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Conjurer questions

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Hi y'all,

 

Me and some collegues are playing the Shadow of Nerekhal campain, and I am playing as the conjurer. The problem is that it feels as it is very powerful (as in game breaking), so I am wondering if we have missed some rules.

First of, whan placing a Mirror Image (either through the mirror image ability, or the refraction ability) do you need line of sight to the space where the mirror image is placed?

Secondly, is it possible to move through portcullises using the Sleight of Mind ability? That seems like it could end missions like "local politics" quite quick.

 

Anyone who can see what we've missed?

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First of, whan placing a Mirror Image (either through the mirror image ability, or the refraction ability) do you need line of sight to the space where the mirror image is placed?

 

You do not require line of sight to place a mirror image, however, you must be able to count 2 spaces to that image (see rules for counting spaces), and the space must be empty.

 

Secondly, is it possible to move through portcullises using the Sleight of Mind ability? That seems like it could end missions like "local politics" quite quick.

 

Yes, you can move through portcullis with teleportation abilities because it is allowed to count spaces through them. The conjurer isn't the only one who can do this. Certain heroic feats and abilities, as well as classes like the Shadow Walker and Geomancer can also teleport through the portcullis. The quests with these features were designed with this possibility in mind.

 

Generally, it will only be one or two heroes that are capable of the teleportation, so the Overlord can usually act to punish the heroes splitting up the party like this, as well as blocking the teleportation with figures that fill up empty spaces.

 

The Conjurer is powerful and capable of some awesome heroics (especially with a Stamina potion), but certainly not game breaking. It is a very stamina intensive class, and carelessly placed images can be picked off by range units, often leaving the mage drained and forced to rest.

 

Geomancer stones being obstacles are more useful for blocking than image tokens a lot of the time (e.g. The stones block the Scamper ability and counting spaces, but the images don't), and the Runemaster is vastly superior for early game damage and multi-target options, while being far more stamina-friendly.

Edited by Charmy

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Charmy is right on with answers. As for your balance question, the conjurer is very powerful, but has several glaring weaknesses which the OL can attack, depending how the conjurer plays:

-image tokens are super wimpy. Not only that, but they are vulnerable to monster abilities. If you can make one suffer a single wound or even a single fatigue (like from Howl) the conjurer will suffer a wound and a fatigue. REMEMBER that hitting an image hard does no good. You can deal 20 damage to an image and the conjurer still just takes a wound and a fatigue. She removes her images before you can damage them? See point 2.

-Images cost fatigues to summon (if using more than one). Drain the conjurer's fatigue and she can't do much. She leaves her images on the map so never needs to resummon? See point 1.

-Some people (me) like to use the conjurer class as a way to keep the conjurer herself safe. (Why go anywhere near monsters when I can attack from a distance using the tokens?) If the conjurer does this, she is likely far from other heroes, too. If you can KO her, she's in trouble.

Edited by Zaltyre

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Hi y'all,

 

Me and some collegues are playing the Shadow of Nerekhal campain, and I am playing as the conjurer. The problem is that it feels as it is very powerful (as in game breaking), so I am wondering if we have missed some rules.

First of, whan placing a Mirror Image (either through the mirror image ability, or the refraction ability) do you need line of sight to the space where the mirror image is placed?

Secondly, is it possible to move through portcullises using the Sleight of Mind ability? That seems like it could end missions like "local politics" quite quick.

 

Anyone who can see what we've missed?

Remember that the mirror images are not familiars. There was a question about this before, and this person thought that the mirror images can move and attack like the Reanimate from the Necromancer. Playing like this would make the conjurer vastly OP of course.

 

And the OL can easily counter the Conjurer with the means addressed by Zaltyre, just deal one damage to them and the conjurer is quickly drained from health AND fatigue.

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Right- that is a super-important point; image tokens never activate, and they have NO attack pool (if one were ever forced to perform an attack such as by 'dark charm', it wouldn't even roll a blue). Regardless of the armor the conjurer has, the images still only roll their gray when attacked, as well.

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Also, despite the skill stating that they have the Conjuror's stats, images cannot test those attribute except in reaction.

For example, they could test if they are hit by a Howl... but they cannot test to open a locked door

Edited by Alarmed

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Thank's for lots of good answers! I am also trying to coach our OL, since he became a bit dishartend after being rather crushed last adventure (he's a bit green, and I played OL last campain), and I'll let him know of his options.

But then we'll continue to use the Conjuror as she's intended, and I'll try not to break the game for the OL.

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Hello, I´m gonna be playing conjurer class and i found a combo that might be pretty strong. That includes playing conjurer with Lyssa hero, but I dont know if rules dont prohibit the way i want to use her. Do you have any idea, if her ability (optional changing power die to a red die while fighting on melee range) affects her images too? I mean if I spawn image that is adjacent to a monster, may I roll with the red dice, even though I am attacking through the image? Did not find any hint that it would not work, since it is me using the attack action taking range and vision from my image. Thanks for advice / reply.

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Hello, I´m gonna be playing conjurer class and i found a combo that might be pretty strong. That includes playing conjurer with Lyssa hero, but I dont know if rules dont prohibit the way i want to use her. Do you have any idea, if her ability (optional changing power die to a red die while fighting on melee range) affects her images too? I mean if I spawn image that is adjacent to a monster, may I roll with the red dice, even though I am attacking through the image? Did not find any hint that it would not work, since it is me using the attack action taking range and vision from my image. Thanks for advice / reply.

 

When Lyssa attacks through a mirror image using Channeling, she attacks measuring range and line of sight from her image token, and not herself. However, the heroic ability requires that she herself be adjacent to the target, I would say she should not be allowed to use her heroic ability in this case.

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Astarra conjurer is hell. She has 4 willpower, so her images "have" immunity to howl, she is fast as Sonic and nearly unstopable with elven boots (immobilize won't work cause to her ability). 

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Astarra conjurer is hell. She has 4 willpower, so her images "have" immunity to howl, she is fast as Sonic and nearly unstopable with elven boots (immobilize won't work cause to her ability). 

I know I've mentioned this before, but she is my favorite conjurer, and that's exactly why.

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Sorry, but for Lyssa, you're wrong

 

Kara Centell-Dunk

08/08/2015Vous

Hey Alex,
 
2) Lyssa’s figure must be adjacent to the target, adjacent image tokens will not trigger her hero ability.
Edited by rugal

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Astarra conjurer is hell. She has 4 willpower, so her images "have" immunity to howl, she is fast as Sonic and nearly unstopable with elven boots (immobilize won't work cause to her ability). 

 

I've played with almost all of the mages throughout many campaigns and I have come to the inevitable conclusion that Astarra is the best Mage in the entire game.

 

She will excel at pretty much any role, whether it is Conjurer, Runemaster, Geomancer... you name it :)

 

Her heroic ability is very overpowered in my view..

Edited by Charmy

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Yeah the Conjurer is kind of tricky to play and to play against.

 

As an OL it's always a good idea to attack the images if you have a bunch of small monsters, if you only have very few big and strong monsters the Conjurer can get really powerfull. However if you destroy the images, the Conjurer will get considerably weaker. He already needs a lot of fatigue, so killing the images will make him max his fatigue pretty quickly and then taking 2 damages everytime an image gets destroyed.

 

While you still can play the Conjurer with very few images, he will turn more into a super mobile mage, but his damage output won't get boosted by his skills this way.

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Since Conjurer images are treated as heroes, does Andira Runehand hero ability proc with it?

1) if a clone (who is within Andira ability range) gets defeated, will attacker take damage?

2) if a clone (who isn't within Andira ability range, but The Conjurer is) gets defeated, Conjurer takes damage, will attacker still take damage?

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Since Conjurer images are treated as heroes, does Andira Runehand hero ability proc with it?

1) if a clone (who is within Andira ability range) gets defeated, will attacker take damage?

2) if a clone (who isn't within Andira ability range, but The Conjurer is) gets defeated, Conjurer takes damage, will attacker still take damage?

 

1) I would say no. Andira Runehand's ability requires that the hearts be suffered from an attack. While the attack is responsible for defeating the image token, the damage to the hero comes from the Mirror Image skill card, and not the attack itself.

 

2) Again, I would say no. Same reason: It is the Mirror Image card dealing the damage, not the attack.

 

Similarly, if a lieutenant damages a hero by using the Shield of Zorek's Favor, that will not trigger Andira's ability.

 

Essentially, hearts suffered "from an attack" refers only to the final hearts dealt after the rolling of attack dice, the resolution of surges and the cancelling out of damage from defense dice. Any other sources of damage that occur as a result of the attack from abilities do not count.

Edited by Charmy

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Alright

Since Conjurer images are treated as heroes, does Andira Runehand hero ability proc with it?

1) if a clone (who is within Andira ability range) gets defeated, will attacker take damage?

2) if a clone (who isn't within Andira ability range, but The Conjurer is) gets defeated, Conjurer takes damage, will attacker still take damage?

1) I would say no. Andira Runehand's ability requires that the hearts be suffered from an attack. While the attack is responsible for defeating the image token, the damage to the hero comes from the Mirror Image skill card, and not the attack itself.

2) Again, I would say no. Same reason: It is the Mirror Image card dealing the damage, not the attack.

Similarly, if a lieutenant damages a hero by using the Shield of Zorek's Favor, that will not trigger Andira's ability.

Essentially, hearts suffered "from an attack" refers only to the final hearts dealt after the rolling of attack dice, the resolution of surges and the cancelling out of damage from defense dice. Any other sources of damage that occur as a result of the attack from abilities do not count.

Alright. But somehow I think, #1 can be proced due to clone is treated as hero, and it suffers Heart by an attack. When it suffers heart (it will proc Andira), then it is discarded. However It won't proc when clone suffers Fatigue though. Edited by Caporai

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If an image token is attacked and suffers 1 damage, Andira's hero ability can trigger (because the image token is treated like a hero. If as the result of the image token suffering a damage the conjurer suffers damage, this will NOT trigger andira's ability, as charmy said.

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If an image token is attacked and suffers 1 damage, Andira's hero ability can trigger (because the image token is treated like a hero. If as the result of the image token suffering a damage the conjurer suffers damage, this will NOT trigger andira's ability, as charmy said.

 

Ah yes, excellent point. Although the damage to the Conjurer from the skill card isn't counted, the mirror image itself *is* being treated as a hero figure, which means that if it is harmed by an attack while within range of Andira, the attacker will be punished.

 

Thanks for the catch.

Edited by Charmy

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Hey!

I have one question concerning "Mirror Image": It states "Use this card during your turn and suffer Fatigue equal to the number of image tokens on the map. Then, place 1 image token in an empty space within 2 spaces of your figure."

As it doesn't state "exhaust this card", does it mean that I can use the card several times in my turn? So in theory, I could summon all four images in one turn (with an hero who has at least six stamina), right?

 

Cheers!

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55 minutes ago, Andi1066 said:

I also Love syndrael as an conjurer via the hybrids...teleportation rune in Act 1 / or the port skill is a must have though

I am pretty sure the ruleing on Syndraels heroic ability is that she can not end her turn in a different space than she started in, it does not have to be the result of a move action, so teleporting or porting to images would still count as a move and so she would not recover fatigue.

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