Snap Wexley, Pattern Analyzer, and Substep B!

[lazycomet 294]

 

 

Note that is says "When executING a maneuver" indicating when you are currently in the process of it, as you now have a window to interrupt the normal flow. It does not imply the check pilot stress is still there.

 

When you are executING a maneuver you have not FINISHED a maneuver, you are currently doing it. Meaning you have started the first substep, i.e. move ship, you are offered an opportunity to change the normal process and be finished with your maneuver now.

You opt for this, and the Execute Maneuver is now finished. Move on to Action step with its new Check Pilot Stress substep.

 

If you have any idea of how computer logic works, you will know its really, really easy to have the same exact command enter a group of commands and interrupt at one point sometimes and othertimes not. Logical flow. Nothing can be in the same place two times, and you are acting like it is.

Upgrade cards in any game (or gear/whatever) break the normal rule flow like crazy. In some cases it bends it backwards and makes it lick its own butthole because its so whacked up, and people accept it anyway because thats how it works despite the original rule being there.

 

Im not swayed. FFG will need to FAQ this. You haven't executed a maneuver until "check pilot stress." Pattern Analyzer gives me zero indication that this RULE has changed.

Why would there be a need for faq?

---for red maneuvers--

1. You do your maneuver

2. You do your action

3. You receive your stress token if you did a red maneuver

--green maneuvers--

1. Do maneuver

2. Remove stress as normal

3. Do action

 

 

Missed the debate big-time.

[lazycomet 294]

If what you are saying is true, then Perform Action is now a part of Execute Maneuver, which will cause a whole heap of issues and confusions.

 

And which issues and confusions did Advanced Sensors cause? That is your Perform Action subphase BEFORE you're finished Executing a Maneuver.

[VanorDM 11,599]

You haven't executed a maneuver until "check pilot stress."

One last shot at this...

the Activation Phase is made up of 3 sub phases.

Subphase 1 Reveal Dial:

Subphase 2 Execute Maneuver (with normally 3 subphases of that subphase)

Subphase 3 Perform Action

Pattern Analyzer move Step 2.b to sometime after Step 3. You do not need to do step b in order to have the Perform a Maneuver trigger to happen, because substep b no longer exists as part of Step 2, it is now Step 3.a

 

So once you've gone through the process of Step 2, which no longer includes Check Stress step, you have performed a maneuver and can use Snaps ability to take a free boost.

[Vineheart01 6,403]

Perform Action is also its own independent step. Theres no confusion there.

Its also not moving a step around. It directly tells you then skip your perform action step. Thats why Adv Sensors has no issues.

Edited November 1, 2016 by Vineheart01

[DeathstarII 1,164]

Here are the two ways to play this out until FAQ:

 

1. SNAP plots a 2, 3, or 4 Dial

2. SNAP moves

3. SNAP elects to PA before checking stress

4. SNAP takes FOCUS as a PA action

5. SNAP checks stress

6. SNAP may free boosts IF not stressed.

 

1. SNAP plots a 2, 3, or 4 Dial

2. SNAP moves

3. SNAP elects to PA before checking stress

4. SNAP takes Free Boost as a fuzzy trigger

5. SNAP takes FOCUS as PA action

5. SNAP checks stress

The second of those would be the correct one because, like people are saying, check pilot stress is no longer part of execute maneuver

[VanorDM 11,599]

And which issues and confusions did Advanced Sensors cause? That is your Perform Action subphase BEFORE you're finished Executing a Maneuver.

No it is not. Advanced Sensors effective moves the Perform Action step before the Perform Maneuver step.

[lazycomet 294]

 

Here are the two ways to play this out until FAQ:

 

1. SNAP plots a 2, 3, or 4 Dial

2. SNAP moves

3. SNAP elects to PA before checking stress

4. SNAP takes FOCUS as a PA action

5. SNAP checks stress

6. SNAP may free boosts IF not stressed.

 

1. SNAP plots a 2, 3, or 4 Dial

2. SNAP moves

3. SNAP elects to PA before checking stress

4. SNAP takes Free Boost as a fuzzy trigger

5. SNAP takes FOCUS as PA action

5. SNAP checks stress

The second of those would be the correct one because, like people are saying, check pilot stress is no longer part of execute maneuver

 

Gonk was definitely more concise.

 

[lazycomet 294]

 

You haven't executed a maneuver until "check pilot stress."

Pattern Analyzer move Step 2.b to sometime after Step 3. You do not need to do step b in order to have the Perform a Maneuver trigger to happen, because substep b no longer exists as part of Step 2, it is now Step 3.a

 

One last shot at this...

How can you be so sure that Pattern Analyzer doesn't move Step 3 to Step 2.b, bumping (old) 2.b to 2.c and well, (old) 2.c was rather pointless anyway, Trigger wise.

Edited November 1, 2016 by lazycomet

[VanorDM 11,599]

Gonk was definitely more concise.

No not really. The only issue here is that you don't want to take the PA upgrade at face value, you seem to think things are implied or need to be interpreted, but they don't. Simply do exactly what the card says to do.

[lazycomet 294]

 

Gonk was definitely more concise.

No not really. The only issue here is that you don't want to take the PA upgrade at face value, you seem to think things are implied or need to be interpreted, but they don't. Simply do exactly what the card says to do.

 

The card is telling me to Move Step 3 to Step 2.b, got it.

[VanorDM 11,599]

How can you be so sure that Pattern Analyzer doesn't move Step 3 to Step 2.b, bumping 2.b to 2.c and well

Because that would create unneeded confusion about what the card actually does.  

 

Yes in theory it could insert step 3 into step 2 between a and b.  But there's no reason to do that, since making Check Pilot Stress step 3.a is much more simple and consistent.  

 

Why should I cross the road at the nearest crosswalk to where I want to go, when I can go down 3 blocks, across 5 more then back another 3 to get to the same spot?  Because one is simple and the other isn't.

[DeathstarII 1,164]

Gonk was definitely more concise.

No not really. The only issue here is that you don't want to take the PA upgrade at face value, you seem to think things are implied or need to be interpreted, but they don't. Simply do exactly what the card says to do.

The card is telling me to Move Step 3 to Step 2.b, got it.

No, the card is telling you to move step 2.b to step 3

[lazycomet 294]

 

 

 

Gonk was definitely more concise.

No not really. The only issue here is that you don't want to take the PA upgrade at face value, you seem to think things are implied or need to be interpreted, but they don't. Simply do exactly what the card says to do.

The card is telling me to Move Step 3 to Step 2.b, got it.

No, the card is telling you to move step 2.b to step 3

 

 

Perform Step 3 before Step 2.b instead of after. Sure sounds like Step 3 is being moved... not the other way around.

[VanorDM 11,599]

Perform Step 3 before Step 2.b instead of after. Sure sounds like Step 3 is being moved... not the other way around.

I'm starting to believe you're being intentionally obtuse here... Since the card clearly says to move the Check Pilot stress and not to move the Perform Action step.

[lazycomet 294]

 

Perform Step 3 before Step 2.b instead of after. Sure sounds like Step 3 is being moved... not the other way around.

I'm starting to believe you're being intentionally obtuse here... Since the card clearly says to move the Check Pilot stress and not to move the Perform Action step.

 

 

No, that was literally a brain-fart. I guess I want to be wrong, as it makes Triple-Action PTL-Snap clear his stress (onGreen) after Pattern Analyzer (cheese) a thing. I don't want to love that CRAZY combo only to find out Checking Stress is still a requirement before the Free Boost.

Edited November 1, 2016 by lazycomet

[VanorDM 11,599]

This is no different then how you can use BB-8 and PtL to perform 3 actions and clear your stress.

[lazycomet 294]

 

Perform Step 3 before Step 2.b instead of after. Sure sounds like Step 3 is being moved... not the other way around.

I'm starting to believe you're being intentionally obtuse here... Since the card clearly says to move the Check Pilot stress and not to move the Perform Action step.

 

 

Side problem...

 

1. PTL/PA SNAP reveals a green

2. SNAP moves his ship

3. SNAP can Free Boost after a Vectored Barrel Roll -or- due to triggered ability, only beforehand?

[lazycomet 294]

This is no different then how you can use BB-8 and PtL to perform 3 actions and clear your stress.

 

Focus on Snap's Triggered Ability, please.

[DeathstarII 1,164]

Perform Step 3 before Step 2.b instead of after. Sure sounds like Step 3 is being moved... not the other way around.

I'm starting to believe you're being intentionally obtuse here... Since the card clearly says to move the Check Pilot stress and not to move the Perform Action step.

 

Side problem...

 

1. PTL/PA SNAP reveals a green

2. SNAP moves his ship

3. SNAP can Free Boost after a Vectored Barrel Roll -or- due to triggered ability, only beforehand?

Snap gets his free boost BEFORE the preform action step that, with pattern analyzer, has the option to have moved step 2.b into step 3.a

[lazycomet 294]

 

 

 

Perform Step 3 before Step 2.b instead of after. Sure sounds like Step 3 is being moved... not the other way around.

I'm starting to believe you're being intentionally obtuse here... Since the card clearly says to move the Check Pilot stress and not to move the Perform Action step.

 

Side problem...

 

1. PTL/PA SNAP reveals a green

2. SNAP moves his ship

3. SNAP can Free Boost after a Vectored Barrel Roll -or- due to triggered ability, only beforehand?

Snap gets his free boost BEFORE the preform action step that, with pattern analyzer, has the option to have moved step 2.b into step 3.a

 

 

You're starting to see my confusion... If Snap gets his Free Boost only after executing but before the perform action step and the perform action step has been moved... we're back to square 1.

[VanorDM 11,599]

3. SNAP can Free Boost after a Vectored Barrel Roll -or- due to triggered ability, only beforehand?

The Vectored Thrusters doesn't fulfil the requirement for Snap, it's not a speed 2, 3, or 4 maneuver.

So he'd have to do his free boost before he could take the barrel roll action allowed by Vectored Thrusters.

[DeathstarII 1,164]

Perform Step 3 before Step 2.b instead of after. Sure sounds like Step 3 is being moved... not the other way around.

I'm starting to believe you're being intentionally obtuse here... Since the card clearly says to move the Check Pilot stress and not to move the Perform Action step.

 

Side problem...

 

1. PTL/PA SNAP reveals a green

2. SNAP moves his ship

3. SNAP can Free Boost after a Vectored Barrel Roll -or- due to triggered ability, only beforehand?

Snap gets his free boost BEFORE the preform action step that, with pattern analyzer, has the option to have moved step 2.b into step 3.a

 

You're starting to see my confusion... If Snap gets his Free Boost only after executing but before the perform action step and the perform action step has been moved... we're back to square 1.

I never said the perform action step was moved, I said the check pilot stress step (2.b) was moved

[VanorDM 11,599]

If Snap gets his Free Boost only after executing but before the perform action step and the perform action step has been moved... we're back to square 1.

No, because the Perform Maneuver process is still Step 2, it still happens before Step 3, the only thing that has changed is step 2.b is now Clean Up, and step 3.a is Check Pilot stress. So you don't get the stress token until after you've completed the Perform Action step.

[lazycomet 294]

 

If Snap gets his Free Boost only after executing but before the perform action step and the perform action step has been moved... we're back to square 1.

No, because the Perform Maneuver process is still Step 2, it still happens before Step 3, the only thing that has changed is step 2.b is now Clean Up, and step 3.a is Check Pilot stress. So you don't get the stress token until after you've completed the Perform Action step.

 

PA has definitely made a mess of "Execution" triggers like Snap's. So basically, PA has turned Substep A. Move Ships the only requirement for "Execution." That seems like a huge FLUX for very little card text.

[VanorDM 11,599]

So basically, PA has turned Substep A. Move Ships the only requirement for "Execution." That seems like a huge FLUX for very little card text.

Effectively yes, although you still have to do the Clean Up phase... PA is a good upgrade, but you still get the stress and have to deal with it. It's also a 2 point upgrade in the Tech slot.

I'm going to post this again, because it's the clearest way I can explain it...

1. Reveal Dial

2. Execute Maneuver

a. Move Ship

b. Clean up

(Perform after a maneuver triggers here)

3. Perform action

a. Check Pilot Stress