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keschnell

Change of scale in new Descent minis?

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From photos I have seen, FFG has increased the base size and overall size of the minis in the new Heroes & Monsters Collection, Stewards of the Secret.  Does anyone know if monster mini/base sizes have changed too (mine's on order, so I can't check).

 

Does anyone know if they're going to do this from now forward?  I wouldn't mind them being larger to be on a more standard scale with other minis (great for proxying), but it sure would have been nice to have this from the start instead of 50+ heroes in. I remember them doing that with Talisman and shrinking down the hero size several releases in. What does everyone think about this?

 

Thanks!

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Which photos are you referring to?

There was a comparison photo posted today in one of the miniatures Facebook groups, but I don't know if I should post that without permission.  Perhaps someone who has Stewards of the Secret already could post a few photos?  The base clearly looked larger, as did the minis.

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The latest packs (starting with bonds or treaty) definitely uses a new plastic- you can see the minion monsters are a different color. The scale seems to be about the same, though Laurel is a bit large compared to Jain.

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Laurel? She was in one of the first packs, right? Or do you mean Tatianna?

 

Here is a (terrible) picture of Base game heroes, some of the older H&M packs, and from the new H&M packs.

 

2016-05-27%2023.50.25.jpg

 

To be honest, so far, the only ones looking out of place are the Bilehall Lieutenants, Jonas The Kind, and Krutzbeck

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Some models changed base size, blood apes are now 2x2 instead of 1x2.

It doesn't mean that the scale has changed only that FFG thought these apes should be a bit bigger.

The minis look awesome.

 

 

This wasn't a change from 1x1 to 1x2 but a noticeable change in base size of 1x1 plus the figures were taller and had larger faces and limbs.  I was basing all of that off the photo posted, but won't get a chance to compare myself until later.  The sculpts did look nice.

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Krutzbeck is really too huge to be a dwarf, indeed. An impressive miniature, but far away from the dwarf (and small one) he should be. More like a giant dwarf, if it ever exist ...

 

Zarihell is really too high, too, but since she's a lieutenant in a moving pose, i'm not so shocked.

 

Jonas is a bit tall but it's really not a trouble. I really like him, even if he does looks like a bit too much like Prince Charmant

Edited by rugal

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 All the dwarves have different sizes, Grisban looks like a gnome near the others :huh: . Lietenants of the Mists of Belihall are in different scale proportion, they are more taller and have better details than the others.

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I wonder if FFG is doing what GW did years ago with moving from 28mm to Super 28.  The mini is basically the same size but weapons and heads are slightly out of scale to get more detail in.

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The ministry have definitely gotten bigger over time and the level of detail has increased as well. You think Grizzly looks like a gnome? Check out August Grissom, although his pose does have him squatting... for some reason...

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So I just got Shards of Everdark and lemme tell you... these figures are huge! I don't think anyone will mind Steelhorns or Karnon, though both of them are certainly big comparing them to other heroes. One-Fist though is gigantic for an Orc and Arvel is a little large as well. The Monsters? Well the Ice Wyrms require construction and the Shades are just really tall (though impressive.)

 

While I think the increase in scale makes for more detailed figures, it may throw some of the immersion off, since the larger heroes will be alot more taller then the older ones. 

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So I just got Shards of Everdark and lemme tell you... these figures are huge! I don't think anyone will mind Steelhorns or Karnon, though both of them are certainly big comparing them to other heroes. One-Fist though is gigantic for an Orc and Arvel is a little large as well. The Monsters? Well the Ice Wyrms require construction and the Shades are just really tall (though impressive.)

 

While I think the increase in scale makes for more detailed figures, it may throw some of the immersion off, since the larger heroes will be alot more taller then the older ones. 

 

Yeah, One-Fist is big for an orc, but Arvel is completely monstrous compared to how she's supposed to be. I honestly have no idea what they were thinking. Changing scales and such this late in an established line is.. bad. It makes the set look incredibly unprofessional and hodge-podge. Like it's a collection assembled from a whole range of different games and manufacturers.

 

She doesn't even fit on the base and she's larger than any orc pre-One-Fist.

Edited by Luckmann

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Yes not a fan of this. Some are not taller or wider but just look way bigger due to super heroic style. Not a big fan of that while I understand it allows for more detail. For example I really like the old Nanok better, much more realistic looking.

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Only Arvel seems to be unacceptable at the moment. I can live with a large Steelhorn and Giant character. I hadnt really noticed Krutzbeck to be honest but i guess he is bigger for a Dwarf but he doesnt stand out too much for me, and neither did Jonas really as i saw him as a tall Prince character with bulky armour in the mold of Jamie Lannister. It is more worrying if all future models are bigger as that will probably take them off my purchase list. 

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Well, we just started a new campaign with Arvel. To be honest, when actually playing, she doesn't really look oversized between Astarra, Alys Raine, Elder Mok or any of the SoN monsters/lieutenants)

Edited by Atom4geVampire

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The real troubles comes from the fact that the miniature were growing in size over time and expansions

 

Take Augur or Orkell and take Arvel and Nanok, and you will see the difference for sure !

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I wonder if FFG is doing what GW did years ago with moving from 28mm to Super 28.  The mini is basically the same size but weapons and heads are slightly out of scale to get more detail in.

 

I really hope that FFG isn't going for super 28 scale. I much rather have normal proportions than excessive detail. Imo the normal proportions made the Descent miniatures stand out, even if they weren't loaded with details and they imo look much better than quite a few of GW's cartoony looking miniatures.

Edited by DAMaz

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Real life isn't to scale. Haven't you ever seen the difference in proportionality when a 4'10" woman stands next to a 6'2" woman?  It's totally consistent with the height difference between Jain and Arvel.

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Real life isn't to scale. Haven't you ever seen the difference in proportionality when a 4'10" woman stands next to a 6'2" woman?  It's totally consistent with the height difference between Jain and Arvel.

 

I've already addressed this point previously in the thread. Sufficient to say, Arvel is an absolute monster of an elf, and it's completely out of place in terms of size, fingers, heads to toes, compared to other miniatures. Unless you want to argue that Arvel has suddenly developed an acute case of gigantism.

Edited by Luckmann

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And I'm saying that that the

 

 

Real life isn't to scale. Haven't you ever seen the difference in proportionality when a 4'10" woman stands next to a 6'2" woman?  It's totally consistent with the height difference between Jain and Arvel.

 

I've already addressed this point previously in the thread. Sufficient to say, Arvel is an absolute monster of an elf, and it's completely out of place in terms of size, fingers, heads to toes, compared to other miniatures. Unless you want to argue that Arvel has suddenly developed an acute case of gigantism.

 

All I'm saying is that the differences between Arvel and Jain, in all aspects of their scale and appearance (taking liberties for the stylized nature of the models) are consistent with my real word observations of the differences between very tall and very short women. Since FFG has not, to my knowledge, released artwork demonstrating the size comparisons between characters in universe, I cannot say for certain whether Arvel's miniature accurately represents how tall she should be compared to other characters or not.  I can say for certain that her height is not so much greater than the other female figures as to be absurd or inconceivable. 

 

Just to let you know where I'm coming from, on my father's side of the family I have 42 female cousins and 38 male cousins.  Two are still in their teenage years, the rest are adults.  I am 5'10" tall, and most of my female cousins are between 2 to 6 inches shorter than I am.  However, one of my aunts had 8 daughters, six of whom are range in height between 6'4" and 6'8".  While they look proportional while standing next to each other, when compared to any other woman in the family they seem massive - they're broad shouldered, their hands are quite large, their arms and legs, while in proportion to the rest of their bodies, seem thick and heavy compared to my more petite cousins.  I have no doubt that if someone accurately sculpted miniatures of my extended family, the universal opinion of anyone who didn't know us would be that those six women were sculpted in a different scale from everyone else in the family.

 

It's very possible that Arvel's height is supposed to be closer to some of the shorter female figures in the Descent range.  I don't know.  I don't think you know either.  But even if these more recent miniatures do represent size creep (which, again, is quite possible) it is not so drastic as to utterly fail to comport with real world anatomical variance.

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And I'm saying that that the

 

 

Real life isn't to scale. Haven't you ever seen the difference in proportionality when a 4'10" woman stands next to a 6'2" woman?  It's totally consistent with the height difference between Jain and Arvel.

 

I've already addressed this point previously in the thread. Sufficient to say, Arvel is an absolute monster of an elf, and it's completely out of place in terms of size, fingers, heads to toes, compared to other miniatures. Unless you want to argue that Arvel has suddenly developed an acute case of gigantism.

 

All I'm saying is that the differences between Arvel and Jain, in all aspects of their scale and appearance (taking liberties for the stylized nature of the models) are consistent with my real word observations of the differences between very tall and very short women. Since FFG has not, to my knowledge, released artwork demonstrating the size comparisons between characters in universe, I cannot say for certain whether Arvel's miniature accurately represents how tall she should be compared to other characters or not.  I can say for certain that her height is not so much greater than the other female figures as to be absurd or inconceivable. 

 

Just to let you know where I'm coming from, on my father's side of the family I have 42 female cousins and 38 male cousins.  Two are still in their teenage years, the rest are adults.  I am 5'10" tall, and most of my female cousins are between 2 to 6 inches shorter than I am.  However, one of my aunts had 8 daughters, six of whom are range in height between 6'4" and 6'8".  While they look proportional while standing next to each other, when compared to any other woman in the family they seem massive - they're broad shouldered, their hands are quite large, their arms and legs, while in proportion to the rest of their bodies, seem thick and heavy compared to my more petite cousins.  I have no doubt that if someone accurately sculpted miniatures of my extended family, the universal opinion of anyone who didn't know us would be that those six women were sculpted in a different scale from everyone else in the family.

 

It's very possible that Arvel's height is supposed to be closer to some of the shorter female figures in the Descent range.  I don't know.  I don't think you know either.  But even if these more recent miniatures do represent size creep (which, again, is quite possible) it is not so drastic as to utterly fail to comport with real world anatomical variance.

 

Imo this isn't so much about just bigger size, but about changed proportions like Avrel's body seems to be only ~5 times as big as her head, while the older models are ~6times as big as their head (normal is ~7 times your head). Here is a pic that shows where "heroic scale" will take the proportions of a miniature.

 

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-0HvMkQ1bHTQ/Tt2KutAio9I/AAAAAAAAFK8/dvfomLgs1yI/s1600/comparison.jpg

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