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Sadgit

The Community Rules Reference Guide (CRRG) Project

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With a new RtL campaign coming up soon, I thought it might be helpful for people to get an overview on the content of available expansions to decide what to buy next.

Here is a preview on some tables that will be included in the appendix of my rules reference guide book.

 

5Bkb0pn.jpg

 

IMcQzlo.jpg

 

 

Interestingly, the core box seems to come with 9 RtL side quests instead of the 8 as indicated on the collection screen.

I think, the 9th is "The Treasure of Davin Throm", but I might be wrong here.

 

Comments, corrections and requests are highly welcome.

EDIT: I updated the images according suggestions below.

Edited by Sadgit

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I think that it is appropriate to call them classes. Here is an excerpt from the rulebook on this (bolded by me):

 

There are three different classes of upgraded Overlord cards; Warlord,
Saboteur, and Magus. Within each class, there are three levels of cards
available to the overlord player (such as “Warlord 1” or “Magus 3”).
Level 1 cards cost one experience point, level 2 cards cost two experience
points, and level 3 cards cost three experience points. Level 1 cards are
always available for the overlord player to purchase. In order to purchase
a level 2 card, the overlord player must first currently have two Level 1
cards of that class in his deck. He must have three cards of a class in his
deck (which can be any combination of Level 1 and Level 2 cards) before
purchasing a level 3 card of that class. Unlike heroes, the overlord may
purchase cards from multiple classes. Universal cards are always available
for purchase.

 

I understand that you might refer to "class" in this context as "category". Thus, maybe I should change the heading to Overlord "classes" instead of "class decks".

Will add the number of cards.

Edited by Sadgit

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Yes, thanks for that! I have already modified the chart in the way that you suggested.

EDIT: Sorry that I did not get your comment properly. Tripwires of written communication, I guess.

Edited by Sadgit

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Glad that you guys like it.

 

Most of the work is actually completed and currently the reference guide is at 76 pages. And yes, it was more or less a full time job for several weeks. In addition to the rules of all available expansions (excluding the co-ops) and RtL, I have integrated more than 350 unofficial FAQ from FFG into the text.

 

At the moment, I am doing proof-reading and modifying smaller things while waiting for FFG to answer a couple of E-mails. Furthermore, Zaltryre offered to open up his private cache of FFG answers to let me get the ones that I have not found on the boards.

Edited by Sadgit

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Sadgit, just to ensure you covered it all, just remembered: "return to game box" diff. from "return to plot deck" (e.g. Deceitful Scribe vs. agent plot card)

 

 

I can't wait to see the final result! Very nice job bud!!

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Sadgit, just to ensure you covered it all, just remembered: "return to game box" diff. from "return to plot deck" (e.g. Deceitful Scribe vs. agent plot card)

 

 

I can't wait to see the final result! Very nice job bud!!

 

I agree on the above point, and want to extend it a bit further.  There are many times within the rules, on cards, etc. that you see the following phrases:

  1. Return to ... X (game box, plot deck, whatever)
  2. Discard ...

I feel the differences of these phrases are not well defined.  Sometimes they seem to be compatible/interchangeable, and sometimes they are distinctly different things.

 

It would be nice if these terms are appropriately addressed and/or defined within the CRRG.

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@ Sadgit: it is the Spiritspeaker, not Spiritcaller. (Overview table)

 

By the way: you may want to list the OL-reward cards in the table as well.

 

Great work! I really appreciate it.

Edited by Chaoticus

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@ Sadgit: it is the Spiritspeaker, not Spiritcaller. (Overview table)

 

By the way: you may want to list the OL-reward cards in the table as well.

 

Great work! I really appreciate it.

Yeah for each H&M pack there comes a reward OL Card, for the sake of completeness ...:).

really you have done an amazing job.

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Thanks for catching that! Will add OL reward cards to the the column and correct "Spiritspeaker" as soon as I am home from a X-mas trip.

@Dommus and any2cards:  have to look up the cards and effects with "discard" and "return" mechanisms. I guess it is worth to add 2 new entries to the reference section of the guide with one giving full details and the other referencing the former.

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Another point to consider is the campaign rule changings (for 2 players at least). Hope there is an entry to explain those.

 

Another thing that just came up is ordering the campaign phases. Any2cards made a document once listing all the phases, very, very usefull. I believe you can export the idea to be included in the CRRG.

 

Sadgit, keep it up! Count with me for further researches!

Edited by Dommus

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@Dommus: Got those points covered. Would be still interested to compare my entry with the one from any2cards. I guess it is linked in the sticky thread?

 

EDIT: Found it and will modify my entries were needed.

Edited by Sadgit

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@Dommus: Got those points covered. Would be still interested to compare my entry with the one from any2cards. I guess it is linked in the sticky thread?

 

EDIT: Found it and will modify my entries were needed.

 

Please note that my Campaign Phase document was written when Shadow Rune was the ONLY choice.  It did take advantage of some rulings from FFG as to when certain steps occurred (especially with the transition from Act I to Act II).

 

It does not, however, address any other changes that may have occurred due to additional campaigns being produced.  I have not updated that document in ages.

 

I would be interested in hearing if there are things that need to be changed/alluded to, etc. due to there being more than one campaign now available.

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Sadgit, just to ensure you covered it all, just remembered: "return to game box" diff. from "return to plot deck" (e.g. Deceitful Scribe vs. agent plot card)

 

 

I can't wait to see the final result! Very nice job bud!!

 

I agree on the above point, and want to extend it a bit further.  There are many times within the rules, on cards, etc. that you see the following phrases:

  1. Return to ... X (game box, plot deck, whatever)
  2. Discard ...

I feel the differences of these phrases are not well defined.  Sometimes they seem to be compatible/interchangeable, and sometimes they are distinctly different things.

 

It would be nice if these terms are appropriately addressed and/or defined within the CRRG.

 

I finally found the time to look into that. That's what I found:

 

- all instances of "discard" in RAW instruct game components to be returned to the corresponding supply (tokens) or deck (cards). It is never used when a component is placed into the game box again.

- "return" on the other hand is always followed by a location where the game component should be put. This can be the supply, the game box, the plot deck etc.

 

Will add entries "Return" and "Discard" to the reference guide.

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I would be interested in hearing if there are things that need to be changed/alluded to, etc. due to there being more than one campaign now available.

 

 

Some comments:

 

Overlord turn summary: Steps 1 and 2 are combined into one single step according to the current errata, Thus, start of turn abilities may be played before drawing a card.

 

Campaign phase: 3. Receive Rewards: When OL uses a Plot deck he receives 1 or 2 threat tokens in this step.

 

Campaign phase: Steps 4 and 5 should be swapped.

 

Campaign phase: 5. Shopping: 5 cards are revealed

 

As far as I see, in addition, rules for Mini campaigns are not integrated but most of the rest is still valid.

Good work, by the way!

Edited by Sadgit

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Overlord turn summary: Steps 1 and 2 are combined into one single step according to the current errata, Thus, start of turn abilities may be played before drawing a card.

 

Ok.  I have read and re-read the current FAQ, looking for anything that makes the above claim.  I cannot find it anywhere.  I obviously am old, and would appreciate it if you can point out to me where in the FAQ the above is stated. 

 

Campaign phase: 3. Receive Rewards: When OL uses a Plot deck he receives 1 or 2 threat tokens in this step.

 

I haven't played with a Plot Deck as of yet.  Is it specified with the Plot deck as to 1 or 2 threat tokens?

 

Campaign phase: 5. Shopping: 5 cards are revealed

 

So the amount of Shop Item cards is now always 5, no matter how many heroes are played?  What expansion / rule set changed this rule? 

 

As far as I see, in addition, rules for Mini campaigns are not integrated

 

My group has never played a mini campaign, and probably never will, so I didn't bother putting that info into the document. I created this because when the base game originally came out (and there was poor to no direction from FFG), we wanted something written down in one place as to the order to do this, so we wouldn't have to read various pieces of manuals to come up with it.

 

It was an immense help when just starting to play.

 

I am looking forward to seeing your completed document.  Quite frankly, it is what FFG probably should have done themselves.

Edited by any2cards

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Answers to your questions:

 

Overlord turn:

It's at the bottom of page 2, left column of the current FAQ pdf.

 

Threat tokens after quest:

The OL receives 1 TT when he lost and 2 TT if he won the quest.

 

Shopping step in campaign phase:

It's at the top of page 1, right column of the current FAQ pdf.

 

I very much like the idea of having a document that shows important information in a sequence which it most likely becomes relevant in the course of a campaign. When I started the reference guide project, I have been discussing different formats with Zaltyre. A format like yours was also discussed. However, as my goal is to create a comprehensive rules document for all aspects the game, I felt it would become very difficult to integrate the wealth of information using a sequential structure and keeping it well organized and tidy. At the moment, topics like Setup, Turn, Campaign phase etc. can be found in the alphabethical glossary part of my guide and a little bit of turning pages is necessary when questions come up during a game session.    

Edited by Sadgit

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(...)

 

I finally found the time to look into that. That's what I found:

 

- all instances of "discard" in RAW instruct game components to be returned to the corresponding supply (tokens) or deck (cards). It is never used when a component is placed into the game box again.

- "return" on the other hand is always followed by a location where the game component should be put. This can be the supply, the game box, the plot deck etc.

 

Will add entries "Return" and "Discard" to the reference guide.

 

 

The trick here is not the "discard" vs. "return". Returning to the plot deck is ok, that means you can pay the threat cost again and effectively have the agent card again. But when you use Deceitful Scribe, you can't get it again to your play area. It is poor worded on the RAW and made me wonder I could be buying the "Deceitful Scribe" again and again, until I got corrected by Zaltyre.

 

I got your point tho, but "return to game box" is usually a one way out.

 

There is at least 1 exception to this rule. In SoN, when  you lose a Corrupt Citizen the game instructs you to "return to game box". It's gone for good. However, there is a quest, "Arise my friends", where you can bring back an owned citizen, previously "returned to game box" to the OL play area once more. 

Edited by Dommus

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Thanks for that. Here are the corresponding entries that I did yesterday. Let me know if any modifications are needed to catch that aspect even better.

 

Discarding A Game Component

  • Text on game components sometimes instructs players to discard cards or tokens.
  • Discarded tokens are returned to their supply; discarded cards are placed on the corresponding discard pile.
  • Discarded components may enter the current game again at a later time point. In contrast, components returned to the game box will not be used again during the quest (in single sessions) or during the campaign (in campaign play) unless explicitely noted otherwise.

Related Topics: Returning A Game Component

 

 

Returning A Game Component

  • Text on game components sometimes instructs players to return cards or tokens to a specific location.
  • Components returned to their corresponding supply or deck may enter the current game again at a later time point. In contrast, components returned to the game box will not be used again during the quest (in single game sessions) or during the campaign (in campaign play) unless explicitely noted otherwise.

Related Topics: Discarding A Game Component

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Answers to your questions:

 

Overlord turn:

It's at the bottom of page 2, left column of the current FAQ pdf.

 

Threat tokens after quest:

The OL receives 1 TT when he lost and 2 TT if he won the quest.

 

Shopping step in campaign phase:

It's at the top of page 1, right column of the current FAQ pdf.

 

I very much like the idea of having a document that shows important information in a sequence which it most likely becomes relevant in the course of a campaign. When I started the reference guide project, I have been discussing different formats with Zaltyre. A format like yours was also discussed. However, as my goal is to create a comprehensive rules document for all aspects the game, I felt it would become very difficult to integrate the wealth of information using a sequential structure and keeping it well organized and tidy. At the moment, topics like Setup, Turn, Campaign phase etc. can be found in the alphabethical glossary part of my guide and a little bit of turning pages is necessary when questions come up during a game session.    

 

Sigh ... I am seriously getting old.

 

Thank you for providing me the references.  It wasn't that I didn't believe you, it was the fact that I was dumbfounded that I couldn't find them myself.  :P

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Shopping step in campaign phase:

It's at the top of page 1, right column of the current FAQ pdf.

 

We have almost always played campaigns with 4 heroes, so when it came to dealing shop item cards, if we followed the original rules (1 card per hero + 1) it amounts to the same as the FAQ ruling of deal 5 cards.

 

Still, I really wonder why they changed this?  In other words, I wonder what perceived flaw and/or balance issue they felt occured if you only dealt say 3 cards for 2 heroes, etc.

 

This is a fairly significant change.

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Well, if you only draw 3 cards, you have a lot more odds of all of them being garbage I guess, compared to 5 cards.

It does give you about 15-20 more possible items while playing a campaign, and I guess the fact the 2 heroes technically should gather less gold should prevent them from buying all options, where as a party of 4 would need to split items among the party.

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