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Hoth Open reports?

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I honestly think the Hoth system open is a poor reflection on the gane's meta. It's too early in the wave to know what works and what doesn't, too early for players to have practiced lists. A lot fell back on variations of a known list, one they probably flew before, so they would be comfortable and skilled at their list. 3 scout players obviously were quick learners. I'm interested to see the game move forward and for people to experiment, like I know they will.

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Rebels have options. Really good options, just gotta be smart.

Fat Han w/ homing missile Zs can deal with Aces and Scouts.

Any stress meta control builds shut down aces so hard.

And a Z missile spam right would still clean up.

I hope you find some combo that works for your favourite ship, come nationals, rebels will be present and no real worries will be given to their position in the meta.

 

Your first two options will be destroyed by Scouts easily

Z missile spam will get rocked by Palp aces

 

I'm not saying the game is done etc, or Rebels are done. It's true that they lack a real option to confront both Palp Aces and Scouts. 

 

It's just silly for anyone to celebrate that, though.

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I honestly think the Hoth system open is a poor reflection on the gane's meta. It's too early in the wave to know what works and what doesn't, too early for players to have practiced lists. A lot fell back on variations of a known list, one they probably flew before, so they would be comfortable and skilled at their list. 3 scout players obviously were quick learners. I'm interested to see the game move forward and for people to experiment, like I know they will.

 

The success of the U-Boats and Palp-Aces is just going to make them more prevalent next time.

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There's Rebels. It seems to be a Chopper/Poe list with a Dorsal turret of all things.

Dude, Dorsal Turret is legit. Autoblaster Turret has its uses, but it also has its weaknesses.

 

Agreed. I like Dorsal Turret

IMHO the dorsal turret might just be the best turret for the attack shuttle. Those little ships are maneuverable enough that you should be trying to get enemy ships into your primary arc at range 1 ... but if you fail to anticipate the enemy's move or you're dealing with a higher PS ace that can boost or barrel roll out of your arc then you still have a cheap range 1-2 turret so you can take a shot.

I feel like TLT is a trap for the attack shuttle ... it doesn't have the "tankiness" to sit back and take TLT pot shots at range 2-3. TLTs are more at home on Y-wings and K-wings.

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Any stress meta control builds shut down aces so hard.

 

Yorr is a reasonably effective counter to stress builds so no, that's not true.

Aces can also PS kill a Stresshog and or arc dodge. I've not had too much trouble facing them without Yorr.

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I haven't gotten a lot of triple scout games under my belt yet but I really enjoy the list. I find the winners list a bit curious though (obviously it's solid he won). I really really like Boba Fett paired with Protons but if I was only bringing one Proton Torp with me I think I'd roll with 4LOM instead. Seems like a more reliable way to punish turtled up Aces. Or am I missing something?

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Prediction: Wave 8 meta is going to be much less diverse than Wave 7 meta. Take it for what its worth.

 

Like how the Wave VII meta was supposed to be dominated by quad TLT?

 

 

No. Scouts have far less viable counters than TLT, consequently the Meta should narrow down. Anyway, you're free to disagree, thats why its called a prediction.

Edited by Celes

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I haven't gotten a lot of triple scout games under my belt yet but I really enjoy the list. I find the winners list a bit curious though (obviously it's solid he won). I really really like Boba Fett paired with Protons but if I was only bringing one Proton Torp with me I think I'd roll with 4LOM instead. Seems like a more reliable way to punish turtled up Aces. Or am I missing something?

 

HIs list included the Overclocked Droid on two of them, so he had points for 2 Plasmas, One Proton, and EM on all of them and even with Boba he still had a one point initiative bid.

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I personally think the stats from Hoth will just show that while the 3xScouts is a simple list, it's how you fly it that really matters, especially with predicting your opponent's movement. The mechanics of the list are simple, get them in arc at range 2-3 and fire. But with the lower PS, lack of action economy, and large base that is much harder to do at the table vs a skill opponent than most people want to admit. Just look at the top 32 and you see many many more Ace based lists than non-ace based lists, because the higher PS and action econ gives you some wiggle room to recover from a badly planned maneuver, or a incorrect guess on your opponent's maneuver. Not to say flying aces is easy, it also takes skill, i'm just of the opinion that 3xscouts also take skill to fly well, it's not the brain dead list most want to claim it to be.

 

 

..... of course i have been known to spout crazy from time to time.

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Well, the issue of flying 3 Large bases will be much larger threshold than Quad TLT was.

You want to know how games against quad TLT go?

Watch as your opponent marks his ships with Target Lock tokens. No need for numbers here, I can use Target Locks because I'm literally always going to focus no matter what.

3 straight them in a brick at something and always focus.

Is something going to get range 1 behind the brick of TLT's? Nope, they all 4 K-Turn.

The thing about triple U-Boat is that it's fun to fly itself, takes at least /some/ skill, and is fun to face, there are also ways to deal with it besides for being required to hard counter it.

Palp Aces is the real ******* problem. I bumped a Soontir at range 2 and launched a 4 hit homing missile at it and my opponent triple evaded and Palpatined. If I'm just going to do everything right and my opponent can just dice mod his way through things I don't know what I'm supposed to do. You can rig fights against triple Jumpmaster to be in your favor because they have to joust you for torps and they're 3 large bases. Against Palp Aces you can just dice mod your way through things, and hey, let's give Soontir a cheaper second ace to fly with so that we can buff the shuttle, yay.

And before anyone says, "Don't complain about dice, good/bad dice make or break games all the time", no, they do not. If a bumped TIE Fighter rolls triple evade and survives a shot he shouldn't, you can always get him next turn. When a Soontir god rolls? There is your one chance to kill Soontir, you've just lost the game. Next turn he'll just green and have focus focus evade Palpatine 4 agility dice with Autothrusters. But it's hyper /offense/ that's the problem.

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I haven't gotten a lot of triple scout games under my belt yet but I really enjoy the list. I find the winners list a bit curious though (obviously it's solid he won). I really really like Boba Fett paired with Protons but if I was only bringing one Proton Torp with me I think I'd roll with 4LOM instead. Seems like a more reliable way to punish turtled up Aces. Or am I missing something?

 

HIs list included the Overclocked Droid on two of them, so he had points for 2 Plasmas, One Proton, and EM on all of them and even with Boba he still had a one point initiative bid.

 

Only one of the Overclocked R4 Scouts had extra munitions, 5 torpedoes total.  97 points, 3 point bid.

 

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In my opinicon the Scout is undercosted. It´s a 2 attack dice, PS 3, 9 health, 2 evade dice, with EPT, also with barrel roll, is only 25 points.

 

The outer rim smuggler, PS 1, 2 attack dice, 1 evade dice, 10 health, no EPT and no barrel roll is 27. I don´t know what the hell were thinking when they made the value for the Scout.

Edited by Fuego Estelar

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In my opinicon the Scout is undercosted. It´s a 2 attack dice, PS 3, 9 health, 2 evade dice, with EPT, also with barrel roll, is only 25 points.

 

The outer rim smuggler, PS 1, 2 attack dice, 1 evade dice, 10 health, no EPT and no barrel roll is 27. I don´t know what the hell were thinking when they made the value for the Scout.

Not saying scout is not overcosted, but a ship that hardly sees any competitive play is not a good benchmark

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In my opinicon the Scout is undercosted. It´s a 2 attack dice, PS 3, 9 health, 2 evade dice, with EPT, also with barrel roll, is only 25 points.

 

The outer rim smuggler, PS 1, 2 attack dice, 1 evade dice, 10 health, no EPT and no barrel roll is 27. I don´t know what the hell were thinking when they made the value for the Scout.

Not saying scout is not overcosted, but a ship that hardly sees any competitive play is not a good benchmark

 

This. 1000 times this.

 

I don't disagree with your overall conclusion, the Scout is certainly quite the bargain. A better comparison is the Wild Space Fringer at 30pts.

The Fringer gains has 1 more health, but has: no EPT, Salvaged Astro or Illicit, 1 less PS, a slightly worse dial (white sloop is bonkers, but the J5Ks would quite like that lovely 3 turn), and swaps 2x Torp for Cannon & Missile (a bigger deal since Extra Munitions are a thing). All for the low low cost of 5pts more...

 

J5K is still a bargain in my eyes, I don't think people would disagree if you said the Fringer is also 1-2pts a bit too expensive, but it's a much better comparison.

 

I do think that the J5K is so good because of the unique combination of: EPT, 2x Torp (for EM), Astro/Crew for action efficiency, PS3 and enough health to not be easily alpha-struck off the table. If you pull out one or two of these Jenga blocks, the build comes crashing back down into "Good & efficient, but not exceptional"

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Having both flown and flown against the Jumpmasters the one tactic that works pretty well against them, and does not involve a hard counter such as carnor jax, is forcing them to bump. They are big base ships trying to avoid asteroids and each other and trying to keep opposing ships in arc, a blocker such as a prototype pilot, sienar test pilot or even another contracted scout with -1 PS adaptability can cause havoc and easily force a couple of them to bump and not have that all important focus token on them in the first round of engagement. Once you descend into a fur ball  that 2 white sloop often isn't far enough to get them turned around. 

 

Using the fact they are PS3 and running a PS 1 or 2 ship in your list for this express purpose is something I can see Rebel players especially trying out. 

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I have a non-X-wing question for anyone that was there at Adepticon.   

 

Was there any Warhammer Fantasy Battle there?  I was there a few years ago and it was a huge event.  The whole scene dried up locally and I happily moved on to X-wing.  I'm just curious how it's doing overall at a place like Adepticon.  Was there any tournaments there?  Did anyone see how big it was?   Just curious.

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CheapCreep, on 01 Apr 2016 - 5:33 PM, said:

Wait wait, day 1 saw someone fly the syck, but not the Starviper? And then day 2 saw yet another syck and not a punisher?? Who's running these sycks, what is this list?

 

I saw one list with Serissu, Talonbane, Black Sun Ace, and Cartel Marauder.   Talon & BSA had swarm tactics making all 3 PS9.  Don't remember the remaining upgrades.

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