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Anyone had any success with all Raider fleets?

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Has anyone had any success with an all Raider fleet?  And by all Raider I mean just Raiders for ships ... and maybe squadrons.  If so, what specifically did you take for a fleet and missions?  And have you played in any tournaments with success?

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Every now and then the idea of a "pocket carrier" Raider list (Raiders all with Expanded Hangar Bays) gets tossed around but I don't believe anyone's ever actually made a winning fleet of it.

The clontroper5 list is 80% Raiders (4 Raiders, 1 Demolisher Gladiator) but I feel like the Demolisher brings so much to the table in that kind of fleet that you're hamstringing yourself not including it just for the sake of "lulz, all Raiders."

Edited by Snipafist

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For amusent we ran 7 raiders and a gladiator vs 7 corvettes and a assault frigate.... Interesting game. Rebels won but not overwhelmingly. Midgame it looked bad for the rebels (no space) but the range advantage took over once they started to wheel back around after the initial pass. In the end of the 16 ships on the table, I think 5 survived, tops.

As far as raiders only goes: Motti/Ozzel and 7 raiders w/ ordinance experts and ACMs might be a nasty surprise... But they are so fragile.

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Has anyone had any success with an all Raider fleet?  And by all Raider I mean just Raiders for ships ... and maybe squadrons.  If so, what specifically did you take for a fleet and missions?  And have you played in any tournaments with success?

 

No. Because why would I not take Demolisher? 

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I tried a Raider swarm and despised it.  I think (unlike the CR90) the Raider needs big brothers helping it out.

The difference has more to do with Rieekan than the ships themselves i think.

Disagreed, and please consider that Mon Mothma and Ackbar can run CR90 swarms pretty well too, not just Rieekan.

 

CR90As have the big benefit of being able to attack from long range with Turbolaser Reroute Circuits. They can get out of a lot of tricky situations by simply not sticking around to get into closer ranges of enemy ships. Raiders need to get to closer ranges to work well. They can get the job done there but they're also fragile while they're at short range. I've found they work best supporting other types of ships due to their restrictions. They're good ships, I just would never spam them. The closest Imperial build I can think of is the clontroper5 style fleet where Raiders act as the knights and servants of King Demolisher, who is like them but is not one of them.

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I tried a Raider swarm and despised it.  I think (unlike the CR90) the Raider needs big brothers helping it out.

The difference has more to do with Rieekan than the ships themselves i think.

Disagreed, and please consider that Mon Mothma and Ackbar can run CR90 swarms pretty well too, not just Rieekan.

 

CR90As have the big benefit of being able to attack from long range with Turbolaser Reroute Circuits. They can get out of a lot of tricky situations by simply not sticking around to get into closer ranges of enemy ships. Raiders need to get to closer ranges to work well. They can get the job done there but they're also fragile while they're at short range. I've found they work best supporting other types of ships due to their restrictions. They're good ships, I just would never spam them. The closest Imperial build I can think of is the clontroper5 style fleet where Raiders act as the knights and servants of King Demolisher, who is like them but is not one of them.

 

I'll clarify, if you talk about CR90B vs Raider, the difference is Rieekan. Agreed that red dice is a dfferent ballgame.

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I took a 6 raider list.  It would start out great....and then crumple around turn 5 or 6...they just can't survive once the enemy closes....making strafing runs works well but you need them to stick around a bit to finish things off.  2 of mine were set up as mini clonishers...(hate the name as people ran Demo that way before lol)  with OE, Intel, Exp Launchers.  The rest were pretty basic OE and Screed was my commander.  in Hindsight I wish I had taken Ozzel as jumping away 2 extra speeds would have saved a couple. 

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I took a 6 raider list.  It would start out great....and then crumple around turn 5 or 6...they just can't survive once the enemy closes....making strafing runs works well but you need them to stick around a bit to finish things off.  2 of mine were set up as mini clonishers...(hate the name as people ran Demo that way before lol)  with OE, Intel, Exp Launchers.  The rest were pretty basic OE and Screed was my commander.  in Hindsight I wish I had taken Ozzel as jumping away 2 extra speeds would have saved a couple. 

I guess theres a reason why Ozzel comes in the the Raider pack right?

 

 

I did try a pocket carrier raider list and it sucked bad. All the opponent has to do is rush the raiders and you are left with the choice of abandoning and gimping your squadrons (which is the point of making them carriers in the first place, all those hangars gone to waste) or duking it out with some of the most fragile ships in the game. Its a great way to get tabled...

 

I'm kicking around the idea of a multiple raider list lightly upgraded paired with rhymer, generic jumpmaster and the rest all firesprays. The firesprays do their rogue thing with Rhymer jumping around as a turret hub and the raiders just run away or wolf pack on any isolated target. Against high squadron lists raiders can serve as anti-squad support while/before running away. It's a theory, but frankly you are bound to lose a few raiders and that adds up to an ISD2s worth of points...so why not take an ISD2?

 

Edit: Tried setting up list, ended up with 5 firesprays, Dengar, Rhymer, 5 Raiders. 1 with exp Launchers 3 with APT 1 naked and 1 with instigator. Might be interesting to ditch dengar and rhymer and go for a full 7 firesprays, or just ditch dengar and go with 6. Still, I wouldn't run this list in any sort of serious play.

Edited by Hastatior

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I like Raiders but I don't like their selection of defense tokens.  A close range melee ship doesn't need two evade tokens give it either two braces or add a redirect

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Not exactly an all Raider fleet, but last weekend I took two Gladiators and four Raiders with Admiral Ozzel to a small tournament and won solidly.  With Ozzel and the Raider's maneuverability at speed 2, a banked Nav token was enough to get me pretty much anywhere I wanted, and the number of activations meant I could set up a really nasty crossfire each round with the Raiders carrying Expanded Launchers and Ordnance Experts.  They did the bulk of the work, honestly; the Gladiators were mostly there so that I had something that could survive an attack if it was in a bad position, letting my Raiders take the best activations each round.

 

It was an absolute blast to play!  I've taken patient Rebel squadron-based fleets pretty much exclusively in competition, and getting to fly so aggressively for a change was a treat.  I highly recommend everyone try Ozzel at least once, he offers an incredible amount of flexibility.

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Not exactly an all Raider fleet, but last weekend I took two Gladiators and four Raiders with Admiral Ozzel to a small tournament and won solidly.  With Ozzel and the Raider's maneuverability at speed 2, a banked Nav token was enough to get me pretty much anywhere I wanted, and the number of activations meant I could set up a really nasty crossfire each round with the Raiders carrying Expanded Launchers and Ordnance Experts.  They did the bulk of the work, honestly; the Gladiators were mostly there so that I had something that could survive an attack if it was in a bad position, letting my Raiders take the best activations each round.

 

It was an absolute blast to play!  I've taken patient Rebel squadron-based fleets pretty much exclusively in competition, and getting to fly so aggressively for a change was a treat.  I highly recommend everyone try Ozzel at least once, he offers an incredible amount of flexibility.

I love the Ozzel!

 

Do you mind posting the list here? curious how you fit so many expanded launchers.

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I love the Ozzel!

 

Do you mind posting the list here? curious how you fit so many expanded launchers.

 

 

Most Wanted, Fleet Ambush, Intel Sweep

Two Gladiator I-class with Ordnance Experts, Nav Teams, Rapid Reload and a title each.  Admiral Ozzel is aboard Insidious.  These sink initiative if necessary in the closing pass since they can take a hit, then whip around to get behind the target.

Two Raider I-class each with Ordnance Experts and Expanded Launchers.  These are the heavy-hitters, coming in from either flank like a pair of scissors; each fires then dashes through the enemy formation to set up on the opposite side.

Two Raider I-class, one with Director Isard and Phylon Q7 Tractor Beams, the other is Instigator.  Initiative sinks, back-ups, and blockers.  Also play really well to the objectives.

 

The Gladiators, although intimidating, are pretty much even with the Expanded Launchers Raiders in terms of firepower.  It's like a magician's trick; keep them watching the hand holding Demolisher while I set up the Raiders to strike.  I find it very useful to plan around the idea that I will never get to attack a target with the same Raider twice; either it will be destroyed or space will be too crowded to turn around in time.  Once you accept that, you can maneuver in a way that keeps each Raider either attacking or getting set up to do so every round, and you will prepare to overkill targets to ensure they're destroyed.

 

If you hold your hands out in front of you, palms up and fingers spread, then rotate your hands so that your fingers interlace and then separate again, starting from the bottom; this is how the fleet attacks.  Each ship in turn activates and fires at a target on its side of the enemy formation, then bypasses that ship to prepare for an attack against the target its opposite "finger" hit, while its counterpart does the same.  Certainly not for the faint of heart, but it's great fun and looks cool on the table.

Edited by Joker Two

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I have ran a seven raider list with Screed, APTs and OEs on all seven at the Fargo Regional and a local store championship.  I ended up getting byes in both tournaments, so only played a total of four games with that list.   I usually play a rhymerball list so this is a little different for me in planning my activation strategy.  I also believe in demolisher as a must take, just to get that out of the way.  I did not put OEs on Screed since he was my sweeper ship and would stay out of battle.

 

Objectives:

Precision strike: with APTs, hoping to get a lot of damage to ignore shields and pile up the objectives. - never used

Dangerous territory - So, I do not have to worry about obstacles - ended up being a wash

Hyperspace assault - least evil, I felt - never used

 

I got to go first 3 out of my 4 games at 393 points.

 

The basic strategy initially was a wolf pack list but with six rounds in the game it is hard to do.  When I mean wolf pack strategy I mean go in one ship at a time and get out, like wolves chasing a deer and nipping at them as they run.  

The new strategy is line up blockers in front as sacrifices to block the large ships from moving and attack from the rear arc with 3-4 ships.  Still working on this list.

 

Good thing about the list.

Tons of activations, so the first few rounds you can usually avoid damage. 

Fast maneuverable ships

Guaranteed crit or two depending on arc

 

Bad thing about list

fragile ships and evades are useless at close range.

Blue and black attack dice, so have to be in short range

only activate one ship at a time, at close range if you have 2 ships attacking, they will attack the ship that has not been activated, against a big ship this usually means an accuracy will come up and getting six damage is easy.

six rounds in a game - not enough time to use a wolf pack strategy.

 

Against my local players, I did ok testing the list but they were also testing their own lists.

 

In the tournaments, where I had to go against people with well defined tournament lists, I had a hard time bringing down the large ships, because I could not bring enough damage in a round or two where I was losing a ship a round from one attack.  At Fargo, I was one damage away from a large point swing in both my matches.  Meaning killing a 150 point ship, instead of killing nothing.

In my matchup against a demolisher, insidious , 4 raider list, I was able to kill both gladiators but he was able to kill enough of my ships and grab objectives in an intel sweep matchup, he basically alpha striked my objective ship with demolisher.  Against an ackbar list I was able to stay out of the side arc and this is where I first tried blocking his MC80 but he was able to one shot my blocker and with engine techs get out of range of my raiders that were behind him.

 

The one thing I found out about the 7 raider list is that you will not 10-0 anybody cause they are to fragile and almost guaranteed to die in one attack.  You have to be precise in your movements.  

I will be playing this list until Wave 3 comes out or a tournament has some phat loot, cause it just makes me a better player.  

 

My first game I played with this list is on twitch from the fargo regional against a ISD, demolisher, with squadron list.

 

I hope this helps answer some questions about the seven raider list.  

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It wouldn't be an all-Raider fleet, mind you, but with the Gozantis coming out I can certainly see a modified Rhymerball fleet consisting of Gozantis+Raiders. Gozantis for Bomber Command Centers and bossing your bomber cloud around and Raiders to provide flak cover to the bomber cloud and protect the Gozantis against enemies who get any sneaky ideas about zooming in to handle them at close range. You can get in quite a few Gozantis and Raiders while still keeping plenty of room for squadrons provided you don't splurge on frivolous upgrades.

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Raiders act as the knights and servants of King Demolisher, who is like them but is not one of them.

 

Snip just won. . .something. I don't know what, but he definitely won.

 

And the Regionals tourney I was just at saw a person in third place with an all Raider list. I don't know the upgrades, but there were five (nicely painted) Raiders on the table.

 

The Raider is an excellent ship, but it has a much harder style. It's well suited as a close-support, anti-squadron role that can punch a much bigger ship in the nose at close range, but it can never be the only target. You either have to have something much more threatening or much more valuable your opponent can shoot at, or it will die. Having multiple Raiders against a non-Gunnery Teams ship can also work, if you're willing to trade a Raider for the ship they're going after. And their titles show that anti-squadron is their intended role, which makes sense. There's nothing else in the Imperial lineup that's well-suited for that role. The ISD-II and GSD-II both have blue/blue AS fire, but neither wants to be wasting their shots on squadrons if the enemy ships are in range. But OE on Instigator? Squeeze in right next to a squadron cluster and drop two damage on every enemy squadron, then Navigate and do it again, all while those squadrons are pinned in place. Instigator might die, but if played right it will have already dealt a serious blow to the enemy squadrons and protected a high-value target for a turn.

 

It'll be interesting to see how things go with flotillas. Escorting a flotilla might be a new tactical role. A Raider-I and Gozanti are a little cheaper than an ISD-I, have the same squadron value and only slightly less hull (7 versus 8). The Raider can be kitted out pretty nicely (OE, APT, Instigator), and be used to scare squadrons and faster ships away from the Gozanti. You could even use them in a two-to-one ratio (one Raider for a pair of Gozantis).

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