New Imperial Admiral and Devastator

[Hastatior 1,444]

Thinking aloud.

 

If you ditch defense tokens and then recover them with the admiral and then ditch them again do you get MORE Devastaror dice?

 

In other words does this admiral increase the potential dice output of a devastator to 14 dice?

[Lyraeus 4,759]

No. We also have his question in the rules forum.

I am of the mind that each ship has a set number of tokens that a ship gains at the beginning of the game. Getting a used token back is not a 5th token then.

[Drasnighta 26,573]

Yes, in the Rules Forum, where it was raised originally on Reddit...

Quite back and forth.

TL:DR, I made an argument based on States, backed up by Lyraeus pointing out how many Tokens a Ship is defined as having...

Others make other arguments.

We'll get an FAQ Eventually...  

~1 Month after General Release, at the EARLIEST...  As FFG puts a Moratorium on it.

[Madaghmire 7,202]

Not to comment on the validity of any arguments, or what I think the rules are here, but I hope they faq this relationship to mean dev gets mad dice. Because atm that card is hot garbage.

[Snipafist 7,392]

Not to comment on the validity of any arguments, or what I think the rules are here, but I hope they faq this relationship to mean dev gets mad dice. Because atm that card is hot garbage.

I find I can't disagree with anything said right here.

[Hastatior 1,444]

Yeah, just re-read the title and I have to agree

 

"for each of your discarded defense tokens"

 

this is fairly clear. A token can either be discarded or NOT. If you regain it it is no longer discarded. There is no Schrodingers token

[Hastatior 1,444]

Further thought that is less rules question-y

 

This means the new Admiral will lose devastator dice every time he activates. This makes the Devastator title and the Admiral only synergize in very situational fashion and it will require a strategy and deployment built around making this mess work....

[Lyraeus 4,759]

Yeah, just re-read the title and I have to agree

 

"for each of your discarded defense tokens"

 

this is fairly clear. A token can either be discarded or NOT. If you regain it it is no longer discarded. There is no Schrodingers token

Someone could always make the argument but it won't be me. I have enough people remembering me for "silly" questions

[MandalorianMoose 1,781]

It all depends on how they define the regained token. Say you discard brace A turn 4, and then chose to gain a brace token during turn 5. Are you getting brace A back, or will you be getting a new token, brace B? That distinction needs to be made for the ruling to be clear one way or the other.

Edited May 3, 2016 by MandalorianMoose

[thecactusman17 3,170]

I too would like an official answer.

For what is worth, I read the Devastator literally: for *every* token discarded add a die. It doesn't seem to care about a state, just the act of discarding the token. And that insane 14 die attack can only happen on turns 5 and 6. In most games, by that point it's going to be of limited utility.

[Ardaedhel 10,807]

^ This is why I said we need a ruling on it even though I personally think it's pretty obvious what the intent is.

Also, to keep the clutter down on the main forum (gotta make room for the Demo/Rieekan QQ and the VSD/MC80 bashing ) and avoid rehashing the same points, this probably belongs in the Rules Questions area. There's a thread there already that I started a couple days ago: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/218746-devastator-tagge-and-the-meaning-of-discarded/

[Blail Blerg 7,335]

I too would love t to be FAQ Ed or erratad so that devastate can give you 8 more dice.

Is there a rule on when you can spend your tokens btw? If there's no combat. Or you aren't in combat with the current two ships can you spend tokens? Based on Jan and Intel agent ing yourself I think you could?

[Drasnighta 26,573]

I too would love t to be FAQ Ed or erratad so that devastate can give you 8 more dice.

Is there a rule on when you can spend your tokens btw? If there's no combat. Or you aren't in combat with the current two ships can you spend tokens? Based on Jan and Intel agent ing yourself I think you could?

 

No.

 

Both of the processes you described above still conform to the timing windows of spending Tokens...  Which is "During this attack", and they are spent at the appropriate times for tokens.

The FAQ expliticly states that you cannot spend Defense Tokens outside of the standard timing windows in order to fuel the Devestator card.

[Lyraeus 4,759]

It all depends on how they define the regained token. Say you discard brace A turn 4, and then chose to gain a brace token during turn 5. Are you getting brace A back, or will you be getting a new token, brace B? That distinction needs to be made for the ruling to be clear one way or the other.

I go by the ship card. It shows X number of tokens. So far there is no way to add to that number so all you are doing is recovering one of the X tokens on the card.

[Salted Diamond 591]

As it's wording is "for each of your discared defense tokens",  Once you recover it, it is no longer discarded.  The verbiage IMO prevents stacking.  If Devastator stated "for each token you have discarded..." then I could see room to argue.  Word syntax makes a difference here. 

[Drasnighta 26,573]

....

 

"Since I purchased my Imperial Star Destroyer, I have discarded 96 Defense Tokens over its life...

 

...  So let me just go and borrow everyone's dice for this attack...  Don't worry, its only one attack a round like this..."

Edited May 4, 2016 by Drasnighta