Inquisitor,x7 glaive,x7 glaive

[Velvetelvis 3,739]

Saving another one of my bad ideas here...

https://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!194:57,-1,-1:33:-1:;194:57,-1,-1:33:-1:;163:18,-1:27:17:&sn=Inquisitors%2Cx7glaive%2Cx7glaive.

[Karhedron 1,865]

How about switching out Predator for Juke on the Glaives? Then you could either give them Mk2 engines or drop the Mk2s on the Inquisitor to give him Prockets for "close encounters".

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

Juke for sure

Absolute godsend against every generic in the game (6 bring the highest generic PS; trgps never seeing play) and it makes aces think twice about spending focus

The single refill from predator is underwhelming in comparison

[Velvetelvis 3,739]

Nice! Thanks fellas!

I need to work on my fixation with rerolls. On paper it always seems to feel best to be able to reroll a failed die.

Ideally id like to get to where I'm using the /D title instead and fitting ion cannons. I'm not wedded to using the inquisitor so I have no problem dumping it for a different support piece.

Edited July 2, 2016 by Velvetelvis

[Hobojebus 11,341]

Juke is awesome on x7s nothing gives people fits like getting evades cancelled, plus since stress can't stop you getting evades it also won't stop juke opening up their defences.

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

x7 is ze best juke platform in game atm, not counting the unique case of omega leader

 

juke is surprisingly really GONKing annoying to enable on any ship that can take it. Best platform prior was the Tie/Fo thanks to relay allow you to juke and still do things like red manuever

 

along comes x7, a far more efficient jouster that doesn't even need to red maneuver because the freaking 4k is white, and juke just found its soul mate

[Hobojebus 11,341]

Looooooooving juke is easy cause it's so useful, doo de do *add sound of cat being strangled*

[TrenchRunner 72]

I just flew a similar list with X7 and stealth device on the Glaive Sq. pilots, but I think Juke would be better and would also enjoy the Twin Ions as I clipped a couple stress clouds and really lacked the ability to remove it when I needed to. My Inquisitor did not have push the limit either, but was able to perform just fine against the lists I played. First was double regen X-wings (Poe, RA) w/ Biggs. Second list was Ello regen and a decked out Han Solo. Regardless, really enjoyed the list! 

[Imperial Mike 123]

How about switching out Predator for Juke on the Glaives? Then you could either give them Mk2 engines or drop the Mk2s on the Inquisitor to give him Prockets for "close encounters".

 

Have tried Juke on Glaives - it's just that good. 

[Rolotamasi 208]

What about Carnor with the x7s?

Something like this:

(100)

Glaive Squadron Pilot (34) - TIE Defender

Juke (2), TIE/x7 (-2)

Glaive Squadron Pilot (34) - TIE Defender

Juke (2), TIE/x7 (-2)

Carnor Jax (32) - TIE Interceptor

Juke (2), Royal Guard TIE (0), Autothrusters (2), Targeting Computer (2)

That way the juke hurts more. Thoughts?

[blade_mercurial 2,091]

I've tried Juke on glaives too, and its okay.  I wouldn't declare it better than crack shot.  If going with Juke, then it makes a lot of sense to run Carnor Jax.  I understand he's hard to use though so I realize he's not a 'go-to' choice for a lot of people, but if you can use him, he is absolutely gold alongside juking defenders (and ultimately more helpful than the inquisitor in such a list).

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

You don't need Jax to juke

Just having two jukes already forces the focus's hand

Hell JUST HAVING JUKE AT ALL forces your opponent's hand. If they spend focus offensively, they may get juked. If they don't focus (ie perform any other action or red move), they may get juked

Literally the ONLY things juke doesn't work super well against are Luke/Poe, and you can block Poe out of his focus

There's no need to jump through hoops to enable juke, it's just a **** good card when you don't need to waste an action to evade

Edited July 4, 2016 by ficklegreendice

[Hobojebus 11,341]

Exactly if they don't focus you have em, if they do they don't dare spend it on offence so you have em.

 

Crackshots good but it's a one off. 

[The Inquisitor 346]

Juke for sure

Absolute godsend against every generic in the game (6 bring the highest generic PS; trgps never seeing play) and it makes aces think twice about spending focus

The single refill from predator is underwhelming in comparison

 

When did Predator fall out of favour so much?

 

A single re-roll - every shot of the game, allowing you to focus/evade every turn and giving you reliable action economy that's always "on". 

 

No question Juke works well with the x7 title since you'll almost always have an evade by start of combat, but Juke is easily countered with a focus token. Now that does have its perks (forcing enemies to hold back a focus, for example) but overall predator gives you an extra hit more often than not and juke gives you an extra hit if you have an evade token and if the enemy rolls an evade on the dice and if the enemy doesn't have a focus.

 

I think overall Predator probably does more work than Juke.  

 

Edit:

 

That said, I would put Juke on ONE of the Glaives. That saves you one point, which allows you to upgrade one of them to Vessery. Particularly coupled with the Inquisitor, that gives you a considerably nastier ship. It's not an ideal Vessery setup but for a single point over a Glaive I think it's an auto-take. 

Edited July 4, 2016 by The Inquisitor

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

Predator fell out of favor when I noticed my opponents are luckier than I am

Also more expensive

Also you can juke x7 glaive, juke x7 vess and ptl title thruster Quizzy @100

If low agi PS 2 ever comes back, maybe predator will be back in vogue. I trust green dice to **** me over far more often, though

Edited July 4, 2016 by ficklegreendice

[Raven19528 158]

Predator would be a great take on a TIE/D setup, as it would work on both shots. It's not a falling out of favor per se, as much as it is Juke does more or the same while costing less in x7 setups.

[Hobojebus 11,341]

He's right predators a reroll it could still come up blank but jukes a sure thing if you go speed three and a point cheaper.

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

He's right predators a reroll it could still come up blank but jukes a sure thing if you go speed three and a point cheaper.

 

well, your opponent could not roll any evades

 

not in my games, of course, because that's my job

 

 

the ceiling for juke is higher, though. You don't need predator to get 3 hits, but you do need juke to cancel evades whereas predator cannot

Edited July 4, 2016 by ficklegreendice

[blade_mercurial 2,091]

You don't need Jax to juke

Just having two jukes already forces the focus's hand

Hell JUST HAVING JUKE AT ALL forces your opponent's hand. If they spend focus offensively, they may get juked. If they don't focus (ie perform any other action or red move), they may get juked

Literally the ONLY things juke doesn't work super well against are Luke/Poe, and you can block Poe out of his focus

There's no need to jump through hoops to enable juke, it's just a **** good card when you don't need to waste an action to evade

there's a lot more things Juke is not good against, especially on a ship that is forced to specific moves in order to enable the EPT.  Not saying its not worth it, but your ignoring many of the downsides.

 

Also, Jax is not there just for enabling juke.  The new meta is just around the corner, and its going to be chock full of X-7 Defenders.  Jax is going to be as happy as a pig in ****.  If you can fly him right and not get blown to bits on the way to R1...

 

Not to mention all the things Jax has always been great against (contracted scouts, Soontir Fel, Poe, etc)

Edited July 4, 2016 by blade_mercurial

[Imperial Mike 123]

Juke's pretty darn good on the Glaive and x7 title. It makes your opponent think twice and it works every time you've got the evade. 

 

I think Crack shot is great for a Swarm - but with a 3 ship squad you've only got 1-2-3 opportunities to use it. The Defender - using x7 - dial makes it easy to get an evade. I've happily taken a hit or two just to save the evade for Juke. At range 1 with four red dice you can push through some monster damage (using a focus and TL). 

Edited July 4, 2016 by Imperial Mike

[The Inquisitor 346]

Well, we can work  it out mathematically. 

 

Predator, on a 3 dice attack, has a 111/256 = 43% chance of adding an extra hit you wouldn't otherwise have with a focus (and about the same if you don't, oddly enough). It's around 51% if you have 4 dice.

 

Juke depends on the enemy agility, these are the probabilities that an enemy ship will roll at least one evade for you to juke:

 

Agility 1: 3/8 = 38%

Agility 2: 1-(5/8)^2 = 61%

Agility 3: 1-(5/8)^3 = 76%

 

So Predator gives you a better return on agility 1 against un-focused enemy but juke wins out against agility 2 or 3 ships. Which makes sense - the best payoff predator can get is either 50% or 75% as that's what the odds of success on the re-roll are, modified by the probability of needing predator in the first place. 

 

Then you have the other pros and cons - predator gets better against PS1-2 and juke requires both an evade and no focus on the enemy. On the other hand, with all the palp aces around, getting past high agility might be more useful if they aren't focused up.

Edited July 5, 2016 by The Inquisitor

[Scopes 530]

How about this? http://tinyurl.com/h8tonyd 

 

Exchanges the Inquisitor for OL, and lets you get some additional stress relief for the Glaives. 

 

Am loving coming up with lists now that IV is out...

[Imperial Mike 123]

Predator, on a 3 dice attack, has a 111/256 = 43% chance of adding an extra hit you wouldn't otherwise have with a focus (and about the same if you don't, oddly enough). It's around 51% if you have 4 dice.

 

Juke depends on the enemy agility, these are the probabilities that an enemy ship will roll at least one evade for you to juke:

 

Agility 1: 3/8 = 38%

Agility 2: 1-(5/8)^2 = 61%

Agility 3: 1-(5/8)^2 = 76%

 

So Predator gives you a better return on agility 1 against un-focused enemy but juke wins out against agility 2 or 3 ships. Which makes sense - the best payoff predator can get is either 50% or 75% as that's what the odds of success on the re-roll are, modified by the probability of needing predator in the first place. 

 

Great analysis - really comes down to the state of the meta where you are. Given that Palp aces and uboats dominate I'd be leaning towards Juke. We're not seeing the low agility ships (apart from Ghost) around very much. 

[Raven19528 158]

Then you have the other pros and cons - predator gets better against PS1-2 and juke requires both an evade and no focus on the enemy. On the other hand, with all the palp aces around, getting past high agility might be more useful if they aren't focused up.

Right but let's look at the meta right now. First you have U-boats, the JM5K variety we all know and love. They have 2 agility, so by your analysis, Juke will do better than Predator. Next, the maneuvers to get the evade. Well the Defender has all the 3 speed maneuvers, 4 straight and K, and 5 straight. So a pretty awesome dial, and one that loves going fast. If you can't find a maneuver that is going to do well at those speeds, my advice would be to play Defenders more and get better at timing those moves. To the third point, yes a u-boat will probably have a focus token, but will probably not want to spend it so they can use it for Deadeye. So if you're laying some hate on one u-boat, and his choice is to either use focus on defense or burn, he will use focus on defense, which means you won't have to worry about a torp shot this round from that one. I think there, Juke is far more powerful than Predator.

Next meta list is Palp Aces. Yes, they will likely be tokened up at the beginning of the round, but they will likely shoot first, and if they have a focus roll, they have to decide if it's better to spend it on offense or spend it on defense (this is even better if two Defenders have the Ace in their sights). Offense, you have the bulk to weather the storm, or the agility to possibly avoid the unmodified attack. Defense, sure they may get the evade back, but it drains their tokens, and they aren't able to maximize their attacks. On the flip side with Predator, there aren't really a lot of decisions outside of the norm. You spend your tokens when you can, or you can save for defense, but it isn't as imperative.

Overall I think Juke with x7 is going to be something that changes the meta. All Palp Aces will want to run Carnor, and Rebels will see a lot more from Wes Jansen. I don't know where the meta will end up, but it's almost certain to change.

[JamieSpace 138]

First thought was Carnor with a couple of Juking Glaives. He's not necessary for them to trigger as people have stated but he's just so **** annoying plus the added benefit of not using evade tokens to. He makes people fly differently

 

Glaive Squadron Pilot (34)
Juke (2)
TIE/x7 (-2)

Glaive Squadron Pilot (34)
Juke (2)
TIE/x7 (-2)

Carnor Jax (26)
Push the Limit (3)
Autothrusters (2)

Total: 99

 

shame you cant get a fully kitted out Carnor. Could add MKII engines on him but Int bid is prob worth it with all the 8s about.

Could always go down the VI Carnor route too but that requires skill I don't have