How can i defeat 3 U-Boats with the Empire?

[darks0uls 21]

I would want to know which are the best imperial lists to defeat the famous 3 U-Boats lists and which should be the strategy.

 

Thank you!!

[Vitalis 1,012]

Aces and dodge arcs. Or swarm with even less finesee of going head on.

[Beard 155]

I have seen many ppl playing Uboats in tournaments lately, and they all fail to arc dodgers. If you're specifically going for imperial, then Palp aces, or 3 aces are both solid lists, that not only dominate uboats, but also stand up pretty well to everything else in the meta. Carnor Jax would love to be in your list

[Managarmr 2,353]

Stuff like Omega Leader and Dark Curse also makes hitting them with ordnance more difficult.

[TheRealStarkiller 3,446]

I am going to utilize my Tie Bombers again, even pre-Imperial Veterans.

Let them come! Gammas shoot first!

[Folkenhellfang 132]

After watching the Hoth Open, I'm not sold on Palp Aces being the ultimate answer. That's what lost to U Boats. Now, I don't disagree with the theory: U Boats must have arc to fire, aces Dodge arcs, simple. Only, there is a very high learning curve for aces and mistakes are doubly costly.

Maybe, there is another option. I'm thinking Redline, Vessery, and a cheap bomber, or maybe a 27-28 point Inquisitor. The initial engagement is a bit more worrisome, but it could be possible to take one Jumper out before it shoots.

[blade_mercurial 2,091]

I have been practicing various imperial builds vs torpedo scouts, and Aces are not necessarily in a good situation.  Well played contracted scouts have very large firing arcs and can fan out to cover lots of possible positions.  Its not realistic to expect to be able to arc-dodge all of them, and even 1 lucky shot can put an ace down...

 

Not that I'm saying arc-dodgers have no chance at all.  Because they do.  But you will need to utilize asteroids and you need one ship as bait.  Fel is pretty good here, because of all aces, he's the most likely to evade a 4 dice attack (provided autothrusters is in play).

 

Things that I've found to be good vs u-boats:

- Crackswarm (but you need a few things in your favour: rocks have to be a factor to limit their white s-loop and you need to get at least Range 2 to maximize your damage in the initial shooting turn)

- PS 4 bombers (extra munitions, homing missile + guidance chips).  Unfortunately, this list has some really bad matchups (arc-dodgers & IG88s)

- Alpha Squadron pilot w/ autothrusters.  This little guy is an excellent blocker at 20 points. 

- Vessery w/ TIE/D, tractor beam + ruthlessness (nom, nom, nom) not officially out yet, but he murders contracted scouts---just beware taking multiple torpedoes in the face (1 per turn and he's ok)

- Inquisitor and Soontir Fel.  Not necessarily in the same list, but these guys can hang fine in range 1 of a scout, maybe even 2 (out of arc for autothrusters).  Just don't get blocked!

- Carnor Jax.  Duh.  Doesn't take a genius to figure out why...but still have to be careful.  If he gets blocked and has to eat a torpedo, he's toast!

 

Things that do NOT work well against u-boats:

- 3 ship builds (unless it includes things like Fel, Omega Leader, Inquisitor and Jax)

- Darth Vader (ship).  This makes me sad as he's my favourite imperial pilot.  Unfortunately, even with 3 agility and 2 actions, he just can't stop the 2 attack turret with R4 agromech from trickling damage through, and if he has to eat a plasma torp he almost always loses both shields.  Vader also has to avoid blocks, so he misses out on shots.

- phantoms.  They have the same problem as Vader.  Even with 4 agility and a defensive token, 2 attack dice w/ R4 agromech trickles damage through.  With only 4 health, its inevitable that they will die.  The scouts are also very good at blocking them, so you have to fly very unpredictably, but that can mean giving up shots...

- decimators.  Even if you only take 1 or 2 torpedoes, you can't win the damage race because R4 agromech makes 2 attack turrets deal consistent damage every turn...

 

I still think Vader and even phantoms can do okay if you have Jax or an alpha interceptor for blocking, but if you want to specifically counter torpedo scouts, you'd be better off with Fel or the inquisitor.

 

I have high hopes that either 4 sabres or 2 alphas + 2 royal guards will also be good (on my list of things to try).  TIE defenders w/ x-7 are also extremely good.  They shrug off a single torpedo launch per turn with ease (but sweat if two torpedoes incoming and may die if taking 3).  Flown carefully though, TIE defenders are generally a good answer to the u-boat menace...

Edited April 7, 2016 by blade_mercurial

[Ynot 670]

I beat 2 double toilet seat builds last night with Carnor+PTL+RGT+AT+SD, Dark Curse+SD and Whisper+VI+ACD+FCS+RebCaptive.

 

Game against Dengar(PTL,K4,Unhinged,Punishing One Title,EU) and Manaroo(standard torpedo boat kitting) - I won 100-0.

 

Game against 2 Scout torpedo boats and 4Lom - I won 100-16.

 

Carnor and Dark Curse were both quite instrumental in the wins as both of them deny spending focus which is the torpedo boats big thing.  Carnor easily got into range 1 of them all game.  Whisper stayed back and just kept taking pieces out of them.

 

Based on the success against 2 double lists I would imagine it would do quite well against the triple as well.

 

3rd game last night was against soontir+ptl+at, krassis+hlc+saboteur+(?), alpha+at.  I won this game 100-42 - only lost whisper.

Edited April 7, 2016 by Ynot

[Biophysical 15,761]

I've found FOs with Comm Relay aren't too bad against Torp Scouts.  They can enter combat with a Focus and Evade token, which means they can take minimal damage from 1 torpedo, but can be in real trouble against 2.  The nice thing is they're relatively inexpensive, can sometimes avoid arcs, and even if they take two torpedoes and die, their buddies are typically very resistant to the primary turret of the Scouts, so they can make back the lost points pretty reliably.  

[blade_mercurial 2,091]

I beat 2 double toilet seat builds last night with Carnor+PTL+RGT+AT+SD, Dark Curse+SD and Whisper+VI+ACD+FCS+RebCaptive.

 

Game against Dengar(PTL,K4,Unhinged,Punishing One Title,EU) and Manaroo(standard torpedo boat kitting) - I won 100-0.

 

Game against 2 Scout torpedo boats and 4Lom - I won 100-16.

 

Carnor and Dark Curse were both quite instrumental in the wins as both of them deny spending focus which is the torpedo boats big thing.  Carnor easily got into range 1 of them all game.  Whisper stayed back and just kept taking pieces out of them.

 

Based on the success against 2 double lists I would imagine it would do quite well against the triple as well.

 

3rd game last night was against soontir+ptl+at, krassis+hlc+saboteur+(?), alpha+at.  I won this game 100-42 - only lost whisper.

Dark Curse is actually in trouble vs proton torpedoes (even a lucky plasma torp can do him in).  According to the FAQ, he does not stop deadeye being used to fire the torpedo (only using a focus token to change eyeballs to hits).  He also does not stop guidance chips, nor does he stop the Proton's innate conversion of 1 eyeball to crit.  So proton torps fired by deadeye can easily do him in (dice depending).  He would be good against the turrets though, since R4 agromech basically has no effect on him...

 

I've found FOs with Comm Relay aren't too bad against Torp Scouts.  They can enter combat with a Focus and Evade token, which means they can take minimal damage from 1 torpedo, but can be in real trouble against 2.  The nice thing is they're relatively inexpensive, can sometimes avoid arcs, and even if they take two torpedoes and die, their buddies are typically very resistant to the primary turret of the Scouts, so they can make back the lost points pretty reliably.  

Yeah for sure!  Another build on my list of 'to-try' is:

Alpha w/ autothrusters = 20

2 omegas w/ juke + comm relay = 22 x 2

Fel (or Jax or Inquisitor)

98 - 99 (depending on ace loadout)

 

Jax makes the most sense to specifically counter Scouts, but Inquisitor can squeeze in proton rockets and Fel is Fel, so they are all generally good choices.

Edited April 7, 2016 by blade_mercurial

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

Any focus evade thruster Palatine etc can ruin torp scouts. Even ptl inq has whethered enough firepower to mop up two scouts at half health, because 2 duce primaries are ass

If green dice stonewall their torps, they're screwed against anything more threatening than a tie fighter

Which is why I don't run without a bumpmaster and the lovely misthunter crew. Absolutely ruins aces, if played well

Edited April 7, 2016 by ficklegreendice

[Ynot 670]

 

I beat 2 double toilet seat builds last night with Carnor+PTL+RGT+AT+SD, Dark Curse+SD and Whisper+VI+ACD+FCS+RebCaptive.

 

Game against Dengar(PTL,K4,Unhinged,Punishing One Title,EU) and Manaroo(standard torpedo boat kitting) - I won 100-0.

 

Game against 2 Scout torpedo boats and 4Lom - I won 100-16.

 

Carnor and Dark Curse were both quite instrumental in the wins as both of them deny spending focus which is the torpedo boats big thing.  Carnor easily got into range 1 of them all game.  Whisper stayed back and just kept taking pieces out of them.

 

Based on the success against 2 double lists I would imagine it would do quite well against the triple as well.

 

3rd game last night was against soontir+ptl+at, krassis+hlc+saboteur+(?), alpha+at.  I won this game 100-42 - only lost whisper.

Dark Curse is actually in trouble vs proton torpedoes (even a lucky plasma torp can do him in).  According to the FAQ, he does not stop deadeye being used to fire the torpedo (only using a focus token to change eyeballs to hits).  He also does not stop guidance chips, nor does he stop the Proton's innate conversion of 1 eyeball to crit.  So proton torps fired by deadeye can easily do him in (dice depending).  He would be good against the turrets though, since R4 agromech basically has no effect on him...

 

I've found FOs with Comm Relay aren't too bad against Torp Scouts.  They can enter combat with a Focus and Evade token, which means they can take minimal damage from 1 torpedo, but can be in real trouble against 2.  The nice thing is they're relatively inexpensive, can sometimes avoid arcs, and even if they take two torpedoes and die, their buddies are typically very resistant to the primary turret of the Scouts, so they can make back the lost points pretty reliably.  

Yeah for sure!  Another build on my list of 'to-try' is:

Alpha w/ autothrusters = 20

2 omegas w/ juke + comm relay = 22 x 2

Fel (or Jax or Inquisitor)

98 - 99 (depending on ace loadout)

 

Jax makes the most sense to specifically counter Scouts, but Inquisitor can squeeze in proton rockets and Fel is Fel, so they are all generally good choices.

 

He stops the focus from deadeye which means either no torp or if they TL to get the torp off, it has no mods except for guidance chips.  I would hardly call that a problem for dark curse.

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

no, torps are still a problem for dark curse

 

because he's made of paper and will die to an unlucky green dice roll against anything

 

he's also rolling only 2 dice against them, so that'll take forever to do any significant damage

 

he's Dark Curse, after all, he's never going to be much more than a cheap annoyance

Edited April 8, 2016 by ficklegreendice

[4fox100 609]

I would want to know which are the best imperial lists to defeat the famous 3 U-Boats lists and which should be the strategy.

 

Thank you!!

my go to would be this

Omega Leader

Juke

Com Relay

Zertik Strom

Title

Sensor Jammer

Mk2 Engine

Dark Curse

Carnor Jax

Predator

Thrusters

Takes alot of finesse to fly but seriously takes away from their dice mods. And if they are using deadeye....well carnor jax laughs at your focus.

[player1723238 3]

Palp Aces has a serious problem with torp boats. Namely, Palpmobile is gonna get WRECKED, probably in the first turn. That build can pretty reliably do 10-12 damage on a single target, and if you don't roll evades, say goodbye to that Palp shuttle. I would say triple aces, Inquisitor, Vader, and OL is my current Imperial Aces build.

[Ynot 670]

Palp Aces has a serious problem with torp boats. Namely, Palpmobile is gonna get WRECKED, probably in the first turn. That build can pretty reliably do 10-12 damage on a single target, and if you don't roll evades, say goodbye to that Palp shuttle. I would say triple aces, Inquisitor, Vader, and OL is my current Imperial Aces build.

Palp Aces was what was beating triple toilet seats at the Hoth event just last weekend.  It is one of the best counters to it.

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

Having no torps for aces = auto loss

Blowing up the shuttle with half your stock isn't necessarily the best idea, especially since its the only thing you can reliably murder with pwts while easily avoiding its arc in the late game

Edited April 8, 2016 by ficklegreendice

[Cubanboy 6,534]

I want to try this when Imp Vets comes out, its at 100 points.

Darth Vader -Adaptability, Proton Rockets, Accuracy Corrector, Guidance Chips, TIE/x1

The Inquisitor -Adaptability, Proton Rockets, Guidance Chips,TIE/v1

Rexler Brath -Outmaneuver, Twin Ion Engine Mk. II, TIE/x7 

Edited April 8, 2016 by Cubanboy

[blade_mercurial 2,091]

 

 

I beat 2 double toilet seat builds last night with Carnor+PTL+RGT+AT+SD, Dark Curse+SD and Whisper+VI+ACD+FCS+RebCaptive.

 

Game against Dengar(PTL,K4,Unhinged,Punishing One Title,EU) and Manaroo(standard torpedo boat kitting) - I won 100-0.

 

Game against 2 Scout torpedo boats and 4Lom - I won 100-16.

 

Carnor and Dark Curse were both quite instrumental in the wins as both of them deny spending focus which is the torpedo boats big thing.  Carnor easily got into range 1 of them all game.  Whisper stayed back and just kept taking pieces out of them.

 

Based on the success against 2 double lists I would imagine it would do quite well against the triple as well.

 

3rd game last night was against soontir+ptl+at, krassis+hlc+saboteur+(?), alpha+at.  I won this game 100-42 - only lost whisper.

Dark Curse is actually in trouble vs proton torpedoes (even a lucky plasma torp can do him in).  According to the FAQ, he does not stop deadeye being used to fire the torpedo (only using a focus token to change eyeballs to hits).  He also does not stop guidance chips, nor does he stop the Proton's innate conversion of 1 eyeball to crit.  So proton torps fired by deadeye can easily do him in (dice depending).  He would be good against the turrets though, since R4 agromech basically has no effect on him...

 

I've found FOs with Comm Relay aren't too bad against Torp Scouts.  They can enter combat with a Focus and Evade token, which means they can take minimal damage from 1 torpedo, but can be in real trouble against 2.  The nice thing is they're relatively inexpensive, can sometimes avoid arcs, and even if they take two torpedoes and die, their buddies are typically very resistant to the primary turret of the Scouts, so they can make back the lost points pretty reliably.  

Yeah for sure!  Another build on my list of 'to-try' is:

Alpha w/ autothrusters = 20

2 omegas w/ juke + comm relay = 22 x 2

Fel (or Jax or Inquisitor)

98 - 99 (depending on ace loadout)

 

Jax makes the most sense to specifically counter Scouts, but Inquisitor can squeeze in proton rockets and Fel is Fel, so they are all generally good choices.

 

He stops the focus from deadeye which means either no torp or if they TL to get the torp off, it has no mods except for guidance chips.  I would hardly call that a problem for dark curse.

 

No he doesn't.  Read the FAQ.

[Strikesback 147]

Strategy is the best weapon against the U-boats. I went 3-0 at the Hoth open against u-boat builds with a Deci and with Vader (ship).

[Arschbombe 1,001]

He stops the focus from deadeye which means either no torp or if they TL to get the torp off, it has no mods except for guidance chips.  I would hardly call that a problem for dark curse.

 

Not anymore.  In the old rules you couldn't spend a focus to shoot him, but now you can because you are technically spending the focus before he actually becomes the target.  It doesn't spell that out like that in the FAQ, but the FAQ specifically states Dark Curse can be shot by weapons that spend a focus to fire.

[nogarder 18]

Strategy is the best weapon against the U-boats. I went 3-0 at the Hoth open against u-boat builds with a Deci and with Vader (ship).

More details please¡¡

Edited April 9, 2016 by nogarder

[CheapCreep 1,144]

Fly even better!

Honestly though, get out of the arcs, bump, and evade. All these things are great tactics employed by the Empire. God speed you black pilots of the oppressor!

[Keffisch 2,642]

Either Palpmobile or:

 

Gamma Sq. x2 with Proton Torps, EM and GC.

Inquisitor with PTL, Thrusters, Title and Tracers.

Omega Sq. /w Crackshot & Weapons Guidance.

 

Strategy = slow-roll and then delete one Jumpmaster, then delete another in the following round. Congratulations, it is now 3-4 of your ships vs 1.

[Strikesback 147]

Strategy is the best weapon against the U-boats. I went 3-0 at the Hoth open against u-boat builds with a Deci and with Vader (ship).

More details please¡¡

Engine upgrade on both. Let them chase and then range one pocket. Only got shot twice by a torpedo the whole tournament.

To be honest I did get lucky my last match. Vader was a turd the whole tournament and on my last game he did roll 3 natural evades against a the last torpedo I was shot with. Only stripped one shield. About my only luck the whole tournament. Otherwise the chase strategy work perfectly.