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BlindAdmiral

Need a cheat sheet map for Imperial player

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Has anyone made a cheat sheet mini map that the Imperial player can mark up with there "intel?" Finding it a little difficult keeping where I have been and what I have probed clear in my mind.

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I agree. I don't like having to remember the cards, because I have really lousy short-term memory.

Though there's a Rebel mission that was played in me yesterday, which robbed me of 4 probe cards. Part of the benefit (for the Rebel player) was to put those cards on to of the probe deck. That would not, then, be giving me any new information, while those previously-drawn cards were there. But iirc it also allowed the Rebel player to put some in the bottom. Where's the benefit in that, if I have a cheat sheet?

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I asked for this on BGG awhile back, there were several submissions, and at least one is listed in the images on the site, so a little searching there should give you something to use.

 

I tend to overthink things, so as an Imp player, I'm planning strategy based on future probe draws.  If I pull this and this, I could clear this sector and move this fleet here, but if I draw only one of these, then I need to move that fleet here.  And I do that so much, I forget which probes I actually have.  So I would end up looking through my probe hand about a dozen times per round just to me sure.

 

I do the same thing in texas hold-um.  Betting round, look at cards.  Flip a card, look at cards.  Betting round, look at cards.  I'm thinking through the options so much I lose trust in my memory of my own cards.

 

Hey look, I decided to not be lazy and post a link.  Yeah for me!

https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1518817/resource-request-map-recording-probes/page/1

 

Hope you find something that works for you!

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I agree. I don't like having to remember the cards, because I have really lousy short-term memory.

Though there's a Rebel mission that was played in me yesterday, which robbed me of 4 probe cards. Part of the benefit (for the Rebel player) was to put those cards on to of the probe deck. That would not, then, be giving me any new information, while those previously-drawn cards were there. But iirc it also allowed the Rebel player to put some in the bottom. Where's the benefit in that, if I have a cheat sheet? 

 

 

If the rebel player uses rapid mobilization, he could choose one of those systems who's cards have gone back in.

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I can't think of may benefits to putting probe cards at the bottom of the deck.   Maybe, if you wanted to make sure that there were locations that weren't controlled by the empire and available in case you needed to move the rebel base.  But the deck would need to be very thin and/or you would need to assign 2 leaders to the "move the rebel base" mission to draw 8 probe cards and hope you draw down to those cards you put at the bottom.  Or on the other hand, if you see that those systems are already controlled by the Empire and you are planning on moving your base soon, you put those at the bottom so when you do draw probe cards to move the base, you know your not getting "bunk" locations.

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I generally like the map on BGG, but I'm not a big fan of the fill-in color, which might use more ink than is necessary. I created a .png image with empty (see-through) space instead of that fill-in color. Using that .png I also made a .pdf (link below image).

 

This all was done in a manner of minutes. If you have suggestions to make it better, I'll be happy to consider.

 

RebellionMap.png

 

http://www.concentratedfirepower.com/Downloads/RebellionMap.pdf

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I'm all for this cuz this is a big deal... HOWEVER... this violates the spirit of the game in some ways. There's a rebel mission that makes imperial players put back cards into the deck, so having the memory element actually be a thing matters for those situations. Of course, on the flip side, a real galactic overlord would have a map with xs that are checked. lol

Edited by otomo

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I found I was wanting to also keep track of which planets I landed stormies onto. Late in my first game, I had to devote resources to a planet the rebels took over because I wasn't 100% sure if I was there 3 hours earlier.

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I can't think of may benefits to putting probe cards at the bottom of the deck.   Maybe, if you wanted to make sure that there were locations that weren't controlled by the empire and available in case you needed to move the rebel base.  But the deck would need to be very thin and/or you would need to assign 2 leaders to the "move the rebel base" mission to draw 8 probe cards and hope you draw down to those cards you put at the bottom.  Or on the other hand, if you see that those systems are already controlled by the Empire and you are planning on moving your base soon, you put those at the bottom so when you do draw probe cards to move the base, you know your not getting "bunk" locations.

 

The false lead mission gives you two options really.  One is a delay tactic.  By putting those 4 cards at the top, you force them to re-probe systems they already probed.  It buys you 1 or 2 turns before they find the actual base.

The other is in combination with the base relocation.

When used this way, there are some things to consider.

You draw 4.  Lets say 2 are good base locations, and 2 are junk.  The Imp player will see this also.  Now you have some options.  Put all 4 at the bottom, draw 4/8 others and relocate somewhere else.  The Imp player may assume you used a good planet you stole and waste time checking them.  Keep 1 on top, the others at the bottom.  Now you have insurance that you have one possible location, and the others are dumped at the bottom.

Heck, depending on how many cards are left in the probe deck, you could create a lure for the Imp player.

 

Lets say there are 3 cards left.  You draw 4 from his hand.  Leave 1 good one on top, the other 3 at the bottom.  Draw 4 for new base, but DON'T select the one he would know about.  If I remember right, the ones you pick from are shuffled and sent to the bottom of the pile.  The next 3 probes he draws (likely in 1 turn) would be 3 of the 4 cards you stole.  He'll then assume you used the last planet that you stole and focus on that location.

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As for gaming the system by using something like this, I don't really agree.

 

Honestly, I can remember all the probe cards I have.  I wouldn't have to look.  The problem is that I would doubt my own memory, so I'd be consulting the probe cards CONSTANTLY.  It would likely add 30 minutes of play time due to my AP about my probe hand.

I look at my probe cards, pick my missions, reveal a mission and declare that it's happening on system....check probe cards, system X.  Ok, I'm going to use this guy to move military units to syste....check probe cards, system Y.

I look at them so much that if you do take one away, I'll know full well which system it was you removed.

 

Same goes for planetary control.  I'm going to remember that.  This one MAY be pushing the limits as I know some people may not be able to recall every move.  But again, for AP purposes, it will save time.  Otherwise I'm going to do a mental playthrough to determine if I ever controlled a planet that I suspect.

 

Thematically, I'm pretty sure the Imps kept track of that kind of stuff.

"Sorry Lord Vader, the reports are a little hazy.  We're not sure if we ever had a presence on Mon Calamari."

"Sorry Palpatine, um, we forgot the password to the excel spreadsheet that shows which systems we sent probes to.  We've contacted our IT people, but well, Vader has choked most of them to death due to some folder they keep finding on his computer."

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I have played game 6 times now, 3 as empire, 3 as rebel. The probe deck was made a probe deck and not a checklist for a reason.  Like previously stated there is a mission that can mess with it.  As the empire player I had no issue with not being able find the base, even in the 2 games where my opponent moved it. I would not allow my opponent to use and checklist nor would I use one. All 6 games I played, the location of the base was known by the empire player at some point in the game whether empire lost the game or won it.

 

Also I believe that mission takes the 4 probe cards out of the probe deck randomly. So it is possible to move the base to a location that the empire has marked off on a checklist.

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I have played game 6 times now, 3 as empire, 3 as rebel. The probe deck was made a probe deck and not a checklist for a reason.  Like previously stated there is a mission that can mess with it.  As the empire player I had no issue with not being able find the base, even in the 2 games where my opponent moved it. I would not allow my opponent to use and checklist nor would I use one. All 6 games I played, the location of the base was known by the empire player at some point in the game whether empire lost the game or won it.

 

Also I believe that mission takes the 4 probe cards out of the probe deck randomly. So it is possible to move the base to a location that the empire has marked off on a checklist.

 

False leads does return 4 cards to the deck, randomly or not, it's not a mystery what disappeared from your hand.

 

So it sounds like no one had any trouble keeping track of the probe cards right?  So the checklist would be of no advantage.

 

You say you would not allow your opponent to keep notes, but you'd be ok with the added 10 minutes of AP per round you'd deal with from me instead?

Would you be cool playing with someone that had a photographic memory?  Or someone that used some type of mental trick to help them remember things better?

Edited by kmanweiss

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I have a terrible short term memory and used the linked sheet.  I would have no problem letting my opponent use it if I were the Rebels, either.  All it does is save time from having to re-check the probe cards constantly and slow the game down like that.

Edited by DyingTickles

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Make it a house rule that IF you use this 'cheat' sheet you have to surrender it and pick up a blank one if the rebels play that card that puts probe cards back in the deck. Problem solved, best of both worlds.

 

Addy

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Make it a house rule that IF you use this 'cheat' sheet you have to surrender it and pick up a blank one if the rebels play that card that puts probe cards back in the deck. Problem solved, best of both worlds.

 

Addy

I think some are missing the point of that Rebel sabotage. It isn't ment to confuse the Imperial player but delay new Intel. There is NO logical or game related reason why the Imperial player should not use whatever guide they want to organize their intel.

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Make it a house rule that IF you use this 'cheat' sheet you have to surrender it and pick up a blank one if the rebels play that card that puts probe cards back in the deck. Problem solved, best of both worlds.

 

Addy

I think some are missing the point of that Rebel sabotage. It isn't ment to confuse the Imperial player but delay new Intel. There is NO logical or game related reason why the Imperial player should not use whatever guide they want to organize their intel.

 

Good point, I agree with you there.

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Make it a house rule that IF you use this 'cheat' sheet you have to surrender it and pick up a blank one if the rebels play that card that puts probe cards back in the deck. Problem solved, best of both worlds.

Addy

I think some are missing the point of that Rebel sabotage. It isn't ment to confuse the Imperial player but delay new Intel. There is NO logical or game related reason why the Imperial player should not use whatever guide they want to organize their intel.
Agreed, but I think kmanweiss has a point that it also allows the Rebel player to put them on the bottom in case she's planning to relocate the base in fairly short order. Edited by Mikael Hasselstein

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Make it a house rule that IF you use this 'cheat' sheet you have to surrender it and pick up a blank one if the rebels play that card that puts probe cards back in the deck. Problem solved, best of both worlds.

Addy

I think some are missing the point of that Rebel sabotage. It isn't ment to confuse the Imperial player but delay new Intel. There is NO logical or game related reason why the Imperial player should not use whatever guide they want to organize their intel.
Agreed, but I think kmanweiss has a point that it also allows the Rebel player to put them on the bottom in case she's planning to relocate the base in fairly short order.

 

And this becomes the Imperial player's problem that those cards are missing and may or may not be counted on any more.  The sheet still does not give the Imperial player any kind of advantage. 

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Neither I nor any of my opponents have felt we needed a cheat sheet. Maybe 25 sytems it could be on.  At least half that can be eliminated by having a empire ground force or loyalty. I dont mean to be fussy. But are the people wanting this actually played any games yet to see if its needed.

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I have mixed feelings on the system tracker idea (and I am horrible with memory games).

 

Part of me feels there is a lot to track for the Imperials and I hate having to keep everything in my head, plus having to sort through your hand when you forget slows things down.  On the other hand, part of the game appears to be juggling all that information in your head.

 

I just want to add in general, if you are advocating for something, avoid using the word "cheat" in the name.

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Neither I nor any of my opponents have felt we needed a cheat sheet. Maybe 25 sytems it could be on.  At least half that can be eliminated by having a empire ground force or loyalty. I dont mean to be fussy. But are the people wanting this actually played any games yet to see if its needed.

Yes, I've played it.  It isn't NEEDED, it simply speeds things up.  It gives absolutely ZERO additional information.  All it does it organize information that the Imperial player already has so he or she doesn't have to repeatedly look at the probe droid cards.

 

Jobu, there is still juggling of information.  The system tracker doesn't remove any juggling.

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