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Warpman

FAQ Mess

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looking at the faq and being exact at the "There is no defender when Deadeye is used" moment

I got a bluescreen.

Kidding. SImply understood that either I don't understand hell or the game suddenly went different way.

 

The point is, that usually we somehow all considered that every time you want to fire a torp (example)
you

1. select a ship

2. declare using a torp

3. meausre range and arc to see if possible

4. if possible, spend the focus\TL

5. roll the dice

 

???
so the point is: you are the attacker immediatley when 3rd step is a "YES YOU CAN" 

 

and FAQ clearly states that nope, there's no defender.

What brings us a curious question: we use Deadeye before measuring the range&arc?!
That means a mess because we spend the focus even before that, and it's completely possible to lose the focus\TL

 

sooooo

 

FAQ is a mess and a blunt, simple and completely miserable attempt to down the ordnance they sought to make viable for...erm...4 waves?!

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looking at the faq and being exact at the "There is no defender when Deadeye is used" moment

I got a bluescreen.

Kidding. SImply understood that either I don't understand hell or the game suddenly went different way.

 

The point is, that usually we somehow all considered that every time you want to fire a torp (example)

you

1. select a ship

2. declare using a torp

3. meausre range and arc to see if possible

4. if possible, spend the focus\TL

5. roll the dice

 

???

so the point is: you are the attacker immediatley when 3rd step is a "YES YOU CAN" 

 

and FAQ clearly states that nope, there's no defender.

What brings us a curious question: we use Deadeye before measuring the range&arc?!

That means a mess because we spend the focus even before that, and it's completely possible to lose the focus\TL

 

sooooo

 

FAQ is a mess and a blunt, simple and completely miserable attempt to down the ordnance they sought to make viable for...erm...4 waves?!

 

Sounds like you are doing it wrong. Once you are the attacker you can measure and check arc to all the possible targets you have. At that point you decide what weapon you want to use and declare a target, if there is a cost and you have selected a valid target you pay the cost.  At that point the target becomes the Defender. If you are unable to pay the cost or your target isn't valid for the attack, you go back to part where you declare the target.

 

This changed with the TFA release. Previously, as soon as you declared your target that ship became the Defender. Every since that change, Deadeye and Blaster Turret only continued working with R4 Agromech because the FAQ said that they did. The new FAQ removes the contradiction.

Edited by WWHSD

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A lot of nerfs, Tel and TFA damage deck got nerfed. Along with Vallen Rudor, Vader<crew>, Lando <crew> got nerfed with the double evade tokens. Now you really need something to make use of extra evade tokens since you can't spend 2 evades in a single attack. 

 

Also the Deadeye/R4 combo has been NUKED! or sorry, got to explain is Star Wars Terms. Blown away by both the DEATH STAR, the DEATHSTAR II & STARKILLER BASE!

 

U-boats are no more. But hey IG-88A and scum cloaking device along with Sigma SPA got buffed.

Edited by Marinealver

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looking at the faq and being exact at the "There is no defender when Deadeye is used" moment

I got a bluescreen.

Kidding. SImply understood that either I don't understand hell or the game suddenly went different way.

 

The point is, that usually we somehow all considered that every time you want to fire a torp (example)

you

1. select a ship

2. declare using a torp

3. meausre range and arc to see if possible

4. if possible, spend the focus\TL

5. roll the dice

 

???

so the point is: you are the attacker immediatley when 3rd step is a "YES YOU CAN" 

 

and FAQ clearly states that nope, there's no defender.

What brings us a curious question: we use Deadeye before measuring the range&arc?!

That means a mess because we spend the focus even before that, and it's completely possible to lose the focus\TL

 

sooooo

 

FAQ is a mess and a blunt, simple and completely miserable attempt to down the ordnance they sought to make viable for...erm...4 waves?!

 

Sounds like you are doing it wrong. Once you are the attacker you can measure and check arc to all the possible targets you have. At that point you decide what weapon you want to use and declare a target, if there is a cost and you have selected a valid target you pay the cost.  At that point the target becomes the Defender. If you are unable to pay the cost or your target isn't valid for the attack, you go back to part where you declare the target.

 

This changed with the TFA release. Previously, as soon as you declared your target that ship became the Defender. Every since that change, Deadeye and Blaster Turret only continued working with R4 Agromech because the FAQ said that they did. The new FAQ removes the contradiction.

 

Consulting the chart they 

i. allowed us to freely measure range to all enemy ships (we aren't obliged to fire on the target because that happens BEFORE the target is chosen)

ii. weapon choice is made after and not before

iii. target is declared (what means we decalre target in declare target step. meaning it's declaration-inception)

iv. we pay the cost

v. and here they added the nerf. not a faq, a nerf. plain, dumb and completely utterly unnecessarry.

 

and the main feature of the game "declare first measure only that" is also broken. what a mess.

 

 

 

U-boats are no more.

you say that as if it's something good.

 

U-boats are no more.

 
Edited by Warpman

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I think it's a mixed bag for Rudor. He ends up doing worse against stuff like TLT but but he ends up better of in a lot of other situation. Previously if he was being shot at by someone with a Gunner effect, he would only get his action before that attack if he had initiative. Now he will always get an action before that second attack (assuming he is able to take an action) regardless of initiative.

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and the main feature of the game "declare first measure only that" is also broken. what a mess.

 

That has never been a feature of X-Wing. The active ship in the combat phase has always been able to measure and check arc to any enemy ship on the board before declaring a target.

 

Literally nothing has changed about the early stages of the attack sequence since TFA dropped. All of the changes in the new combat sequence occur near the end. When destroyed ships are removed, what order after attacking/defending effects happen, and how to handle attacks like TLT are really the big changes from the new sequence.

 

R4 Agromech hasn't worked with Blaster Turret and Deadeye according to the rules since the TFA update. The FAQ has finally caught up.

Edited by WWHSD

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You should know by now that Warpman is trollish, or immature. Take your pick. 
The fact is that the faq finally cleared up a lot of contradictions.

 

The 'cost before shooting' makes perfect sense logically, and will FINALLY make ordinance viable again (by making the rest of the games' carriers of ordinance more viable). 

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Kidding. SImply understood that either I don't understand hell or the game suddenly went different way.

 

 

This. You don't understand hell. Game hasn't changed. Get better at _rules-001_

 

Especially since these rules have been out for 4 days now. Come on you act like they were released yesterday. :P

FAQ_date.jpg

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I am sorry but having problems with the logic now presented in the fact that I am deciding I am doing an attack and apparently making a decision of a weapon and THEN there is a defender.

So...I choose to shoot an HLC and THEN I choose who I am attacking? But what if they are in range one?

It is the logic (not the rules per say) that is driving me bonkers. I am choosing a target first Before I decide what weapon and how to activate it.... So how can there not yet be a defender.

But with the written rules I just randomly decide to fire, activate, etc. If to follow the logic of the new rules there should not even be a defender until after rolling the dice.

Basically step 1iv and 1v is backwards and to me to spend a Target Lock or focus to fire a weapon to me means an attack is already occurring.

Edited by rilesman

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looking at the faq and being exact at the "There is no defender when Deadeye is used" moment

I got a bluescreen.

Kidding. SImply understood that either I don't understand hell or the game suddenly went different way.

 

The point is, that usually we somehow all considered that every time you want to fire a torp (example)

you

1. select a ship

2. declare using a torp

3. meausre range and arc to see if possible

4. if possible, spend the focus\TL

5. roll the dice

 

???

so the point is: you are the attacker immediatley when 3rd step is a "YES YOU CAN" 

 

and FAQ clearly states that nope, there's no defender.

What brings us a curious question: we use Deadeye before measuring the range&arc?!

That means a mess because we spend the focus even before that, and it's completely possible to lose the focus\TL

 

sooooo

 

FAQ is a mess and a blunt, simple and completely miserable attempt to down the ordnance they sought to make viable for...erm...4 waves?!

 

Sounds like you are doing it wrong. Once you are the attacker you can measure and check arc to all the possible targets you have. At that point you decide what weapon you want to use and declare a target, if there is a cost and you have selected a valid target you pay the cost.  At that point the target becomes the Defender. If you are unable to pay the cost or your target isn't valid for the attack, you go back to part where you declare the target.

 

This changed with the TFA release. Previously, as soon as you declared your target that ship became the Defender. Every since that change, Deadeye and Blaster Turret only continued working with R4 Agromech because the FAQ said that they did. The new FAQ removes the contradiction.

Can you post the FAQ on this....yes, I'm an idiot.

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So...I choose to shoot an HLC and THEN I choose who I am attacking? But what if they are in range one?

It is the logic (not the rules per say) that is driving me bonkers. I am choosing a target first Before I decide what weapon and how to activate it.... So how can there not yet be a defender.

 

Because you can measure ranges before deciding who to fire on.

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looking at the faq and being exact at the "There is no defender when Deadeye is used" moment

I got a bluescreen.

Kidding. SImply understood that either I don't understand hell or the game suddenly went different way.

 

The point is, that usually we somehow all considered that every time you want to fire a torp (example)

you

1. select a ship

2. declare using a torp

3. meausre range and arc to see if possible

4. if possible, spend the focus\TL

5. roll the dice

 

???

so the point is: you are the attacker immediatley when 3rd step is a "YES YOU CAN" 

 

and FAQ clearly states that nope, there's no defender.

What brings us a curious question: we use Deadeye before measuring the range&arc?!

That means a mess because we spend the focus even before that, and it's completely possible to lose the focus\TL

 

sooooo

 

FAQ is a mess and a blunt, simple and completely miserable attempt to down the ordnance they sought to make viable for...erm...4 waves?!

 

Sounds like you are doing it wrong. Once you are the attacker you can measure and check arc to all the possible targets you have. At that point you decide what weapon you want to use and declare a target, if there is a cost and you have selected a valid target you pay the cost.  At that point the target becomes the Defender. If you are unable to pay the cost or your target isn't valid for the attack, you go back to part where you declare the target.

 

This changed with the TFA release. Previously, as soon as you declared your target that ship became the Defender. Every since that change, Deadeye and Blaster Turret only continued working with R4 Agromech because the FAQ said that they did. The new FAQ removes the contradiction.

Can you post the FAQ on this....yes, I'm an idiot.

 

 

Here are the rules that have been in place since December that prevent R4 Agromech's and Night Beast's abilities from being able to trigger from tokens spent as part of the cost of an attack:

 

RRG, pg. 5:

ATTACK
A ship can perform one attack when it becomes the
active ship during the Combat phase. To perform an
attack, the ship resolves the following steps in order:
1. Declare Target: The attacker may measure
range to any number of enemy ships and check
which enemy ships are inside his firing arc. Then
the attacker chooses one of his weapons to
attack with. Then he chooses one enemy ship to
be the target and pays any costs required for the
attack.
• If attacking with a primary weapon, the target
must be inside the attacker’s firing arc and at
Range 1–3.
• If attacking with a turret primary weapon, the
target must be at Range 1–3 but does not need
to be inside firing arc.
• If attacking with a secondary weapon, the target
must be inside the attacker’s firing arc (unless
otherwise specified) and at the weapon range
indicated on the weapon’s Upgrade card.
• If there is no valid target for the chosen weapon,
or if the attacker cannot pay any costs required
for the attack, the attacker may choose a
different weapon and target.
• After a valid weapon and target are chosen
and any indicated costs are paid, the target is
considered to be the defender

 
 
In the FAQ that released at the same time. FFG changed Night Beasts entry to reflect the new rules but R4 Agromech's entry was unchanged. This is the FAQ ruling that had R4 Agromech triggering from Deadeye even though by the rules it shouldn't have.

 

FAQ 4.1.2, pg. 14:

R4 Agromech
Target locks acquired using R4 Agromech’s ability may
be used during that attack.
If a ship equipped with R4 Agromech is attacking with
a secondary weapon that requires the ship to spend a
focus token (such as a Blaster Turret), that ship may
acquire a target lock on the defender and spend it
during that attack.

 
 
Here is the R4 Agromech entry from the most recent FAQ. It finally applies the rules that have been in place since December to R4 Agromech.
FAQ 4.2.1, pg. 16:

R4 Agromech
Target locks acquired using R4 Agromech’s ability may
be used during that attack.
If a ship equipped with R4 Agromech is attacking with
a secondary weapon that requires the ship to spend a
focus token (such as a Blaster Turret or any weapon
used with Deadeye), that ship cannot acquire a target
lock on the defender because the enemy ship becomes
the defender after the cost for the attack is paid. See
"Timing Chart for Performing an Attack" on page 6.
You may spend 1 focus token to change all [EYEBALL] results
to [HIT] results only once during the "Modify Attack" dice
step. See "Spending Tokens" on page 5.

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Sounds like you are doing it wrong. Once you are the attacker you can measure and check arc to all the possible targets you have. 

Technically at that point you aren't the attacker, you're the Active Ship. There's a big difference.

 

 

While the you are correct that being the attacker and the active ship are not the same thing, I believe what I wrote is accurate. You become the attacker once you enter the Declare Target step and it is in that step that you are permitted to measure and check arc. If you had to be the active ship in order to check range and arc, Corran and Dengar's abilities would not work.

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I am sorry but having problems with the logic now presented in the fact that I am deciding I am doing an attack and apparently making a decision of a weapon and THEN there is a defender.

So...I choose to shoot an HLC and THEN I choose who I am attacking? But what if they are in range one?

It is the logic (not the rules per say) that is driving me bonkers. I am choosing a target first Before I decide what weapon and how to activate it.... So how can there not yet be a defender.

But with the written rules I just randomly decide to fire, activate, etc. If to follow the logic of the new rules there should not even be a defender until after rolling the dice.

Basically step 1iv and 1v is backwards and to me to spend a Target Lock or focus to fire a weapon to me means an attack is already occurring.

 

This is the same sequence of events that has existed since December 2015. 

 

RRG, pg. 5:
 

ATTACK
A ship can perform one attack when it becomes the
active ship during the Combat phase. To perform an
attack, the ship resolves the following steps in order:
1. Declare Target: The attacker may measure
range to any number of enemy ships and check
which enemy ships are inside his firing arc. Then
the attacker chooses one of his weapons to
attack with. Then he chooses one enemy ship to
be the target and pays any costs required for the
attack.
• If attacking with a primary weapon, the target
must be inside the attacker’s firing arc and at
Range 1–3.
• If attacking with a turret primary weapon, the
target must be at Range 1–3 but does not need
to be inside firing arc.
• If attacking with a secondary weapon, the target
must be inside the attacker’s firing arc (unless
otherwise specified) and at the weapon range
indicated on the weapon’s Upgrade card.
• If there is no valid target for the chosen weapon,
or if the attacker cannot pay any costs required
for the attack, the attacker may choose a
different weapon and target.
• After a valid weapon and target are chosen
and any indicated costs are paid, the target is
considered to be the defender

 
I've left out the steps that come after the Declare Target step because it's not really relevant to the discussion.

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