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The Endless Vigil for Endless Vigil is Finished

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I will personally assume they are HP 2 until confirmed otherwise by the devs. Ate they listed as HP 1 in both the chart and the long description?

Yes they are.

 

So am I to understand that if I have the Fear the Shadows talent, and I alone encounter 4 minion groups, I could potentially spend my action every turn for four turns, and assuming I'm successful, end the encounter with all four minion groups fleeing away in every direction by my shear awesomeness?

 

I must have this. Think of the narrative potential...

You could do that, I suppose. There is a bit of GM discretion called out in the description, but doing it your way would be between GM and player.

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Fear the Shadows:

 

The character may perform the Fear the Shadows action. They make a hard Deception check targeting a single minion group or rival within long range. If they succeed, that minion group or rival flees the encounter. At the GM's discretion, these NPCs may not flee due to extenuating circumstances (such as if there is no realistic path or means to leave the encounter, or if the only way to leave the encounter may result in their deaths from a dangerous fall or lethal atmosphere).

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What's the HP cost of these?

 

 

oops... didn't finish.

 

Because there's the one in Keeping the Peace that costs 4, I believe, which affects parry - and gives a nice bonus on combat checks after having parried ...

 

And the weird thing is they only require 1 hard point. I think it's an error. They are a bit more expensive than some crystals, at 12k and 14k, but still cheaper than the Barab ingot, Krayt dragon pearl, the Sapith, and the Sorian, and are rarity 9, do I don't think the cost is a balancing factor here.

 

Agreed, given their power, I am definitely assuming its an error.  Those are two amazing crystals.  My Soresu Defender is drooling over the Etaan.

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Has manipulate been used in any of the movies or TV series?

Yes, during the Pod Race young Anakin has some engine trouble but manages to keep flying. Also if you subscibe to the theory that Han Solo is a Force Sensitive in denial it kinda looks like he is constantly abusing the Manipulate basic power to keep the Millenium Falcon flying

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Huh. That's...a really powerful talent. That's gonna need some dev explanationism, that is...

Well, I think the fact that this is a Conflict talent, so that means a point of Conflict (at the very least) every session, with more Conflict being a possible option based upon situation, since you are using fear and intimidation, which in and of themselves can generate Conflict.  So that's probably a mitigating factor, as well as the GM deciding that based upon situations the talent simply doesn't work in certain situations.

 

Desperate Allies has similar talents (and even Signature Abilities) that could be shut down by GM override, so this isn't a completely foreign concept.

Edited by Donovan Morningfire

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I will personally assume they are HP 2 until confirmed otherwise by the devs. Ate they listed as HP 1 in both the chart and the long description?

Probably a safe assumption.

 

 

The Manipulate Force power section has some cut-and-paste and other editing errors as well so...

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Huh. That's...a really powerful talent. That's gonna need some dev explanationism, that is...

Well, I think the fact that this is a Conflict talent, so each usage means a point of Conflict (at the very least), with more Conflict being a possible option based upon situation, since you are using fear and intimidation.  So that's probably a mitigating factor, as well as the GM deciding that based upon situations the talent simply doesn't work in certain situations.

 

Desperate Allies has similar talents (and even Signature Abilities) that could be shut down by GM override, so this isn't a completely foreign concept.

Conflict Talents provide a single point of Conflict at the beginning of every session, their use is the subject to the normal rules of gaining Conflict. So certainly you could gain Conflict by using them, but it could be much more than 1 point. A crafty player may find ways to use it without gaining Conflict too though

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Personally I'd just increase the difficulty and/or add setback dice if a player tried using it over and over again during the same encounter. Makes sense that it would lose some potency the more people see others exposed to it.

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Yeah, I realized that just after I'd posted about Conflict talents, and amended my earlier post.

 

Still, that you're getting at least 1 point of Conflict every session just for having that talent, on top of more potential Conflict for using fear/intimidation, that was probably considered a balancing factor with the talent, on top of the GM having written-in approval to deny usage of it under certain circumstances.

 

And no, I would not let a player weasel out of the Conflict from having or even using this talent.

Edited by Donovan Morningfire

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While adding Setbacks for certain targets would make sense, I don't feel the threat of Conflict should really be used as a deterrent, at least not to this degree. After all, this game is designed so that playing a Darksider is a viable option, so to those characters the Conflict is irrelevant.

Fear the Shadows could be used to effectively deal 20+ Wounds with a single Hard check, and as written can be used repeatedly without detriment. Unless you're facing a Nemesis or someone with a lot of Nobody's Fool, why would you make combat checks if you have this talent?

Edited by Absol197

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Yeah - I'd say that Fear the Shadows may be missing a "Once per Encounter" limitation.

For characters who have fallen to the dark side or want to they have a single Talent that allows them to make a Hard check to eliminate a minion or Rival every round at long range.

And if you have a character that doesn't want to fall to the dark side, they can pretty easily select key tough encounters to just use this Talent every round and if they roll poorly they might lose some Morality.

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That and droids actually still flat out ignore any mind affecting force powers; you can do whatever you like to a droid but tricking them is not one. Heheh.

 

I understand though, it seems at the moment that Force users seem to be able to go just that little bit further in everything but ultimately pay a price for doing so. A droid tech will probably finish his progression long before the force senstive ultimately reaches his capstone. That and I've noticed that force users tend to recieve powerful abilities naturally.

 

Deadly Accuary for combatants (FS have no way of getting this without diving into another set of rules.)
Improved unrelenting skeptic.

Unmatched coodination.

Appresors eye

Gamblers dice rerolling.

Sig abilities.

 

That and even in regards of the lore, Force characters are generally more capable then none force sensitives, especially in martial skills. However as we all know there is plenty of room for characters to shine otherwise. Han Solo might have been out of his depth but as a pilot he was certainly a cut above most. Generally non-force characters "get good" much quicker due to a purity of purpose. Force characters might eventually surpass them but that takes a long time and more EXP. Like for example I imagine force senstive pilots are mega expensive for a fairly small gain.

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While adding Setbacks for certain targets would make sense, I don't feel the threat of Conflict should really be used as a deterrent, at least not to this degree. After all, this game is designed so that playing a Darksider is a viable option, so to those characters the Conflict is irrelevant.

Fear the Shadows could be used to effectively deal 20+ Wounds with a single Hard check, and as written can be used repeatedly without detriment. Unless you're facing a Nemesis or someone with a lot of Nobody's Fool, why would you make combat checks if you have this talent?

I see the Conflict cost as less a deterrent and more of a built-in cost of having that ability, much like paying strain is a built-in cost of various defensive talents.

 

"Okay, you want to pull a Batman and scare the crap out of a bunch of mooks?  Sure, you can do that, but you'll have to accept some Conflict for that privilege."

 

Given that being a Light Side Paragon is generally more beneficial in terms of mechanics than being a Dark Sider, having a talent that gives you one assured point of Conflict each session is a minor determent, especially in games where the GM uses an alternate method of Conflict/Morality resolution, such as a smaller die type or only rolling at the end of an adventure instead of at the end of every session.

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I think its great there are more "Mechanical" ways to gain Conflict. There are too many players avoiding Conflict where this system is supposed to offer reasons for being Dark. Its so awesome that a PC can be doing bad things for good reasons, or good for bad... or bad for bad! I think many players, by refusing to walk the line, really miss out on some of the awesome potential this system offers.

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I think its great there are more "Mechanical" ways to gain Conflict. There are too many players avoiding Conflict where this system is supposed to offer reasons for being Dark. Its so awesome that a PC can be doing bad things for good reasons, or good for bad... or bad for bad! I think many players, by refusing to walk the line, really miss out on some of the awesome potential this system offers.

I personally think that many people overlook the conflict cost od using Dark Side pips. While the cost is listed as being 1 per pip, this is if you are using the power for thw "Greater Good", so if you are using it for selfish or nefarious reasons the you are supposed to add up to an additional 1-5 points per pip. So using a power to save yourself could cost 2 or 3 points per pip, and using it to attack unprovoked could cost you 6 per pip. So as an example using move for an attack unprovoked and rolling 2 Dark Side pips could cost as much as 12 points conflict, not counting the actual act itself. So in this situation if you killed a stormtrooper with move as a first resort would be an immediate 22 conflict.

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What's the HP cost of these?

 

 

oops... didn't finish.

 

Because there's the one in Keeping the Peace that costs 4, I believe, which affects parry - and gives a nice bonus on combat checks after having parried ...

 

And the weird thing is they only require 1 hard point. I think it's an error. They are a bit more expensive than some crystals, at 12k and 14k, but still cheaper than the Barab ingot, Krayt dragon pearl, the Sapith, and the Sorian, and are rarity 9, do I don't think the cost is a balancing factor here.

 

 

The crystals were one of the things I did, and it is an error, for which I sincerely apologize. I hope everyone enjoys the book, though!

 

Edit for clarification: I intended the crystals to have the same hard point cost as other crystals, so they should be 2 each. However, I'm not a dev and wasn't involved with any post-playtest elements, so I can't speak for the "official" ruling on what they should be--it could actually be 1, could be 2, could be something else entirely.

Edited by RocketPropelledGrenade

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