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RIP Talonbane Cobra?

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Why would anyone ever take Talonbane now that Fenn Rau is here? A better ship(debatable, as the Khirax has a shield, but the extra evade on the Fang should make up for that over the course of a game) a most likely better dial, and an as good pilot ability all for the exact same point cost makes Fenn Rau way better in my opinion. What do you guys think?

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Why either/or?

Why not both?

Enough of the tunnel vision already people, think outside the box.

 

its cobra, there's not much room to be able to think anywhere. All the guy does is roll dice (and specifically with/against primary weapons, so he can't even vary things up with that missile slot very well), unless you're somehow fond of feedback on him

 

the Special-K overall has merit over the Fang and vice versa, but Cobra is just bleh

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Little late to be mourning Talonbane Cobra.

 

Talonbane was D.O.A.

 

beat me to it

 

Talonbane arrived a corpse

 

and that which is dead cannot exactly die again

 

unless you're from Mad Max, and Cobra is from GI Joe

 

(the more you know...)

 

 

And knowing is half the battle. . . .

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Fenn Rau didn't kill Talonbane, Terry did.

 

I was going to fly Talonbane and Fenn, but not it's gonna be Fenn and Terry and I'm not quite ready to go all in on a 13hp list for all 3  :P

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Talonbane's still PS9. That's never going to be completely meaningless. Vectored thrusters might help him somewhat as well.

I could definitely see a niche role for him in a sort of scum aces builds. Someone mentioned Manaroo as a decent, Palpish support ship for scum, you could imagine something like this:

Talonbane Cobra (28)

Fearlessness (1)

Vectored Thrusters (2)

Fenn Rau (28)

Push the Limit (3)

Autothrusters (2)

Concord Dawn Protector (1)

Manaroo (27)

Lone Wolf (2)

K4 Security Droid (3)

Unhinged Astromech (1)

Total: 98

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Talonbane in this scenario just had to get in up close and throw six dice at the opponent. Manaroo makes sure those dice are modified, and while the enemy is focused on Talonbane, Fenn is flanking and arc dodging like Soontir. And if you're willing to run the list without an unit bid, you can even strap a deadman switch onto Talonbane, making him even more devastating at range 1, or switch out his thrusters for EU.

Another possibility is the high PS Alpha strike. I just flew a rebel version to decent effect tonight(admittedly at PS10, rather than 9 with a bid), but the combination of a killer first strike and high PS repositioning to follow up with is nothing to sneeze at:

Talonbane Cobra (28)

Expert Handling (2)

Concussion Missiles (4)

Inertial Dampeners (1)

Guidance Chips (0)

Fenn Rau (28)

Push the Limit (3)

Proton Torpedoes (4)

Autothrusters (2)

Concord Dawn Protector (1)

N'Dru Suhlak (17)

Veteran Instincts (1)

Homing Missiles (5)

Glitterstim (2)

Guidance Chips (0)

Total: 98

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

There's no real question: Fenn Rau is the better option when you have to choose between the two scum small base PS9s. But Talonbane might still have a place in very specific squads, especially when he's flying along with his new PS9 buddy.

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Fenn Rau can get six hits at range 1.

 

3+1 for range 1, +1 hit from fearless, +1 from his ability. And then 5 evades at range 1 as well. 3+1 evade from title +1 from ability.

 

This is like, the only actually really good ship we've seen so far from Wave 9. It's leagues ahead of both the ARC and the TIE/SF. 

 

The amount of stupid this is boggles my mind. It's actually aggravating. This ship will do more over the course of 1 game than the ARC-170 ever could, and it costs less. And it's pilots are better too. Why need astromech and crew when you just have everything you need already? At a high agility value with circular modifiers. Get within Range 1? Here, have a free hit result, a free evade result, and a free extra die when attacking and defending. All you gotta do is be at range 1 in their arc. The risk of getting into range 1 is that you can get hurt really easily. This risk is eliminated with it's 1 point title with no downsides, and the 1 point SCUM ONLY EPT(because why give other factions such a good EPT?) gives you a free hit when doing what that craft already does. It's cheap, effective, easy modifiers.

Meanwhile over with the ARC-170, Norra has to get both a target lock and a focus at the same time to get a one time use out of her ability(because once either one of those modifiers is gone there's nothing you can do with Norra's ability). Norra's ability forces you to build a list around her, because if you don't then you're really not getting any of the points back from it. The R3 astro forces you to gimp your primary weapon ONLY attack, is useless at low PS, and is 2 points. Rau's ability works whenever he's at range 1 of something, no question's asked. Shara throws away modifiers at 28 points base. Braylen works on RNG. The only actually good thing we've seen from the ARC-170 is the title. 

 

How is this fair? FFG seems to be laboring under the assumption that arc-dodger type ships need to be REALLY REALLY GOOD to an insane degree for some reason, possibly to "Compensate for it's inherent flaws" or something, but that ships(like the ARC-170) are inherently too good and need to be debuffed pre-release. Which is the opposite of what the meta is like. The Protectorate starfighter is the next ship that people will be calling a nerf for, i'm predicting it now. It's coming into a meta that could not be more suited to it. The ARC-170 won't necessarily be DOA, but it's not gonna be healthy, that's for sure. There's no reason to run it when something like the Protectorate exists. You managed to line up a range 1 shot on Rau with Norra and actually have the focus+TL on him? You managed to get 4 hits? Cool, well, Rau dodged 1 automatically, and he's still rolling 4 defense dice with a focus after that, so chances are you're gonna miss. And why does that happen, you ask? Because it has boost and barrel roll, and the ARC doesnt. And it's higher PS than Norra, as well. So it's gonna effortlessly dictate the terms of the engagement, because ships with repositioning are inherently better than those that do not have them. In a positioning based game, that is the way it works. 

 

Protectorate Starfighter: Invalidating ships, even ones that aren't out yet, since 2016.

Edited by Razgriz25thinf

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Talonbane was fairly DOA, so sure, RIP. He suffers from the same weaknesses (lacks repositioning and action economy, as well as having a huge target on his back) as Wedge, Wes, and any X-Wing elite, only with even fewer options for keeping him alive. Fenn Rau is much better, though how much he will succeed will depend GREATLY on his dial, once known.

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Kihraxz's in general are DOA. They would have been a strong ship in Wave 2, but the power creep has done them in. Even if you fly them perfectly, they just don't have the raw efficiency to out-shoot current tournament lists.

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I don't think enough people gave the Kihraxz a chance, to be honest.  I've been flying it lately and it's been working out great for me.  Sure, it wasn't top tables blah blah blah....but it wasn't a bad ship to fly in a list, especially a cheap generic.

 

Vector Thrusters can give it the Barrel Roll it needed and I was looking forward to Fearlessness perhaps giving it a new life.  

 

I don't think anyone would want to take a cheap generic Kihraxz Fighter anymore.  The Fang Fighter just does it better in almost every way for about the same points.  

 

I can see Cobra being taken for the PS 9 aspect.

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I'm not sure if it was brought up elsewhere but in the article it mentions 6 green maneuvers. And if it's like the tie interceptor and the tie fo that could most likely be all 2 green maneuvers except for the talon roll obviously and the 3 forward?

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My only hope is that maybe FFG is pricing the Fang and Rau in particular to replace the Khirax and Cobra in particular as Scums mid points fighter and that Scum veterans will catapult Cobra and the Khirax into the "super awesome high points fighter"

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