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Brother Malachai

Throwing a Primed Meltabomb?

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"Throwing objects", Corebook p.209.

And I would say that you'll need to modify detonator with Demolition skill, if you want explosion at the same moment when bomb hit.

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RAW a melta bomb has to be placed.

 

From the descriptions its beam has to be focused on the actual target to work best, with a Blast Radius of 5 however the rules mostly ignore that part tho.

If you want it to work then I'd go with the following:
Full Action Demolition Skill test. Has to be made for a specific target in a specific situation to set the Timer right.

-20 Demolition Skill test to attach some sort of different trigger like proximity or remote.

(4 DoF still blow you up)

Range = SBx3/8, it weights 8 times as much as a regular grenade and its design is not made to be thrown.

Behaves just like a Grenade for the Scatter and possible "jam".

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Range = SBx3/8, it weights 8 times as much as a regular grenade and its design is not made to be thrown.

 

You don't need houserules when you have official rules.

Corebook, p.209:

 

"character can attempt to throw just about any object that weighs up to half the character’s normal Lifting Weight (as indicated by Table 7–7: Carrying, Lifting, and Pushing Weights). To throw an object, a character makes a Challenging (+0) Strength Test.

A successful test means that the object flies a number of metres equal to his Strength Bonus. For each Degree of Success, this distance increases by a factor of one, so one degree means that the character throws the object a number of metres equal to twice his Strength Bonus, two degrees means that the object is thrown a number of metres equal to three times his Strength Bonus, and so forth. On a failed test, the object flies a number of metres equal to half his Strength Bonus (round down; a result of 0 means it fell at his feet).

...

If the object is being thrown at a specific target, it is treated as an improvised weapon and the throwing character makes a Ballistic Skill Test instead of a Strength Test. A character can attempt to throw an object that weighs more than half his Lifting Weight, but such tests are Hard (–20)."

Edited by Jargal

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RAW a melta bomb has to be placed.

 

From the descriptions its beam has to be focused on the actual target to work best, with a Blast Radius of 5 however the rules mostly ignore that part tho.

If you want it to work then I'd go with the following:

Full Action Demolition Skill test. Has to be made for a specific target in a specific situation to set the Timer right.

-20 Demolition Skill test to attach some sort of different trigger like proximity or remote.

(4 DoF still blow you up)

Range = SBx3/8, it weights 8 times as much as a regular grenade and its design is not made to be thrown.

Behaves just like a Grenade for the Scatter and possible "jam".

 

 

Yes, but don't meltabomb's also have a timer?  Just set it to go off in one or two turns, etc...before throwing.

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Range = SBx3/8, it weights 8 times as much as a regular grenade and its design is not made to be thrown.

 

I'm not sure about the not made to be thrown. Exhibit A:

 

meltabomb_by_elysiantrooper-d30e3jq.jpg

 

Exhibit B:

 

gallery_22056_810_59686.jpg

 

I mean, with that handle it seems quite comfortable to throw for me ;) Size shouldn't be a problem as well.

 

Furthermore, the official games like Dawn of War 2 or Eternal Crusade include the Melta Bomb as something explicitly to throw.

 

Regarding the range, I don't get why a marine should only be able to throw this little thing about 4 meters, that seems like a joke to me. We're still talking about ******* Space Marines, aren't we? Even though the throw rules are pretty broken (think of caber tossing terminators), it really shouldn't be a problem for a marine to throw that thing at his enemys. Except they're Eldar.

Edited by Avdnm

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Regarding the range, I don't get why a marine should only be able to throw this little thing about 4 meters, that seems like a joke to me. We're still talking about ******* Space Marines, aren't we?

 

 

He will throw this little thing only for 4 meter if he will fail Ordinary (+10) Strength test. For average Space Marine (Str 40+) in Power Armor it's only 30-percent or lower chance.

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With Str 40 it's actually just a 20 percent chance to fail on a +10 Test (+20 from armour, +10 from Unnatural Strength). And the 4 meters related to "SBx3/8". 4 meters on a fail seems more accurate to me.

 

Edit: Wait, did you make it an ordinary (+10) test because of Unnatural Strength? I'm kinda confused now.

Edited by Avdnm

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As for the Melta Bomb being thrown I just refered to the RAW entry. As such they are not throwable weapons.

Also I would not take the DoW games to serious as a fluff resource or it is quite common to lose some 100 Baneblades somewhere...

As for the TableTop you also had to be in Assault to use a Melta Bomb if that did not change.

 

I do know that there is a rule for throwing stuff yet I wanted to avoid testing all the time and a strict formula like SBx3/8 gives some hard numbers you can work with just as you do with grenades. Throwing a St Test and then a BS Test for one thing after you already had to made a Demo Test may be a bit excessive.

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As for the Melta Bomb being thrown I just refered to the RAW entry. As such they are not throwable weapons.

Also I would not take the DoW games to serious as a fluff resource or it is quite common to lose some 100 Baneblades somewhere...

As for the TableTop you also had to be in Assault to use a Melta Bomb if that did not change.

 

I do know that there is a rule for throwing stuff yet I wanted to avoid testing all the time and a strict formula like SBx3/8 gives some hard numbers you can work with just as you do with grenades. Throwing a St Test and then a BS Test for one thing after you already had to made a Demo Test may be a bit excessive.

 

 

Yes, but does it make sense that a space marine could toss a small vehicle as a "improvised thrown" but not a meltabomb?  It really doesn't.  :-/

 

How is this any different than throwing a chunk of C4 or a Claymore Mine?  It's not gonna fly as well as a grenade, but you can still throw it. And we don't have gene implants or power armor!

Edited by Brother Malachai

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Yes, but does it make sense that a space marine could toss a small vehicle as a "improvised thrown" but not a meltabomb?  It really doesn't.  :-/

 

Yep, with that logic throwing of unarmored man (75 kg) will work at SBx3/53 - for Str50 Astartes in PA maximum range will be... 2,7 meters.

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More or less yes. Given the verious descriptions a melta bomb is or might be more or less a potent one-time melta charge you point at the direction you want to screw and most likely it might also screw some stuff arround that. tho the initial target will suffer the most.

 

The fact is that the combat rules are an abstraction. Throwing a man and failing in doing so is just as laughable as shooting a bolt round into a humans head and him still surviving. Can happen. Has happened. Even the standard rules for throwing grenades are stupid in that regard.

A US army survey stated that a M67 Grenade can be reliably and accuratly thrown up to 40 meters with a casulty radius of 15 and a deadly radius of 5 metres. How do the frag grenades compare to that? Well wouldnt it be for the implants and power armor the throwing distance alone might be a problem...

 

THe question is: Given that the entire game is already an abstraction do you really wanna come up for some super realistic rules for something that might happen once every three evenings? Well if you do so please rewrite the entire rulebook. Or just stick with a simple range code that wont change much, shows that it is harder and makes this work like being improvised for this is NOT the intended way to use it.

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THe question is: Given that the entire game is already an abstraction do you really wanna come up for some super realistic rules for something that might happen once every three evenings? Well if you do so please rewrite the entire rulebook.

 

But this is exactly what I'm talking about. That is why I suggest using RAW.

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But this is exactly what I'm talking about. That is why I suggest using RAW.

 

RAW in this case just results in a myriad of dice rolls for a single actions that might actually not have an impact worth mentioning in the first place.

I want my combat to be somewhat quick and not consume 2+ hours so every weapon has its profile, gets used and done.

 

Declaring a Target

Rolling for Demolition

Throwing

Rolling for how far you actually manage to throw

Rolling for BS (What range modifier now?)

Rolling for Scatter

Rolling for Damage

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So, for simplification rules changing is allowed without "total rulebook rewriting"? ;)

Honestly, I don't think that we must continue this dispute. We offered some options for Brother Malachai, now he can choose any of them.

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I would not allow to throw it as an effective weapon in the first place taking RAW into account.

(Unless you just want to throw it like a stone)

And yea, I prefer simplfication in an abstract, already simplified system rather than singeling out something rather rare and making it the only thing that follows real world physics or uncommon rules and requires a multitude of diece.

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Ok speaking as a FNG with no military experience that has studied things a lot, I'd say a melta bomb is in some ways like a shaped charge bomb. When a shaped charge explodes, most of the force is directed in one tight direction that is mean to concentrate it to penetrate armor by focusing tremendous force on one point, but there is still an explosion centered on the bomb as not all the force is focused into the shaped charge effect. So you could in theory use a shaped charge as a bomb, and it might kill or infure people near it thru the secondary blast effect but it's mostly going to be wasted and thus would only be used in am emergency.

I think a melta bomb might be the same. it releases a lot of heat so it makes an area effect but it's meant to be placed so most of the force is directed against a specific target, i.e. what it's placed too.  As such I'd say it might do damage in an area effect, but not get an armor penetration bonus except against a target it was placed on.

I suppose in an emergency you could chuck it into a tyranid horde and fry a few guants on even warriors, but it's a waste of the bomb's primary power.

 

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Range = SBx3/8, it weights 8 times as much as a regular grenade and its design is not made to be thrown.

 

I'm not sure about the not made to be thrown. Exhibit A:

 

meltabomb_by_elysiantrooper-d30e3jq.jpg

 

Exhibit B:

 

gallery_22056_810_59686.jpg

 

I mean, with that handle it seems quite comfortable to throw for me ;) Size shouldn't be a problem as well.

 

Furthermore, the official games like Dawn of War 2 or Eternal Crusade include the Melta Bomb as something explicitly to throw.

 

Regarding the range, I don't get why a marine should only be able to throw this little thing about 4 meters, that seems like a joke to me. We're still talking about ******* Space Marines, aren't we? Even though the throw rules are pretty broken (think of caber tossing terminators), it really shouldn't be a problem for a marine to throw that thing at his enemys. Except they're Eldar.

The handle could be like a pin on a grenade, you pull it out to activate the timer. You might be meant to pull it out after placing it.

 

Edited by Professor Tanhauser

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