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RodianClone

Who has seen the official Rogue One trailer yet?

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On a side note I'd really like them to have Imperial Army troopers play the incompetent enemy forces for once; because the film stormtroopers are laughable as a special forces level of unit.

Oh, you mean the incompetent soldiers that were able to take a fortified position through a choke point with minimal losses? The ones that totally curb stomped the rebels on Hoth? Those incompetent soliders?

The ones who lost to teddy bears despite having armored support, yes. Edited by Jace911

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Oh, I'm sorry - I assumed you watched all of Return of the Jedi instead of nodding asleep. There was a section of the movie you missed where the outnumbered stormtroopers fought their way out from a surrounded position and were actually doing pretty well for themselves until they broke up into smaller units to pursue into the woods.

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Oh, I'm sorry - I assumed you watched all of Return of the Jedi instead of nodding asleep. There was a section of the movie you missed where the outnumbered stormtroopers fought their way out from a surrounded position and were actually doing pretty well for themselves until they broke up into smaller units to pursue into the woods.

Outnumbered by teddy bears with sticks, oh no. Whatever shall we do with our superior firepower, training, and heavy vehicles?

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Oh, I'm sorry - I assumed you watched all of Return of the Jedi instead of nodding asleep. There was a section of the movie you missed where the outnumbered stormtroopers fought their way out from a surrounded position and were actually doing pretty well for themselves until they broke up into smaller units to pursue into the woods.

Outnumbered by teddy bears with sticks, oh no. Whatever shall we do with our superior firepower, training, and heavy vehicles?

 

 

Get killed by overwhelming numbers, unfriendly terrain, and an entrenched force.

 

Don't underestimate the power of numbers and ambush tactics.  They work far better than many realize.

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haha, well that's the point, they are so freaking bad its laughable to think they've even fired a blaster before.

Maybe they were just taught how to stand in neatly shaped squares on parade grounds.

 

However they are repeatedly both in old and new canon referred to as "elite shock troops", "elite soldiers", etc.

Even the AoR CRB says that the average citizen is only likely to ever see Imperial Army Troopers (infantryman); implying that stormtroopers are a much more select group.

Well the old canon means two things; Jek and Poodoo, and Jek left town. As for the new, while I admit I haven't read everything yet, I don't recall something that states stormtroopers are the elite troops. Rebels shows the oppsite, that they are the standard trooper. You have to remember, the Republic didn't have a standing army - that is why the clones came about, so the Stormtroopers are the largest trained military force the Galaxy has seen in a very long time.

As for Age of Rebellion, it is wrong about SO many things. It was rehashing the old WEG tripe about stormtroopers being elite with a never seen in any comic, movie, novel, or really any source but the RPG's imperial army trooper. Yes, there are officers and vehicle crews as part of the army, but stormtroopers are the foot soldiers of the Empire. When someone plays a game, reads a book or comic, they likely imagine stormtroopers as the enemy troops not some other equipped trooper.

As for sources that cite stormtroopers as generic troops:

Rebels - taking local child populations and turning them into soldiers. Capable ones (and those "too capable") are noted and recommended for further training in vehicles piloting, or if "too capable" they get to meet an inqusitor.

Twilight Company - one secondary character is a Stormtrooper, she joined the forces and on duty she is little more than a guard/police officer, arresting civilians. Off duty, she helps her father (or uncles) bar patrons. She is a regular person

Lost Stars - the officers seem to have a different training academy then stormtroopers. Officers end up being the "highly trained" troops, though many once conpleted the necessary requirements of combat training let them atrophy. These are usually the corrupt and more politically minded officer. The conniving ones, as it were. If you don't have the necessary talents to become a pilot or officer, you go to stormtrooper school.

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Outnumbered by teddy bears with sticks, oh no. Whatever shall we do with our superior firepower, training, and heavy vehicles?

Ewoks had more than just "sticks". In fact, they were quite advanced for a primitive civilization. They had enough advanced engineering concepts to build a villiage above ground in the trees - one that was connected by bridges and bridges and was quite large. They had catapults, elaborate traps, and most impressively mastered flight. Did they have metallurgical talent? Not that we saw, perhaps Endor was very poor mineral wise. Instead, the ewoks developed their technology with what was avaliable, and their technology was quite good considering they didn't have even a blacksmith.

So, ewoks are apparently quite intelligent and advanced. We also see in the film several examples of them, quite quickly, figuring out imperial equipment. One flies a speeder bike, when taking put the AT-ST crew, they startered operating the vehicle. Also, when the empire was defeated and the ewoks were cheering, I recall at least ONE that was holding an E-11 rifle - and while most depicted had spears, bolas and bows, at least a few seemingly took their enemies weapons to use.

As for training, it is extremely arrogant to equate "training" as something that only "advanced" cultures can inplement. What of the training of an ewok hunter? Wicket (the ewok that met Leia) used his heigtened senses and dissapeared from view. So the ewoks were trained in stealth. They were obviously hunters, but were small. Now we haven't really seen much in the way of the fauna on the Endor moon, but for a single ewok hunter to be out by themselves, I'm sure he was quite trained in killing animals by hitting vital spots - a stormtroopers armour has a number of weak spots - basically anything black is little more than fabric. A spear or stone knife jabbed into those spots will kill you just as much as a blaster. Ewoks attack from stealth with numbers. They sermingly do hit and run tactics. Ewok hunters and engineers were quite well trained at what they do.

As to the vehicles, we can assume a few things really; the ewoks were helped in making these large traps to deal with the walkers, and The rebels helped make these large traps. Or, the Ewoks had encountered large beasts or the empire vehicles before, and those traps were already there. This once again brings up the Ewok technological prowess of felling huge trees, and making traps that can take out an AT-ST.

Now before you complain about the AT-ST being crushed, remember, that The Empire fights foes that mainly have blasters and other galactic norm technology. While the armour of an AT-ST is quite good at repelling blasters, having two, probably at least a ton in weight, logs smash into your vehicle that was not designed to repel such a massive physical force crushed it.

All in all, I can see why Endor was never colonized. Stealthy, technologically advanced (though not in materal fabrication ways) indigenous population that will EAT you. I'm sure many of those Stormtroopers stationed there were quite afraid for their lives. The empire had been there a while, and I'm sure in that time, patrols were lost, digesting in Ewok bellies. No, the demon bears of Endor are NOT to be scoffed at.

If you go out in the woods today, you are in for a big surprise indeed... This teddy bear picnic has stormtrooper on the menu.

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That's a load of poo. Stormtroopers are trained to fight anywhere in the galaxy. Just because the enemy has sticks and stones instead of blasters doesn't make their job harder. There is no good explanation for the Ewok victory. You can try to rationalize because that's what the story called for, but there's just no way it should have happened. Compare it to the Gungans. They at least had some exotic tech that gave them a fighting chance. Too bad their tactics were total crap, but again, plot says good guys have to win even when they shouldn't.

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That's a load of poo. Stormtroopers are trained to fight anywhere in the galaxy. Just because the enemy has sticks and stones instead of blasters doesn't make their job harder. There is no good explanation for the Ewok victory. You can try to rationalize because that's what the story called for, but there's just no way it should have happened. Compare it to the Gungans. They at least had some exotic tech that gave them a fighting chance. Too bad their tactics were total crap, but again, plot says good guys have to win even when they shouldn't.

 

Well, the Gungans DID lose, but it was PODRACING that saved them!

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If you are "badass" I guess you can't be a real person with real, human feelings and a personality.. I have known and worked with troubled kids, some foster kids and I have to say that being alone since age X doesn't make you automatically a grown up with no "pouting". Everyone is different. Some are badass and still do a little "pouting".... That being said, where was the pouting in the trailer again?

Edited by RodianClone

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That's a load of poo. Stormtroopers are trained to fight anywhere in the galaxy. Just because the enemy has sticks and stones instead of blasters doesn't make their job harder. There is no good explanation for the Ewok victory. You can try to rationalize because that's what the story called for, but there's just no way it should have happened. Compare it to the Gungans. They at least had some exotic tech that gave them a fighting chance. Too bad their tactics were total crap, but again, plot says good guys have to win even when they shouldn't.

Arrogance on the part of the empire. They didn't see the ewoks as a viable threat, and were surprised by them. Or they didn't know they were there, making them incompetent.

Lets be honest, if I was the commander of an evil empire garrison I would slaughter any indigenous population that existed. I would have clear cut the forest around the bunker so I could see any approaching enemies, and inside the bunker I would have set up an E-web to fire on any thing that opened the door without a certain code.

So of course we have to rationalize. The empire is so inept at everything they do, to make them them a credible threat we have to play up their opponents.

The empire is so stupid, they didn't fire on an sermingly empty escape pod, with no life forms, despite the fact that it could logically hold a data tape (or thumb drive for modern equivalent) with the stolen plans. Heck, even if you don't want to tell the troops that you are looking for stolen plans, at least TELL them to destroy or at least tractor ANYTHING jettisoned from the captured ship. Instead we get: "Hold your fire. No life forms, must have short circuited" ?! That guy was either an idiot, or a part of the rebellion. Firing a laser won't cost that much, and would prevent any hidden items from being recovered.

So of course the bad guys have to lose. If we had competant bad guys, the film would be over in 10 minutes.

So yes, I am trying to give a way that the Emperor's best troops can be defeated by "teddy bears" in a logical way. It is that or accept that the only training a stormtrooper actually gets is putting thier helmet on the right way and which end of a blaster to point at the enemy.

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Imperial Stormtrooper Marksmanship Academy

"This is a degree of Truth in Television, as by far most shots fired in firefights or combat are misses. Some sources report that in WWII, the average soldier needed to fire two hundred rounds for every hit scored on an enemy; numerous other examples are mentioned in the Real Lifesection of this page. So the fictional bad guys don't actually suffer from unrealistic inaccuracy; rather, the heroes' fictional performance would count as Improbable Aiming Skills in real life."

Edited by RodianClone

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If you are "badass" I guess you can't be a real person with real, human feelings and a personality.. I have known and worked with troubled kids, some foster kids and I have to say that being alone since age X doesn't make you automatically a grown up with no "pouting". Everyone is different. Some are badass and still do a little "pouting".... That being said, where was the pouting in the trailer again?

I guess the pouting comment really struck a nerve. I have no idea what "foster kids" has to do with anything, it's like you're bouncing around looking for a reason to be mad. But I'm sure with time and counselling you'll get over it.

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Oh, I'm sorry - I assumed you watched all of Return of the Jedi instead of nodding asleep. There was a section of the movie you missed where the outnumbered stormtroopers fought their way out from a surrounded position and were actually doing pretty well for themselves until they broke up into smaller units to pursue into the woods.

Outnumbered by teddy bears with sticks, oh no. Whatever shall we do with our superior firepower, training, and heavy vehicles?

 

 

Right, so you've not actually seen Return of the Jedi. Got it.

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If you are "badass" I guess you can't be a real person with real, human feelings and a personality.. I have known and worked with troubled kids, some foster kids and I have to say that being alone since age X doesn't make you automatically a grown up with no "pouting". Everyone is different. Some are badass and still do a little "pouting".... That being said, where was the pouting in the trailer again?

I guess the pouting comment really struck a nerve. I have no idea what "foster kids" has to do with anything, it's like you're bouncing around looking for a reason to be mad. But I'm sure with time and counselling you'll get over it.

 

 

Nah, I`m not really mad.... And it was more of a loose answer to the " if someone is "on their own from the age of 15" they tend to grow the **** up." Not the "pouting" comment, that term just stuck around in my mind I guess. So I just compared with people and kids I know that has grown up more or less alone. But out of context, I see how the foster kids might come out of nowhere. :P 

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Sorry, was cranky this AM.

 

Basically it comes down to not liking the teaser on many levels.  The TFA teaser was awesome, this was the usual crap.  I don't care about slight equipment mods or new vehicles, I'm interested in character and drama.  The only good character moment was Mon Mothma looking bemused (or maternally tolerant) at the "I rebel" line.

 

But it's Star Wars, so I'll watch it no matter what :)

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Sorry, was cranky this AM.

 

Basically it comes down to not liking the teaser on many levels.  The TFA teaser was awesome, this was the usual crap.  I don't care about slight equipment mods or new vehicles, I'm interested in character and drama.  The only good character moment was Mon Mothma looking bemused (or maternally tolerant) at the "I rebel" line.

 

But it's Star Wars, so I'll watch it no matter what :)

 

What I find funny is how many people are so pissy about her lips.  "OMG she has pouty face!  NOBODY over the age of 12 has pouty face!! WORST TRAILER EVER!"  Um, you do realize that lips come in various shapes and designs right?  We have "Resting Bit** Face", pretty sure "Resting Pout Face" is a thing too.

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Sorry, was cranky this AM.

 

Basically it comes down to not liking the teaser on many levels.  The TFA teaser was awesome, this was the usual crap.  I don't care about slight equipment mods or new vehicles, I'm interested in character and drama.  The only good character moment was Mon Mothma looking bemused (or maternally tolerant) at the "I rebel" line.

 

But it's Star Wars, so I'll watch it no matter what :)

 

What I find funny is how many people are so pissy about her lips.  "OMG she has pouty face!  NOBODY over the age of 12 has pouty face!! WORST TRAILER EVER!"  Um, you do realize that lips come in various shapes and designs right?  We have "Resting Bit** Face", pretty sure "Resting Pout Face" is a thing too.

 

I had no idea that Resting ***** Face was a real thing until Wikipedia showed me the truth. Now I know, and knowing is... Well hardly half of anything.

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Sorry, was cranky this AM.

 

Basically it comes down to not liking the teaser on many levels.  The TFA teaser was awesome, this was the usual crap.  I don't care about slight equipment mods or new vehicles, I'm interested in character and drama.  The only good character moment was Mon Mothma looking bemused (or maternally tolerant) at the "I rebel" line.

 

But it's Star Wars, so I'll watch it no matter what :)

 

What I find funny is how many people are so pissy about her lips.  "OMG she has pouty face!  NOBODY over the age of 12 has pouty face!! WORST TRAILER EVER!"  Um, you do realize that lips come in various shapes and designs right?  We have "Resting Bit** Face", pretty sure "Resting Pout Face" is a thing too.

 

 

Lips are a physical feature.  I have no problem with her lips.

A pout is an expression.  An actor should be in control of their expressions.  If an actor has "resting <any> face" in a scene, they aren't acting.

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Sorry, was cranky this AM.

 

Basically it comes down to not liking the teaser on many levels.  The TFA teaser was awesome, this was the usual crap.  I don't care about slight equipment mods or new vehicles, I'm interested in character and drama.  The only good character moment was Mon Mothma looking bemused (or maternally tolerant) at the "I rebel" line.

 

But it's Star Wars, so I'll watch it no matter what :)

 

I see. Good points! I actually liked the trailer. It was still just a teaser, even if it was a bit longer, an managed to tease me and set the mood and get me intrigued...

But I agree with you that character moments are way more interesting and eventually is what makes me like or dislike the movie for the most part. Like my story and character developement teacher said in animation school, "the characters are the story!"

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Sorry, was cranky this AM.

 

Basically it comes down to not liking the teaser on many levels.  The TFA teaser was awesome, this was the usual crap.  I don't care about slight equipment mods or new vehicles, I'm interested in character and drama.  The only good character moment was Mon Mothma looking bemused (or maternally tolerant) at the "I rebel" line.

 

But it's Star Wars, so I'll watch it no matter what :)

 

What I find funny is how many people are so pissy about her lips.  "OMG she has pouty face!  NOBODY over the age of 12 has pouty face!! WORST TRAILER EVER!"  Um, you do realize that lips come in various shapes and designs right?  We have "Resting Bit** Face", pretty sure "Resting Pout Face" is a thing too.

 

 

Lips are a physical feature.  I have no problem with her lips.

A pout is an expression.  An actor should be in control of their expressions.  If an actor has "resting <any> face" in a scene, they aren't acting.

 

 

Sure, but when did she pout?... I mean, more than Luke?

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