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kyten44

A over stressed suggestion

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I have seen some people not liking the fact that ships can carry an infinite amount of stress without consequences. I had a thought about that.

First let me say I do not have a problem with the current stress mechanics

 

If a ship has more stress than remaining hull, All damage cards are dealt face up. just would have errta tycho so he is imune to this effect.

 

what do you think?

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Simple if you have 4 or more stress then all white maneuvers count as red. Sure Tycho gets a nerf but not really since the awing dail has lots of greens. This fits the stress fluff the more stress you ship takes the harder it is to do other maneuvers it affect s all even robots because it is affecting the ships performance too

Edited by eagletsi111

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Stress was a game mechanic that balanced out the use of some (otherwise) advantageous ability. 

 

 

X-Wing originally was a game where it mattered whether your guns were pointed in the right direction during the attack phase.  Having a stress token meant not only losing an action, but more importantly - it meant having reduced mobility - red maneuvers were "off the table" until you could perform a green maneuver.  Many games were won and lost because of a single stress token causing one player to miss a single beat, and go from the pursuer, to the pursued.

 

Stress was a real deterrent right up until turrets were introduced, but since with turrets, it doesn't matter if your ship is facing the enemy at pew-pew time - gaining a stress (on such a ship) no longer represented a the same level of detriment.

 

That is what we are seeing when we see ships flying around unhindered by the pile of stress tokens in their wake.

 

As a player, I don't want stress to damage my enemy - I want it to inconvenience them in the same way it inconveniences me.

 

To that end, I'd be satisfied if when a ship has two or more stress tokens, the opponent must choose a white maneuver from their dial - and remove one of the stress tokens.

 

 

As it is, stress isn't really the deterrent it used to be - at least for a ship equipped with a turret - and some would [say] that until it is again the deterrent it ought to be, the game stands a little less balanced than it could be.  It would be interesting to play test something like this to see how it affects balance.

 

edited for [clarity]

Edited by DanDoulogos

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How about they instead make an alteration to what appears to have caused "overstressed" to actually be a concern?

 

Having a mountain of Stress has not been an issue until recently although it became a real possibly way back in Wave 2.

 

If you really think you need to penalize a ship for having some level of stress, which may not be any fault of its own, then what ever was really should clear all of the stress that led to that "overstressed" situation.  If you're not going to do that why not just say that when a ship has Stress tokens >= Hull/PS/whatever the ship is destroyed immediately as a ship that gets that much stress isn't likely to shed much of it very quickly.

 

And some people complain about Shield Regeneration which generally can only happen 1 token at a time.  Barring a lot of extra help a ship could only lose one Stress token at a time when performing a specific set of maneuvers.

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I'm not really sure stress needs to be changed. It's really only 2 scum ship builds and tycho that don't care about it, and even them most people are only complaining about dengaroo with Zuckuss, which requires manaroo for the actions and the fact the jump master has a white s loop, no one really worried about it when it was just the party bus and tycho

soon enough we are going to have wave 10 and we still have 2 ships that haven't been spoilt, and the meta will change soon.

Btw I play tycho a lot and really don't want anything that makes him even less effective that he already is, but even so stress is still a big issue for 99% of ships so it really does not need to be changed

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I think the stress rules are fine as is. If they were to change I would hope it is just to make it so that any maneuver that rotates your ship becomes red while stressed. That way even if a ship has a white K or Sloop they can't do it while stressed. That only effects a couple of ships but makes stress at least matter a little to everyone.

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I'm not a fan of changing stress. If I had to, it would be the following and reprinting the few pilots screwed over by this. Add a step to attacking/defending: before the compare dice step remove one of your dice for each stress you have.

Perhaps after a starting threshold... eg for each Stress token above 3.

Or just completely deny attacks to ships above a certain level (5?).

Or course, Tycho would simply need 2 words ("and attacks") added after the word "actions".

 

Then other builds that rely on piling stress on themselves also have to manage their own levels to a degree.

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Stress works well, except for zuckus.

It's just another example of the designers getting too excited and making scum too powerful.

They screwed up the Contracted Scout, and they screwed up zuckus.

The fix for scout should have been to make the scout a unique Pilot, and zuckus should have been "...if you do not already have any stress tokens..."

Oh, and palp should have been range 1-3.

Then a boost to x wings in yhe form of a few really good x wing only Astromechs and we're golden.

And then something for khiraxz, and starviper. Done.

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I don't think Zuckuss needs that much of a nerf, maybe "If you have less than 3 stress tokens... ...until you have up to 3 stress tokens" That way it can be used for a roll or two, then need to come out of the fight for a bit to be able to wreck someone's day again.

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I don't think Zuckuss needs that much of a nerf, maybe "If you have less than 3 stress tokens... ...until you have up to 3 stress tokens" That way it can be used for a roll or two, then need to come out of the fight for a bit to be able to wreck someone's day again.

This. Almost - not quite but almost - all of the ships that don't care about stress get that stress from Zuckuss. A simple errata (add the text "If you ate not stressed...) to the start of Tue card) makes his ability restricted, so that you can only use him when not stressed, and he suddenly becomes appropriately costed at 1 point, and most of your stress loving ships suddenly become that much less potent.

The great thing is, Zuckuss is still good in that configuration at one point. You either use him as a sort of Juke-lite, modifying one green die every turn, then doing a green move to clear it, or you treat him like a munition - you've managed to roll a bunch of hits or crits that your opponent has dodged, you deploy Zuckuss and get your three stress and then you may never use him again in the game - but for one point, who cares?

In his current configuration, Zuckuss is a 4 or 5 point card. It's that discrepancy that's causing the issue with stress more than anything else.

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In his current configuration, Zuckuss is a 4 or 5 point card. It's that discrepancy that's causing the issue with stress more than anything else.

The thing is the real cost of Zuckuss is no Reds, no Actions (so no repositions) and 1pt. The fact of the matter is you are adding a 30+ point ship into your build to get over some of Zuckuss' restrictions. So what is the real cost of the card????

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Just reword Zuckuss to match Opportunist. "When attacking, you may receive one stress token to make the defender reroll one defence dice. You cannot use this ability if you have any stress tokens."

That should stop the worst stress offender (whether R3-A2 should have similar wording is another matter). Also, for one point it's STILL a good ability.

It also brings the mechanic in line with Elusiveness (although better, as it's cheaper and not an Elite Talent).

Edited by FTS Gecko

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Just reword Zuckuss to match Opportunist. "When attacking, you may receive one stress token to make the defender reroll one defence dice. You cannot use this ability if you have any stress tokens."

That should stop the worst stress offender (whether R3-A2 should have similar wording is another matter). Also, for one point it's STILL a good ability.

It also brings the mechanic in line with Elusiveness (although better, as it's cheaper and not an Elite Talent).

It wouldn't be used... Scum have tonnes of ships with crew spaces that you could fit a Zuckuss into. Ofc they can't operate while stressed so they would have to use him for one green dice then clear the stress and repeat. The fact you don't see any ship ever take Zuckuss unless they are going to go all out and have ways around his downsides shows that he is not viable if you don't stress stack with him.

Edited by Rodent Mastermind

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Or course, Tycho would simply need 2 words ("and attacks") added after the word "actions".

You could just change Tycho's ability to, "If any effect would cause this ship to receive one or more stress tokens these stress tokens are discarded," or suchlike without materially impacting the game.

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Just reword Zuckuss to match Opportunist. "When attacking, you may receive one stress token to make the defender reroll one defence dice. You cannot use this ability if you have any stress tokens."That should stop the worst stress offender (whether R3-A2 should have similar wording is another matter). Also, for one point it's STILL a good ability.It also brings the mechanic in line with Elusiveness (although better, as it's cheaper and not an Elite Talent).

It wouldn't be used... Scum have tonnes of ships with crew spaces that you could fit a Zuckuss into. Ofc they can't operate while stressed so they would have to use him for one green dice then clear the stress and repeat. The fact you don't see any ship ever take Zuckuss unless they are going to go all out and have ways around his downsides shows that he is not viable if you don't stress stack with him.

So basically that would be problem solved then. Zuckuss would either be limited in the fashion of other, similar cards ir simply not used (like the other, similar cards).

Job done!

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Just reword Zuckuss to match Opportunist. "When attacking, you may receive one stress token to make the defender reroll one defence dice. You cannot use this ability if you have any stress tokens."That should stop the worst stress offender (whether R3-A2 should have similar wording is another matter). Also, for one point it's STILL a good ability.It also brings the mechanic in line with Elusiveness (although better, as it's cheaper and not an Elite Talent).

It wouldn't be used... Scum have tonnes of ships with crew spaces that you could fit a Zuckuss into. Ofc they can't operate while stressed so they would have to use him for one green dice then clear the stress and repeat. The fact you don't see any ship ever take Zuckuss unless they are going to go all out and have ways around his downsides shows that he is not viable if you don't stress stack with him.

So basically that would be problem solved then. Zuckuss would either be limited in the fashion of other, similar cards ir simply not used (like the other, similar cards).

Job done!

Yep because what we need more of is cards that aren't used.

If we were going to Errata it, I would go much lighter with one Attack a turn, so it couldn't be double dipped by Dengar, or TLTs...

Edited by Rodent Mastermind

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...snip...

 

Yep because what we need more of is cards that aren't used.

If we were going to Errata it, I would go much lighter with one Attack a turn, so it couldn't be double dipped by Dengar, or TLTs...

 

 

Every time we get new cards we get more cards that aren't used.  It's the truth even if we aren't doing anything to the old cards.  New cards come and either sit on the sidelines or replace cards that were formerly used.  Occasionally that is straight up replacement although other times it may just push the old card's playing time well below what it had been to the point it no longer feels like it is being used.

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Yep because what we need more of is cards that aren't used.

If we were going to Errata it, I would go much lighter with one Attack a turn, so it couldn't be double dipped by Dengar, or TLTs...

 

Forcing the reroll of just one Evade dice is worth it, especially for one point.

 

Hell, Juke essentially does the same thing, only with a lesser effect (focus results can still be modified) and more requirements (Elite Talent slot, Evade token), costs 2 points and sees plenty of use.

 

So don't try and claim that such an errata would render the card worthless, when that clearly wouldn't be the case.

 

Also:

 

If certain card combinations are abusing a game mechanic, those cards should be addressed.

You don't rebuild an entire car just because the side view mirrors need correction.

 

Agree with this entirely.  The stress mechanics are perfectly fine, it's the combinations which circumvent stress which need to be addressed.

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The problem with almost all these suggestions it that they basically focus on the "ships that get boatloads of stress on their own" and ignore the "ships that give out stress tokens like candy".  Stressbot was bad enough when all he did was shut down your actions, but now you want to stack bonus damage cards (going through shields!) or prevent the target from attacking?

 

All because of basically one card: Zuckuss.  A card that only truly functions on a very small handful of ships that require either a support ship (read: Manaroo), or are sitting ducks for return fire (YV-666).  Maybe, just maybe the issue isn't Zuckuss.  Maybe, just maybe you're focusing on the one upgrade card instead of the larger game.

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