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Benjan Meruna

Newbie question: Major Rhymer

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So, as a nearly complete beginner to Armada, I noticed some discussion that asserted Major Rhymer as the best unique squadron.  Curious, I went to look him up, and saw he was the TIE bomber unique that allows your other bombers to hit out from farther.  For Rebels, this would probably be huge, but I'm not sure why Imperials would see him as the best unique squadron.  As I understand Imperials rarely rely on bomber-heavy setups, tending to use fighters more for local superiority.  What did I miss?

 

Also, while I'm asking, are there any good general Armada strategy guides that people recommend?

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So, as a nearly complete beginner to Armada, I noticed some discussion that asserted Major Rhymer as the best unique squadron.  Curious, I went to look him up, and saw he was the TIE bomber unique that allows your other bombers to hit out from farther.  For Rebels, this would probably be huge, but I'm not sure why Imperials would see him as the best unique squadron.  As I understand Imperials rarely rely on bomber-heavy setups, tending to use fighters more for local superiority.  What did I miss?

 

Also, while I'm asking, are there any good general Armada strategy guides that people recommend?

Try making a little ball of bombers around Rhymer, then measure his threat range. Speed 4 + medium range.

That's the base. Now add in stuff like rogue bombers and boosted comms.

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the reason he is the best is he can threaten a large area of the playing field without any carrier support, can just park him and squadrons that take your fancy in the hot area and just fire at battered ships in the squadron phase, however with carrier support of flown with firespray rogues his strike range is tremendous, easily capable of killing a small ship in one pass from halfway across the board with no repercussions.

 

also harder to stop than conventional bombers, if you are under gunned in the squadron phase you could always park your squadrons just in front of your ships to prevent bombing runs until they are taken down, rhymer doesnt care for such nonsense

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Also Tie bombers are cheap so it is easy to get a significant number of them in a fleet. Also take into account the ultimate fire ball of Boba Fett, 4 firesprays, Rhymer, and Dengar. In an attack that's 9 blue and 2 black coming at one hull zone. That's more dice then any single captial ship arc can throw. If you use tie bombers instead that is 10 black and 1 blue for a potential 21 damage at a single arc from medium range.

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SO, what I'm getting here is that Imperial lists generally don't run bombers, unless it's with Rhymer, then Imperial bombers lists are awesome ;)

 

That may or may not be true, depending on the individual player.

 

To get back to you original question/post, though, here is what is NOT true: any notion that the Imperials don't need to use bombers because <big powerful ships>

 

While Imps have some very strong ships, they have also (traditionally/on average) had a problem catching Rebels. This is not always, true, of course, but what I'm trying to say is that if you just throw down 2 Christmas Trees (Christmas Tree = Imperial Star Destroyer loaded up with all kinds of upgrades and goodies) and expect to steamroll everything in your path, you're sadly mistaken.  A decent rebel commander will out-deploy you, out-activate you, and, probably, out-maneuver you.  You'll rarely get your big powerful front guns on target, and rarely on the target that you want (you're opponent will make sure, if he has to take such a shot, that he's taking that shot with Admonition filled up on defensive upgrades like ECM and Walex or Lando,)  Thus, in order to hunt down fast moving rebels, who are not going to play you're (stand toe-to-toe with the ISD!) game, Bombers become an important tool in your toolchest for helping you win. Disregard them at your peril.

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SO, what I'm getting here is that Imperial lists generally don't run bombers, unless it's with Rhymer, then Imperial bombers lists are awesome ;)

incorrect but most imperials add Rhymer because he adds a great deal of flexibility to your bombers.

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SO, what I'm getting here is that Imperial lists generally don't run bombers, unless it's with Rhymer, then Imperial bombers lists are awesome ;)

incorrect but most imperials add Rhymer because he adds a great deal of flexibility to your bombers.

 

 

To add to this: Rhymer is awesome, but he's certainly not the only way to run your bombers. Imperial Tie Bombers are cheap, fast, and hearty. Ie, they are good.  They are cheap enough that you could easily run 2 separate tie swarms and send them off in different directions (imagine 3 bombers, with an advanced escort, and a couple of Tie fighters for chaff.  That's 55 pts, x2, still leaves you some room for a big named dude like vader or fel or bossk.

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SO, what I'm getting here is that Imperial lists generally don't run bombers, unless it's with Rhymer, then Imperial bombers lists are awesome ;)

 

True. At a tournament, you won't see TIE Bombers without Rhymer. It just won't happen. Rhymer won't automatically win games for you, but he's so good that if you leave him out of a bomber complement then you are just plain wrong. There simply is no choice presented, except the choice of an intentionally inferior list. My biggest hope for the Corellian Conflict is that it introduces an Imperial bomber squadron that can form a new archetype, powerful enough to be an appealing option, but mechanically incompatible with Rhymer so that it incentivizes at least some lists to leave Rhymer at home. Just for a change of pace.

 

Schmitty collected data on fleet compositions at last year's Regional tournaments. Rhymerballs (groups of Imperial squadrons surrounding Major Rhymer) accounted for 37% of all Regional winners. Not just Imperial winners, all winners.

 

Among Imperial squadron archetypes that have any real representation in the meta, there are three routes: 1) Rhymer consistently wins games and tournaments. 2) Imperial super friends is a component of some good lists, though it's not what the list is built around. 3) Throwaway TIE tarpits that delay enemy squadrons for a round or two.

Edited by pasewi

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SO, what I'm getting here is that Imperial lists generally don't run bombers, unless it's with Rhymer, then Imperial bombers lists are awesome ;)

True. At a tournament, you won't see TIE Bombers without Rhymer. It just won't happen. Rhymer won't automatically win games for you, but he's so good that if you leave him out of a bomber complement then you are just plain wrong. There simply is no choice presented, except the choice of an intentionally inferior list. My biggest hope for the Corellian Conflict is that it introduces an Imperial bomber squadron that can form a new archetype, powerful enough to be an appealing option, but mechanically incompatible with Rhymer so that it incentivizes at least some lists to leave Rhymer at home. Just for a change of pace.

Schmitty collected data on fleet compositions at last year's Regional tournaments. Rhymerballs (groups of Imperial squadrons surrounding Major Rhymer) accounted for 37% of all Regional winners. Not just Imperial winners, all winners.

Among Imperial squadron archetypes that have any real representation in the meta, there are three routes: 1) Rhymer consistently wins games and tournaments. 2) Imperial super friends is a component of some good lists, though it's not what the list is built around. 3) Throwaway TIE tarpits that delay enemy squadrons for a round or two.

Re corcon bomber squadron: Friendly Bombers at distance 1 gain one blue dice when attacking an enemy ship at range 1? Edited by Madaghmire

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"As long as your list does not include Major Rhymer, friendly squadrons within distance 1 increase their battery armament by three black dice."

 

Boom. Done.

 

But seriously, Jun Sato lets ships attack better when they surround their target with fighters. Maybe an Imperial ace says "After a friendly ship attacks a ship within distance 1 of this squadron and this squadron has not yet activated, choose and activate a number of squadrons within distance 1, including this one."

 

So, Shmajor Shmymer sits next to a CR90, unactivated. An ISD activates and fires at it. When that attack finishes, Shmajor Shmymer and three other squadrons surrounding him immediately get to move and do stuff.

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Re corcon bomber squadron: Friendly Bombers at distance 1 gain one blue dice when attacking an enemy ship at range 1?

As long as its plus 30pts... thats obscene

Maybe just a reroll at distance 1? Wanna do something strong enough that it competes with rhymer without synergizing, right?

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True. At a tournament, you won't see TIE Bombers without Rhymer. It just won't happen. Rhymer won't automatically win games for you, but he's so good that if you leave him out of a bomber complement then you are just plain wrong. There simply is no choice presented, except the choice of an intentionally inferior list.

I strongly disagree with the bottom that running any kind of Bombers without Rhymer is either playing wrong or intentionally inferior.

Having played without Rhymer many times I've used non-Rhymer Bombers reasonably successfully (I'm by no means an exceptional player) and the inclusion of Rhymer would have constituted an unacceptable change in the make up of the list: either by significantly reducing the Bomber continent, and thus making it not nearly effective enough for its intended purpose; by reducing my Fighter element and making the Bombers far easier to isolate and destroy; or by creating weaknesses in my capital ships that would similarly alter the design of the fleet to the point that such a change would require an entire rewrite and create a wholly different list.

Rhymer is an exceptional piece, not denying that, but he is far from the only viable method of using Bombers in Imperial lists. At 16pts he is incredibly useful, but does constitute an investment into a specific type of squadron building, which then generally informs how that fleet is going to operate.

By not using Rhymer, you choose to operate within different parameters and thus choose to use different, but equally useable strategies/tactics.

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True. At a tournament, you won't see TIE Bombers without Rhymer. It just won't happen. Rhymer won't automatically win games for you, but he's so good that if you leave him out of a bomber complement then you are just plain wrong. There simply is no choice presented, except the choice of an intentionally inferior list.

I strongly disagree with the bottom that running any kind of Bombers without Rhymer is either playing wrong or intentionally inferior.

Having played without Rhymer many times I've used non-Rhymer Bombers reasonably successfully (I'm by no means an exceptional player) and the inclusion of Rhymer would have constituted an unacceptable change in the make up of the list: either by significantly reducing the Bomber continent, and thus making it not nearly effective enough for its intended purpose; by reducing my Fighter element and making the Bombers far easier to isolate and destroy; or by creating weaknesses in my capital ships that would similarly alter the design of the fleet to the point that such a change would require an entire rewrite and create a wholly different list.

Rhymer is an exceptional piece, not denying that, but he is far from the only viable method of using Bombers in Imperial lists. At 16pts he is incredibly useful, but does constitute an investment into a specific type of squadron building, which then generally informs how that fleet is going to operate.

By not using Rhymer, you choose to operate within different parameters and thus choose to use different, but equally useable strategies/tactics.

 

 

I agree. Rhymer is great but he's not the ONLY acceptable usage of bombers.

 

The "problem" with Rhymer is that he almost forces you to cluster all your bombers around him. Then, to protect that "ball" of bombers, you end up having to include Vader, Fell, and in order to not keep them pinned, you usually include Dengar.  It gets very expensive very quickly, and it also tends to cluster as one big ball.

 

By not including Rhymer you can spread out and form different task forces.

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I for one would be perfectly happy with my opponent not taking rhymer. Guys a real pain. Yeah it's a lot of points and a majority of your squadrons are going to be in a little ball, but it's terribly effective and versatile. Best of all it doesn't require squadron commands if you move them right so your death triangles can focus on what they do best without babysitting your squadrons.

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Haha, thanks!  I'm glad to see there's so much potential variety!  It's mostly just me and the wife playing against each other (she's the dirty Rebel), we have the core set right now with an ISD, Assault frig, and squadron expansions for both sides on the way!  It's going to be a blast.

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Haha, thanks!  I'm glad to see there's so much potential variety!  It's mostly just me and the wife playing against each other (she's the dirty Rebel), we have the core set right now with an ISD, Assault frig, and squadron expansions for both sides on the way!  It's going to be a blast.

 

Your wife plays Armada with you? Please let me know if you ever get divorced.

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Haha, thanks!  I'm glad to see there's so much potential variety!  It's mostly just me and the wife playing against each other (she's the dirty Rebel), we have the core set right now with an ISD, Assault frig, and squadron expansions for both sides on the way!  It's going to be a blast.

 

Your wife plays Armada with you? Please let me know if you ever get divorced.

 

 

My wife plays StarCraft the board game, Pandemic and has even played bits of Warhammer Fantasy with me in the past. 

 

Armada? 

 

Guess I'll be satisfied with Pandemic and SC. :)

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@Benjan : Don't listen to anyone saying that X or Y is the "best" squadron. Use critical thinking!

 

Is Major Rhymer good? Definitely! Is he the best? How do you define best? What criteria do you use to measure what is good with squadrons or not? Are these criteria absolutely better when it comes to determining which is the best?

 

Major Rhymer is definitely a big bonus on your Bombers/Advanced/Firesprays, but he's also a big trap. Like people mentionned, usually opponent clump up around the Rhymer, in "balls". In terms of counters, this is pretty easy to deal with to pin the enemy fighters down, even with Intel squadrons.

There are squadron strategies that make the enemy need 3 Intel squadrons to free every squadrons engaged in the Rhymer ball. You basically play with the short distance 1 of the Intel.

 

Overall good choice, he provides some great options for your squadrons, but he's not the be all end all of squadron warfare.

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Normally squadrons have a range of 7.6cm

 

Major Rhymer changes that to 18cm

 

It is a massive increase, and one of the often overlooked benefits is, usually squadrons without Rogue need activating by a ship to be able to shoot at a ship, as quite often a ship has the capability to move out of range. So it is very difficult to place squadrons to attack ships without needing to use a squadron command. Rhymer allows you to place them in a position where they might not need activating for several rounds, leaving your ships to use other commands.

 

Combine this with Objectives that force your opponent to be at a specific point on the game board and it means you won't have to use squadron commands to get in ship attacks, he has a game changing mechanic. And you can put him with anything that has black ship dice and cause a ton of damage, he does not need to be sat surrounded by bombers.

 

Not sure I buy this argument of having all your bombers in one area is a detriment, you want them together for sustained damage on the same target. And yes it means your opponents squadrons can tie you down easily, the flip side is, his squadrons have to be some where to tie you down, allowing you to position ships or other squadrons to kill them, and Tie bombers get a single dice for anti squadron, the best damage dealing dice in game, meaning if you have 10 bombers, and someone placed 2/3 squadrons to tie them up it won't take long at all to kill them, even aces.

 

You can take Vader, IG-88, Dengar, Rhymer & 4 Tie Advanced for 127pts which is going to be a nightmare for your opponents squadrons to deal with, and can throw 8 black dice a round at ships at medium range.

 

Rhymer is probably the most powerful single Imperial unit.

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