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OmegaLeader144

Why do people on here say the T-65 needs to be "fixed"?

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So Omegaleader's entire argument boils down to this:

 

"I can win with them.  The fact that they don't win tournaments doesn't count because I think they're biased despite not offering any actual evidence to the fact."

 

In other words, Omegaleader actually knows the T-65 needs fixing and is afraid to take his super-awesome kills-everything T-65 list to an actual tournament because he'd get his ass handed to him.

 

Prove me wrong.

I meant that everyone is biased towards certain ships for example I have a preference towards TIE Interceptors.

 

 

I think you're misunderstanding why people want the T-65 fixed.  It has nothing to do with likes and dislikes.  It has nothing to do with who uses it and who doesn't.  It all has to do with crunching the numbers and comparing them to numbers crunched for other ships (and figuring in experience from trying the craft and other craft in similar uses to see which is better, to make sure the numbers reflect reality).  No one is saying the T-65 can't be used or that it needs to be trashed entirely; they're just saying they want it balanced to other ships better. 

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Also just a thought a lot of people want to see the T-65 be better because it's the ship the game is named after, it's the ship that means a lot to us nerds and most non Star Wars people can tell you what it is. I believe more then the Falcon it is loved, I think a lot of us dreamed about being at the Death Star or landing at cloud city, we dream of taking off on an adventure and exploring space. I think in our hearts if we could have a Death Star size board we all would recreated the trench run and use Luke as a way to relive our childhood dreams. I know I am crazy for loving the 65 more then the falcon and I want it to be the first ship as a go to and not the last.

I think the attachment people have for the 65 is what makes us demand it to be better and we want Luke to have a different ablity.

 

Nicely put.

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In my opinion it still runs great, but why do others say it needs to be "fixed"?

For me, it's not about it being over costed. I think it needs a little something because it just doesn't feel like the iconic rebel space superiority fighter it is in the fluff/my head. It's a straight up jouster, which just doesn't seem quite right in the game right now. A more interesting dial with something other than a k turn would be a great way to really differentiate it from the b wing. An evade action maybe? Integrated astro is kind of a bummer because it eats that mod slot for a extra shield the ship should probably have already.

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So Omegaleader's entire argument boils down to this:

 

"I can win with them.  The fact that they don't win tournaments doesn't count because I think they're biased despite not offering any actual evidence to the fact."

 

In other words, Omegaleader actually knows the T-65 needs fixing and is afraid to take his super-awesome kills-everything T-65 list to an actual tournament because he'd get his ass handed to him.

 

Prove me wrong.

I meant that everyone is biased towards certain ships for example I have a preference towards TIE Interceptors.

 

 

I think you're misunderstanding why people want the T-65 fixed.  It has nothing to do with likes and dislikes.  It has nothing to do with who uses it and who doesn't.  It all has to do with crunching the numbers and comparing them to numbers crunched for other ships (and figuring in experience from trying the craft and other craft in similar uses to see which is better, to make sure the numbers reflect reality).  No one is saying the T-65 can't be used or that it needs to be trashed entirely; they're just saying they want it balanced to other ships better. 

 

IMO, it seems balanced, but that's just my opinion.

Edited by OmegaLeader144

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So Omegaleader's entire argument boils down to this:

 

"I can win with them.  The fact that they don't win tournaments doesn't count because I think they're biased despite not offering any actual evidence to the fact."

 

In other words, Omegaleader actually knows the T-65 needs fixing and is afraid to take his super-awesome kills-everything T-65 list to an actual tournament because he'd get his ass handed to him.

 

Prove me wrong.

I meant that everyone is biased towards certain ships for example I have a preference towards TIE Interceptors.

 

 

I think you're misunderstanding why people want the T-65 fixed.  It has nothing to do with likes and dislikes.  It has nothing to do with who uses it and who doesn't.  It all has to do with crunching the numbers and comparing them to numbers crunched for other ships (and figuring in experience from trying the craft and other craft in similar uses to see which is better, to make sure the numbers reflect reality).  No one is saying the T-65 can't be used or that it needs to be trashed entirely; they're just saying they want it balanced to other ships better. 

 

IMO, it seems balanced, but that's just my opinion.

 

 

Precisely.

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So Omegaleader's entire argument boils down to this:

 

"I can win with them.  The fact that they don't win tournaments doesn't count because I think they're biased despite not offering any actual evidence to the fact."

 

In other words, Omegaleader actually knows the T-65 needs fixing and is afraid to take his super-awesome kills-everything T-65 list to an actual tournament because he'd get his ass handed to him.

 

Prove me wrong.

I meant that everyone is biased towards certain ships for example I have a preference towards TIE Interceptors.

 

 

I think you're misunderstanding why people want the T-65 fixed.  It has nothing to do with likes and dislikes.  It has nothing to do with who uses it and who doesn't.  It all has to do with crunching the numbers and comparing them to numbers crunched for other ships (and figuring in experience from trying the craft and other craft in similar uses to see which is better, to make sure the numbers reflect reality).  No one is saying the T-65 can't be used or that it needs to be trashed entirely; they're just saying they want it balanced to other ships better. 

 

IMO, it seems balanced.

 

 

that's the key to this and what is leading to a lively debate.  In your opinion, the T-65 is fine, in the opinion of many others including those that DO play in tournaments (of which, I am not one) and, I would argue, are intimately and obsessively aware of the myriad combinations and possibilities. And if THOSE guys don't use the T-65, you may be correct that there is bias but may also be misunderstanding the source.

 

Either way, glad you like flying it, I love the T-65 and despite being in the "yup, it needs a fix to give it a role, a purpose and a function" camp, I love to give people an Atomic Wedgie when they're not expecting it.

Edited by Bojanglez

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Gunboat?

The T-65 misses being as effecient as it needs to be by 1 point or so, and has been this way since the Core Set. It's very very hard to put in a fix that doesn't make it too good. FFG has been trying for a LONG time to give love to this ship but everytime a new droid or mod or whatever comes out that helps, the fans cry fowl because 'it wasn't enough'. They are trying, and it looks like the X is gonna end up with several options such as extra-shield-droid, alpha striker with chimps, effective jouster perhaps with the new R3 droid (I hope) and a whole bag full of named pilots with cool abilities.

I may be wrong but to me this is what FFG has been trying for a while.

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Gunboat?

The T-65 misses being as effecient as it needs to be by 1 point or so, and has been this way since the Core Set. It's very very hard to put in a fix that doesn't make it too good. FFG has been trying for a LONG time to give love to this ship but everytime a new droid or mod or whatever comes out that helps, the fans cry fowl because 'it wasn't enough'. They are trying, and it looks like the X is gonna end up with several options such as extra-shield-droid, alpha striker with chimps, effective jouster perhaps with the new R3 droid (I hope) and a whole bag full of named pilots with cool abilities.

I may be wrong but to me this is what FFG has been trying for a while.

 

Maybe a new "Squadron" card type that gives you some sort of global bonus if your selected ships meet certain criteria?  Like, "Rogue Squadron - Requires:  3x X-Wings  Effect:  Each of your X-Wings has +1 Pilot Skill" or "Dinner Squadron - Requires:  2x X-Wings and 2x A-Wings  Effect:  At the end of each turn, your opponent is thoroughly humiliated".  

 

Of course, it would have to be done in such a way so as to avoid making it, "we've pre-built your lists for you!"

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Gunboat?

The T-65 misses being as effecient as it needs to be by 1 point or so, and has been this way since the Core Set. It's very very hard to put in a fix that doesn't make it too good. FFG has been trying for a LONG time to give love to this ship but everytime a new droid or mod or whatever comes out that helps, the fans cry fowl because 'it wasn't enough'. They are trying, and it looks like the X is gonna end up with several options such as extra-shield-droid, alpha striker with chimps, effective jouster perhaps with the new R3 droid (I hope) and a whole bag full of named pilots with cool abilities.

I may be wrong but to me this is what FFG has been trying for a while.

Wrong thread, gunboat is that way ----> https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/108676-xg-1-star-wing-assault-gunboat/

 

Move along! ;)

 

Although FFG has been nursing the X-wing for awhile, they haven't given it anything ground breaking like the TIE advanced title, or the Y-wing title. Chimps helps everyone, that was a boost to ordnance, and while IA is nice on the T-65, the card was really designed for the T-70, but it does come with a cost on either craft. I would be happier with my T-65's if they had more post movement action, or some different torpedo options. I can already take care of the dial with R2 astromech, but at the same time, I'm missing out of R2-D2 or BB-8 if I do. I also can't take both IA and say chips, or engine upgrade. So this leaves me questioning what my T-65 is good for, as far as tournament play goes.

 

Which is why biggs is popular, because he is the easiest answer. Fly the Tank-65, slap IA and R2-d2 on and call it a day. Except that only works on Biggs because of his pilot ability. 

 

Wedge hates being a tank, he'd rather be an alpha striker. So torps and chips favor him, and maybe BB-8 or R2 astro to help line those shots better.

 

Wes, Luke, Garven, and Hobby all fall somewhere between the two extremes. And fitting any 3 pilots into a 100 point list is tricky. Plus in an ordnance meta where the current flavor is large based ships that either roll 3 dice multiple times, or shoot missiles that land 3-4 damage a turn, The X-wing doesn't hold up as well as it needs to. You'll be lucky to get 1 round of shooting in, even with Biggs.

 

So basically the T-65 is filled with comprimises when it comes to list building, and it feels under per-forming for a ship that blew up 2 death stars. It's very close to being what it can be, it just needs a little push.

Edited by FlyingAnchors

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I think many rebel players are overexcited by the cool gimmicks givent to the Advandes and Defender TIEs, so they want one of their own for the X-wing.
But anyway, the T65 is not a bad ship, it is just a bit overcosted to the new standards.

Not any ship should have repositionning or fancy rules, and, imo, not the T65 X-wing.
This ship sould be and remain the spine of the rebel force, a sturdy, muti-role (understand "unspecialized") and worth-its-points ship.
(and we keep the cool gimmick for the poor E-wing)

IMO, they are just overcosted by 2 little points.
With that recosting, we could have :
- 19pts rookie : makes 20 pts with IA and R2, we have a good 3attack ship, available in mini-swarms or filler. At that point value, it would compete with the A-wing (green squadron, at least), in a less specialized way.

- 21pts "rogue squadron pilot", pilot value 5-6, EpT : makes 25pts with one 1pt astromech, IA, and Predator or PtL. Seems a fine 25pts ship for me.

Edited by Giledhil

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