Madine + Nav Teams

[JJs Juggernaut 1,843]

I'm in the boat that Madine does stack. I can see it both ways, but that's the way I initally read the card and the arguments against it aren't definitive enough for me to change. It's poor wording that is causing this issue, as it can be read mutiple ways with the two different meanings. I hope they FAQ it soon. I don't think its out of the realm of sense for Madine to stack either. Ozzel is 20 points for extra speed on dials and tokens, Madine is 30 for extra click on dials and extra speed or click on token.

Edited July 12, 2016 by JJs Juggernaut

[Drasnighta 26,832]

It won't be FAQ'd soon.

As per standard FFG Procedure, it won't be discussed until 30 days have passed from Release.

[JJs Juggernaut 1,843]

It won't be FAQ'd soon.

As per standard FFG Procedure, it won't be discussed until 30 days have passed from Release.

 

well "soon" is relative

Edited July 12, 2016 by JJs Juggernaut

[Ginkapo 9,321]

On what ship is anyone thinking they need nav teams as well as Madine?

 

Or is this one of those rules questions where you all seem to just enjoy being anal for the sake of it?

[Drasnighta 26,832]

As has been mentioned, really - this is for:

Liberty at Speed 3  (To get II II II)

 

Nebulon B at Speed 3 (To get II II II)

 

Corvette at Speed 3 or 4. (To get Maximumage Burnout-Donuts, or something...  I don't know, I don't use Corvettes....)

[Amanal 2,557]

Corvette at Speed 3 or 4. (To get Maximumage Burnout-Donuts, or something...  I don't know, I don't use Corvettes....)

 

They'll confiscate ya ride ya bogun hoon.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Come on, mate!  Give a go!  I've got two goon bags and a case of durries in the boot!

[Captain ICT 151]

I think that due to the wording that Eastern King is correct, and agree with JJ they do stack. However, I don't believe that was the intent. So I expect the FAQ to clarify that whenever wave 4 gets updated.

 

The problem is that it doesn't replace the token's effect, as a nav team does. It says if you spent a token, do this. There's no replacement, so it's an additional effect as it exists now.

 

I'd expect that FAQ entry to be similar to Mon Mothma's ruling. (It can't be the same, as there's the complication of the dial. If they'd worded it as when it resolved a nav command: A dial allows it to adjust speed by up to 1 and increase yaw values by up to 2. Your tokens can either adjust speed by up to 1 or increase a yaw value by 1. The effects may be combined. Then it could be virtually identical. However, with the current wording it's an additional effect. (Note: please don't go over my wording with a fine toothed comb, as that's basically speed of typing, vs something that should be heavily edited, and is intended to show the issue.) 

 

 

Being overly edge case searching: There's actually no limit on nav teams or Madine's speed adjustment with a token. You can either change your speed (note: no limitations) or increase your yaw by 1.

 

And you people were worried about a speed change of 2 with a token! HA!

[pyqz 200]

~thread necromancy~

So I came looking for the answer to this question having the same thought as Dras, that Madine and Nav Team provide redundant permissive effects. But now that I've read Madine's text again, I'm not sure.

Let's look at the relevant text again.

Nav Team:

Navigate command: Your Navigate tokens can either change your speed or increase your yaw value by 1.

Pretty straightforward. Your token can now be spent to increase yaw or change speed.

The relevant text from Madine:

If it spent a Navigate token, it may either change its speed or increase 1 yaw value by 1.

The problem for me here is that, unlike Nav Team, Madine's text does not actually reference that it is your Navigate token that allows you to change your speed or yaw. Because of this, it could be interpreted that the token grants its normal effect, and Madine grants you an additional effect. Where Nav Team explicitly states that it changes how tokens can be spent, Madine states that a token must be spent to get an effect. He does NOT say that he changes how tokens can be spent, just that one must be spent to trigger his effect.

Now, if I had to guess I'd say that this is not the intended interpretation of Madine. Under this interpretation, with just Madine and a token you could increase or decrease speed by 2 or change speed by 1 and gain a yaw. Adding in Nav Team would allow you to get two additional yaw with a token if you forgo changing speed. That seems excessively strong to me. But the fact remains that if FFG had wanted Madine to only change how tokens could be spent, they could have worded it that way, as they did for Nav Team.

[Warlord Zepnick 324]

I know this threat is a bit old, but has there been an official clarification by FFG indicating that the two effects do not stack for yaw?

 

 

 

 

Edit:

 

In other words, can the Liberty use 4 clicks in a single movement?

 

1 Nav token (2 clicks)

1 Nav dial (2 clicks)

Edited November 28, 2016 by Warlord Zepnick

[Ardaedhel 10,844]

They don't stack.

FAQ pg 8