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00Agent

Imp Kath and attack flowchart

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The attack timing flowchart in the latest FAQ says this in box 7:

 

 

7. "Deal Damage" step

i. Remove shield tokens to cancel [hit] results.

ii. Remove shield tokens to cancel [crit] results.

 

According to the chart, shield tokens work by cancelling results. Now here's Imperial Kath Scarlet's pilot ability:

 

 

When attacking, the defender receives 1 stress token if he cancels at least 1 [crit] result.

 

Does this mean that if the target takes a crit on his shield, Kath Scarlet's ability triggers? Or is the flowchart text misleading, and shield tokens don't technically cancel results?

Edited by 00Agent

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The flow chart text is misleading, for my money.

 

The dice results are only cancelled for Kath's ability during the Compare Results step.  I suspect that had she been written in the last couple of waves, it would actually have said that in her ability.

 

I'd send a rules query to FFG on this one though, maybe they might put an FAQ in for it.  I'm dubious though; there are really not that many people *using* Imp Kath...

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The attack timing flowchart in the latest FAQ says this in box 7:

 

 

7. "Deal Damage" step

i. Remove shield tokens to cancel [hit] results.

ii. Remove shield tokens to cancel [crit] results.

 

According to the chart, shield tokens work by cancelling results. Now here's Imperial Kath Scarlet's pilot ability:

 

 

When attacking, the defender receives 1 stress token if he cancels at least 1 [crit] result.

 

Does this mean that if the target takes a crit on his shield, Kath Scarlet's ability triggers? Or is the flowchart text misleading, and shield tokens don't technically cancel results?

The text on the chart is actually quite misleading. Kath's results are cancelled during the "Compare Results" step, not in the "Deal Damage" step. You remove shield tokens to suffer damage from uncanceled <hit> or <crit> results. Shield tokens don't cancel results.

 

 

6. Compare Results: For each <evade> result, the defender cancels one <hit> or <crit> result. All <hit> results must be canceled before any <crit> results may be canceled. If at least one <hit> or <crit> result remains uncanceled, the defender is hit by the attack; otherwise, the attack misses.

7. Deal Damage: If the defender was hit, it suffers one damage for each uncanceled <hit> result and one critical damage for each uncanceled <crit> result. All damage must be suffered before any critical damage may be suffered.

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I can't say if it is intended, but with the new FAQ wording, I think it is necessary to RAW until FFG says otherwise.  Cancel it is.

 

I'd prefer to stick to RAW on the actual written rules and not a flowchart that is choosing wording for brevity.

Canceling damage with shield tokens is a fairly major change.

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I can't say if it is intended, but with the new FAQ wording, I think it is necessary to RAW until FFG says otherwise.  Cancel it is.

 

I'd prefer to stick to RAW on the actual written rules and not a flowchart that is choosing wording for brevity.

Canceling damage with shield tokens is a fairly major change.

I agree.

Common sense is on your side as well.

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I can't say if it is intended, but with the new FAQ wording, I think it is necessary to RAW until FFG says otherwise.  Cancel it is.

 

I'd prefer to stick to RAW on the actual written rules and not a flowchart that is choosing wording for brevity.

Canceling damage with shield tokens is a fairly major change.

I agree.

Common sense is on your side as well.

Now don't go bringing common sense into this game. We all know that it's not welcome around here.

;)

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8 hours ago, Tbetts94 said:

Did we ever get an official answer on this?

Your safest option is to go by the rulebook where dice results are only cancelled in the Compare Results step, and the ship suffers the damage in the Deal Damage step.

Nowhere in the rules does it state that shields cancel dice results. When a ship suffers a damage or critical damage, it loses one shield token.

Therefore, Imperial Kath should normally trigger in the Compare Results step, and not in the Deal Damage step.

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On 20/01/2018 at 7:37 AM, skotothalamos said:

If shields cancel hits and crits, then it’s going to be really hard to get uncanceled crits in with Harpoons or Kylo Ren against a ship with shields. 

It would make no difference whatsoever. Harpoon would trigger off the uncancelled result when the hit was called and Kylo Ren will trigger when critical damage is suffered, regardless of whether the damaging crit is considered cancelled or not.

On 19/01/2018 at 12:44 AM, Parravon said:

Your safest option is to go by the rulebook where dice results are only cancelled in the Compare Results step, and the ship suffers the damage in the Deal Damage step.

It's even safer to quote it for them, Parravon :)
 

Quote

7. Deal Damage:

If the defender was hit, it suffers one damage for each uncanceled [Hit] result and one critical damage for each uncanceled {Crit] result. All damage must be suffered before any critical damage may be suffered.

 

 

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Why don't you bickering peeps stop playing the game all together....

If your sole purpose in this game is to find a way to outclass your opponent with "word content".... stop playing

you spend more time in trying to find a verbal conflict then you actually do in playing.... or you are tired off playing and looking for trouble...

 

"cancel" chart when it comes to the damage window refers to one thing....

-you have 5 damage, every -1 damage step, however it resolves, is a VERBAL "1 cancelled result". And this has nothing to do with the defender's activety.

- the defender can only cancel results by ROLLING DEFENCE DICE.... evade or spending an evade token...

STOP OVERTHINKING

 

Edited by D34d guru

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1 hour ago, D34d guru said:

Why don't you bickering peeps stop playing the game all together....

I don't see any bickering. Stop projecting.

1 hour ago, D34d guru said:

STOP OVERTHINKING

STOP TYPING IN CAPS.

 

Seriously, some people seem to come here just to be combative :P

Edited by InquisitorM

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1 hour ago, InquisitorM said:

I don't see any bickering. Stop projecting.

STOP TYPING IN CAPS.

 

Seriously, some people seem to come here just to be combative :P

Combative? All i see is that a lot off ppl i know won't start playing the game or are leaving the game because there is a small croud that specializes in making all deliberatly difficult and nearly impossible to comprehend. After visiting this part of the forae they are gone.

Is that the purpose of "competitive" play?

 

Edited by D34d guru

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5 hours ago, D34d guru said:

All i see is that a lot off ppl i know won't start playing the game or are leaving the game because there is a small croud that specializes in making all deliberatly difficult and nearly impossible to comprehend.

So you decided to elbow in and make a perfectly reasonable discussion toxic?

Fantastic way to make things better. I applaud. Like, golf clap.

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4 minutes ago, InquisitorM said:

So you decided to elbow in and make a perfectly reasonable discussion toxic?

Fantastic way to make things better. I applaud. Like, golf clap.

You call the usage of the word cancel a reasonable discussion?

I Stab at thee.... Lol?

Ok ok. I get it. 

 

Anyways. My explenation concerningen this topic has been written and it is the correct explenation. So end of this thread. 

 

Greetings

 

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3 hours ago, D34d guru said:

You call the usage of the word cancel a reasonable discussion?

I Stab at thee.... Lol?

Ok ok. I get it. 

 

Anyways. My explenation concerningen this topic has been written and it is the correct explenation. So end of this thread. 

 

Greetings

 

Man I have seen you go into a lot of different threads being exasperated at people for trying to figure out how certain rules should interact. If you're not interested in the discussion, then don't participate. There's no reason to go in being combative and acting superior, you're not actually adding anything to the conversation that way. The way the rules are officially interpreted is important to a lot of players, especially on the competitive scene, so don't mock them for trying to make sure they have it straight before they go to a tournament they paid money to participate in. And even if they're only interested in rules lawyering and not playing in tournament, then this is the place where they are supposed to do that, that is what it's for. If you're not interested in that, then that's perfectly fine! The Rules Questions forum isn't for you, no big deal.

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6 minutes ago, nexttwelveexits said:

Man I have seen you go into a lot of different threads being exasperated at people for trying to figure out how certain rules should interact. If you're not interested in the discussion, then don't participate. There's no reason to go in being combative and acting superior, you're not actually adding anything to the conversation that way. The way the rules are officially interpreted is important to a lot of players, especially on the competitive scene, so don't mock them for trying to make sure they have it straight before they go to a tournament they paid money to participate in. And even if they're only interested in rules lawyering and not playing in tournament, then this is the place where they are supposed to do that, that is what it's for. If you're not interested in that, then that's perfectly fine! The Rules Questions forum isn't for you, no big deal.

Ur Wright.... Problems solved

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