean you have XI7s for your entire Fleet - it means you have "One Ships" worth of XI7s....

[Undeadguy 5,749]

 

 

"You cannot sell upgrades or ships."

Do I read this right that you can only add to your fleet? Lets assume that I do not lose any ships and start with 1MC80L, 2xFrigateEscort, and 1 CR90. Going forward I would not be able to drop one of the frigates and corvette for an assault frigste mkII?

You have 500 points to work with. I'm not sure how the un-equiped upgrades work. Maybe they don't add to your fleet points since they are not equipped to anything, allowing you to fit in more ships or squads.

 

 

 

Upgrades can be removed from your fleet and stored.  They're not part of your fleet, so you're not paying fleet points for them - but you have "access" to them...  

Think of each upgrade card as a physical thing....  Because when your ship explodes, all of those physical things explode with them...

 

 

Niow, if they're non-unique, you can buy them back...  But you still have to buy them back.

 

Buying one set of XI7s does not mean you have XI7s for your entire Fleet - it means you have "One Ships" worth of XI7s....

 

So I should stock pile my TRCs for when my CR90s start blowing up.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Just assume replacement CR90As are 51 points.

[Undeadguy 5,749]

I'm going to buy 10 TRCs and there is nothing you can do to stop me.

 

I do think you should be able to side line ships though.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

I mean, rules wise - its because it doesn't say you can....     It says you can with Non-Titles Upgrades, but lists nothing else....

 

I think because of the scale and time involved...  You can Warehouse an Upgrade, but actually mothballing a ship takes a lot more...  

...  Like, who is going to pay the Crew?

[Undeadguy 5,749]

I mean, rules wise - its because it doesn't say you can....     It says you can with Non-Titles Upgrades, but lists nothing else....

 

I think because of the scale and time involved...  You can Warehouse an Upgrade, but actually mothballing a ship takes a lot more...  

...  Like, who is going to pay the Crew?

The crew doesn't need food or water or money. They work or they get jettisoned out the air lock. 

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Congratulations.  You just Jettisoned them all out of the Airlock............

 

The ship's basically destroyed with no crew...  I mean, I guess you could collect the frozen, pressure-vaporated corpses and pour them back in the airlocks...   But its not going to do anything for the decor....

[Undeadguy 5,749]

Rieekan will let them serve me. The zombie master loves the undead after all.

[Cactus 195]

If a player really wants to discard an entire ship from their fleet I see no reason to disallow it, but the whole idea feels a bit gamey and not in the spirit of the campaign. It should go without saying that there's no points rebate.

[Nostromoid 879]

I'd like to house rule that you can convert a ship from one version to another (of the same type) by spending half the cost of the new ship (keeping scarred or veterancy if applicable). Wouldn't be any big advantage, but thematic, and potentially salvaging an annoying mistake. Just retrofit the weaponry and systems, that sort of thing.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

That would be an interesting house rule, indeed...

Obviously, if the Ship has a Title, the Title stays, correct?

[Nostromoid 879]

Oh sure, change nothing else. But Home One can be converted from an Assault Cruiser to a Command Cruiser if your strategy changes part way through and you need to push some squadrons around, without having to throw it away and buy a new one.

[Reiryc 619]

As I've espoused in a few threads, the easiest way is to go:

Initial list build, 400ts, 1 Upgrade each Ship

 

After your first game:

500pts, 167pt Squadrons.

 

 

 

You can move and even remove (and store) Purchased upgrades.  

 

You cannot move Titles

 

You cannot sell upgrades or ships.

 

Just to be clear.  Is it your position that after the initial build, during subsequent battles, ships can have several upgrades attached to each ship?

 

I'm not disagreeing with that interpretation, but I'm just looking to clarify to others (locally) using the manual and/or the logic string.

 

I see that we can move upgrades, but moving doesn't, at least on the face of it, mean that the 1 upgrade per ship rule is removed, but rather it just allows us to move an upgrade card from say an assault frigate to a mon calamari cruiser and then moving the current upgrade from the cruiser to the frigate -- thus satisfying the 1 upgrade per ship rule, but also allowing the upgrades to be moved.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

 

As I've espoused in a few threads, the easiest way is to go:

Initial list build, 400ts, 1 Upgrade each Ship

 

After your first game:

500pts, 167pt Squadrons.

 

 

 

You can move and even remove (and store) Purchased upgrades.  

 

You cannot move Titles

 

You cannot sell upgrades or ships.

 

Just to be clear.  Is it your position that after the initial build, during subsequent battles, ships can have several upgrades attached to each ship?

 

I'm not disagreeing with that interpretation, but I'm just looking to clarify to others (locally) using the manual and/or the logic string.

 

I see that we can move upgrades, but moving doesn't, at least on the face of it, mean that the 1 upgrade per ship rule is removed, but rather it just allows us to move an upgrade card from say an assault frigate to a mon calamari cruiser and then moving the current upgrade from the cruiser to the frigate -- thus satisfying the 1 upgrade per ship rule, but also allowing the upgrades to be moved.

 

 

 

It is most certainly of my opinion that the "One upgrade per ship Rule" is effectively removed and terminated after the first battle.

 

You are free to purchase Ships, Squadrons, and Upgrades for your Ships, with your resource points.

 

Upgrades can be shuffled from ship to ship, or even detached from ships entirely and re-attached at a later campaign stage.

 

Titles can only be added, they cannot be moved or removed...

 

 

 

But you are certainly free to purchase Upgrades, as the one upgrade per ship rule only exists for construction of said fleet.

[Reiryc 619]

 

 

As I've espoused in a few threads, the easiest way is to go:

Initial list build, 400ts, 1 Upgrade each Ship

 

After your first game:

500pts, 167pt Squadrons.

 

 

 

You can move and even remove (and store) Purchased upgrades.  

 

You cannot move Titles

 

You cannot sell upgrades or ships.

 

Just to be clear.  Is it your position that after the initial build, during subsequent battles, ships can have several upgrades attached to each ship?

 

I'm not disagreeing with that interpretation, but I'm just looking to clarify to others (locally) using the manual and/or the logic string.

 

I see that we can move upgrades, but moving doesn't, at least on the face of it, mean that the 1 upgrade per ship rule is removed, but rather it just allows us to move an upgrade card from say an assault frigate to a mon calamari cruiser and then moving the current upgrade from the cruiser to the frigate -- thus satisfying the 1 upgrade per ship rule, but also allowing the upgrades to be moved.

 

 

 

It is most certainly of my opinion that the "One upgrade per ship Rule" is effectively removed and terminated after the first battle.

 

You are free to purchase Ships, Squadrons, and Upgrades for your Ships, with your resource points.

 

Upgrades can be shuffled from ship to ship, or even detached from ships entirely and re-attached at a later campaign stage.

 

Titles can only be added, they cannot be moved or removed...

 

 

 

But you are certainly free to purchase Upgrades, as the one upgrade per ship rule only exists for construction of said fleet.

 

 

You can buy these upgrades, yes.  Which then can be switched out with current upgrades.

 

I'm just not seeing where it says that the 1 upgrade per ship rule no longer applies.

 

On page 5 it says:  Players may equip only one upgrade card to each small, medium or large ship.  ....commanders don't count, pick a flagship, only 1 flagship.

 

I think what you wrote is what's intended and I think that the 1 upgrade per ship at the start is a way to limit the amount of upgrade cards initially purchased ie start with 3 ships, you only get 3 upgrade cards.  However, I can't find where that 1 upgrade card equipped per ship rule is undone simply because we can purchase additional upgrade cards.  Switching out upgrades doesn't remove the 1 upgrade per ship limitation as far as I can see and we are allowed to not have all upgrade cards equipped. 

 

So where are you drawing your conclusions from the manual that removes that 1 upgrade card per ship stipulation?  I just want to point to local guys, it says here on page x of the rules, that you can have more than 1 upgrade card or that here on page x it talks about more than a single upgrade card on a ship.

 

You're always a great resource for faq and rrg page knowledge, so I'm looking for that here -- I'm not arguing personally that what you write is wrong.  I'm playing devil's advocate so I can then get from you (or others), definitive rule logic or page numbers that I can use to back up my belief (which coincides with yours).

[Kendraam 230]

 

 

 

As I've espoused in a few threads, the easiest way is to go:

Initial list build, 400ts, 1 Upgrade each Ship

 

After your first game:

500pts, 167pt Squadrons.

 

 

 

You can move and even remove (and store) Purchased upgrades.  

 

You cannot move Titles

 

You cannot sell upgrades or ships.

 

Just to be clear.  Is it your position that after the initial build, during subsequent battles, ships can have several upgrades attached to each ship?

 

I'm not disagreeing with that interpretation, but I'm just looking to clarify to others (locally) using the manual and/or the logic string.

 

I see that we can move upgrades, but moving doesn't, at least on the face of it, mean that the 1 upgrade per ship rule is removed, but rather it just allows us to move an upgrade card from say an assault frigate to a mon calamari cruiser and then moving the current upgrade from the cruiser to the frigate -- thus satisfying the 1 upgrade per ship rule, but also allowing the upgrades to be moved.

 

 

 

It is most certainly of my opinion that the "One upgrade per ship Rule" is effectively removed and terminated after the first battle.

 

You are free to purchase Ships, Squadrons, and Upgrades for your Ships, with your resource points.

 

Upgrades can be shuffled from ship to ship, or even detached from ships entirely and re-attached at a later campaign stage.

 

Titles can only be added, they cannot be moved or removed...

 

 

 

But you are certainly free to purchase Upgrades, as the one upgrade per ship rule only exists for construction of said fleet.

 

 

You can buy these upgrades, yes.  Which then can be switched out with current upgrades.

 

I'm just not seeing where it says that the 1 upgrade per ship rule no longer applies.

 

On page 5 it says:  Players may equip only one upgrade card to each small, medium or large ship.  ....commanders don't count, pick a flagship, only 1 flagship.

 

I think what you wrote is what's intended and I think that the 1 upgrade per ship at the start is a way to limit the amount of upgrade cards initially purchased ie start with 3 ships, you only get 3 upgrade cards.  However, I can't find where that 1 upgrade card equipped per ship rule is undone simply because we can purchase additional upgrade cards.  Switching out upgrades doesn't remove the 1 upgrade per ship limitation as far as I can see and we are allowed to not have all upgrade cards equipped. 

 

So where are you drawing your conclusions from the manual that removes that 1 upgrade card per ship stipulation?  I just want to point to local guys, it says here on page x of the rules, that you can have more than 1 upgrade card or that here on page x it talks about more than a single upgrade card on a ship.

 

You're always a great resource for faq and rrg page knowledge, so I'm looking for that here -- I'm not arguing personally that what you write is wrong.  I'm playing devil's advocate so I can then get from you (or others), definitive rule logic or page numbers that I can use to back up my belief (which coincides with yours).

 

Page 11 under the 'Refit and Expand Fleets' section, when talking about unscarring individual ships it states "Do not include the cost of any equipped upgrade cards." Plural.

Also, page 5 under the 'Build Fleets' section there are two bullet points regarding restrictions on Unique cards and having One upgrade card.  The section on Uniques specifically mentions "This rule applies for the duration of the campaign." whereas there is no such stipulation for the only one upgrade card section.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Exactly

 

Is it definitively stated?  No.  No it is not.  And it won't be.

 

But everything else still mentions multiple upgrades...  Even the Fleet Roster Sheet has a section for "Upgrades", not "Upgrade."  

 

 

 

You construct a fleet using the standard rules, with that exception - one upgrade per fleet.

 

 

We are then told we can add Squadrons, Ships and Upgrades, to this fleet...  It does not say that the restriction on 1 upgrade remains (and honestly, if it was intended to remain, its a big goddamn deal and needs to be written down in bold, italic and underlined lettering......)

 

 

We are told that if a ship is destroyed all attached upgrades are destroyed as well.

 

I mean, if the intention again, was to only have 1 upgrade per ship, then I'm sure the fleet roster woul dhave a large section that was "Upgrade Pool" that you are constantly changing things in and out of, snap-on style.

 

 

But if you want a Page Number and a Reference for that?  No. Sorry.  This is a friendly campaign where things are not hard-fast, tournament-grade rules all the time.

It simply does not exist.

[Reiryc 619]

 

 

 

 

As I've espoused in a few threads, the easiest way is to go:

Initial list build, 400ts, 1 Upgrade each Ship

 

After your first game:

500pts, 167pt Squadrons.

 

 

 

You can move and even remove (and store) Purchased upgrades.  

 

You cannot move Titles

 

You cannot sell upgrades or ships.

 

Just to be clear.  Is it your position that after the initial build, during subsequent battles, ships can have several upgrades attached to each ship?

 

I'm not disagreeing with that interpretation, but I'm just looking to clarify to others (locally) using the manual and/or the logic string.

 

I see that we can move upgrades, but moving doesn't, at least on the face of it, mean that the 1 upgrade per ship rule is removed, but rather it just allows us to move an upgrade card from say an assault frigate to a mon calamari cruiser and then moving the current upgrade from the cruiser to the frigate -- thus satisfying the 1 upgrade per ship rule, but also allowing the upgrades to be moved.

 

 

 

It is most certainly of my opinion that the "One upgrade per ship Rule" is effectively removed and terminated after the first battle.

 

You are free to purchase Ships, Squadrons, and Upgrades for your Ships, with your resource points.

 

Upgrades can be shuffled from ship to ship, or even detached from ships entirely and re-attached at a later campaign stage.

 

Titles can only be added, they cannot be moved or removed...

 

 

 

But you are certainly free to purchase Upgrades, as the one upgrade per ship rule only exists for construction of said fleet.

 

 

You can buy these upgrades, yes.  Which then can be switched out with current upgrades.

 

I'm just not seeing where it says that the 1 upgrade per ship rule no longer applies.

 

On page 5 it says:  Players may equip only one upgrade card to each small, medium or large ship.  ....commanders don't count, pick a flagship, only 1 flagship.

 

I think what you wrote is what's intended and I think that the 1 upgrade per ship at the start is a way to limit the amount of upgrade cards initially purchased ie start with 3 ships, you only get 3 upgrade cards.  However, I can't find where that 1 upgrade card equipped per ship rule is undone simply because we can purchase additional upgrade cards.  Switching out upgrades doesn't remove the 1 upgrade per ship limitation as far as I can see and we are allowed to not have all upgrade cards equipped. 

 

So where are you drawing your conclusions from the manual that removes that 1 upgrade card per ship stipulation?  I just want to point to local guys, it says here on page x of the rules, that you can have more than 1 upgrade card or that here on page x it talks about more than a single upgrade card on a ship.

 

You're always a great resource for faq and rrg page knowledge, so I'm looking for that here -- I'm not arguing personally that what you write is wrong.  I'm playing devil's advocate so I can then get from you (or others), definitive rule logic or page numbers that I can use to back up my belief (which coincides with yours).

 

Page 11 under the 'Refit and Expand Fleets' section, when talking about unscarring individual ships it states "Do not include the cost of any equipped upgrade cards." Plural.

Also, page 5 under the 'Build Fleets' section there are two bullet points regarding restrictions on Unique cards and having One upgrade card.  The section on Uniques specifically mentions "This rule applies for the duration of the campaign." whereas there is no such stipulation for the only one upgrade card section.

 

 

Perfect.  I think page 11 gets it right on!  I didn't read that originally as individual ships but rather as a big purchase of multiple ships/cards at once.  Thus you could refit 2 ships for example.

 

thank you!

[Reiryc 619]

Exactly

 

Is it definitively stated?  No.  No it is not.  And it won't be.

 

But everything else still mentions multiple upgrades...  Even the Fleet Roster Sheet has a section for "Upgrades", not "Upgrade."  

 

 

 

You construct a fleet using the standard rules, with that exception - one upgrade per fleet.

 

 

We are then told we can add Squadrons, Ships and Upgrades, to this fleet...  It does not say that the restriction on 1 upgrade remains (and honestly, if it was intended to remain, its a big goddamn deal and needs to be written down in bold, italic and underlined lettering......)

 

 

We are told that if a ship is destroyed all attached upgrades are destroyed as well.

 

I mean, if the intention again, was to only have 1 upgrade per ship, then I'm sure the fleet roster woul dhave a large section that was "Upgrade Pool" that you are constantly changing things in and out of, snap-on style.

 

 

But if you want a Page Number and a Reference for that?  No. Sorry.  This is a friendly campaign where things are not hard-fast, tournament-grade rules all the time.

It simply does not exist.

 

I hear ya...

 

This expansion just doesn't seem as tight in the 'rules' department as other releases, at least to me.