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InterceptorMad

You can no longer double-Gonk

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The end.

It's not though is it?

A rule has come back from FFG - maybe it'll be overturned, maybe it won't.

It could be that they didn't word the cards the way they intended and they'll errata it to read 'you may not use gonk twice in a turn'... or not.

Either way, it's not the end yet but any tournament I play until this is sorted I'm taking the email clarification with me saying no double gonk.

Edited by Stu35

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No, what you really should do is ask the TO before the tournament, that way you're not thrown off when they rule opposite of what you expect (and they'll already have thought about it, and have an answer ready if your opponent questions it in a game). This goes for any rules questions that you're particularly concerned about, whether you think they're clearly answered in the FAQ or not. In a casual setting, I suggest that you confirm with your opponent before you place your ships.

Edited by FireSpy

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I'm #teamtwoactionsnotone or #GonkGonk

 

The rules state that actions are either icons on the action bar or text that start with a "ACTION" header.

On the Gonk card there is TWO times a text with an "ACTION" header. So TWO different actions.

So using IE, you can both bank and reload a shield. It will cost you two actions, a stress, 5 points and two upgrade slots to do it, but you CAN do it! imho!

 

Also, A mail copied to a facebook page and then copied into forums is nothing official. When this thing hits an official FAQ I will (be sad and) use it as stated in that FAQ.

 

This is indeed Wave 8 and by now the wording on upgrade cards should already be near perfect and not as debatable as this.

Don't they know the KISS principle: Keep It Simple, Stupid. To not overcomplicate things?

If they indeed intended the Gonk actions to be one action, then why did they not word them as all the other cards with multiple one-action options.

Why didn't they add "this card can only be used ONCE PER TURN" as previous upgrades have stated or why didnt they use ONE action header with "OR" to stipulate the different options you need to choose between, or "face this card down after until the end phase after using one of the actions"

To me, a new kind of card design also introduces a new kind of use for it, and it shouldnt be yet another way of wording something that has been worded differently in the past.

 

I really hope they stick with their own rules and overrule that mail and say that Gonk has 2 different actions that can be used in a single turn, if you use IE.

 

Gonk.

Gonk.

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It's weird though; why would it be written as two separate actions if it wasn't intended that they be two separate actions?

 

I mean, it could have been written like this:

 

"ACTION: Place 1 shield token on this card or remove 1 shield token from this card to recover 1 shield (up to your shield value)."

 

If it was intended not to be two different actions.

 

???

 

There have been some really confusing rulings recently.

100% agreed.

 

That's unfortunate. It makes Gonk a little harder to justify using. 

Honestly, though, having played "Gonk" on Kath for a while, the times when you want to use both actions are pretty rare.

 

Oh, I'm sorry, did I say "both actions"?  :rolleyes:  ;)

 

Cheeky!  ;)

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Don't the new tourney rules say that you cannot reference outside materials?  And is this email 'ruling' not an outside material? 

 

For many of the reasons stated above, FFG's own tourney rules, and the basic rule of 'do what the card says you can do, not what you can't do' (IE 'Action' is listed twice, separately, so are two individual actions) I will be looking to GonkGonk as that is the way the card is written.  Until officially FAQed, that is.

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Don't the new tourney rules say that you cannot reference outside materials?  And is this email 'ruling' not an outside material? 

 

That only applies to players and only during matches. The TO can use any reference that he wants to. A player having a rules discussion with a TO can use them as well as long as it is not during a round.

 

Ultimately, the TO is able to rule however they feel like ruling on anything. Even if their ruling is in conflict with the FAQ and rules.

EDIT: I should probably be using the new Event Leader role names for clarity but am using TO out of habit.

Edited by WWHSD

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Don't the new tourney rules say that you cannot reference outside materials?  And is this email 'ruling' not an outside material? 

 

That only applies to players and only during matches. The TO can use any reference that he wants to. A player having a rules discussion with a TO can use them as well as long as it is not during a round.

 

Ultimately, the TO is able to rule however they feel like ruling on anything. Even if their ruling is in conflict with the FAQ and rules.

EDIT: I should probably be using the new Event Leader role names for clarity but am using TO out of habit.

 

 

Here are the relevant tournament regulations.

 

Tournament Regulations, pg. 3:
Players cannot reference outside material or information during a round. 
 
Tournament Regulations, pg. 3:
Finally, the organizer is
also responsible for having all required rules documents on hand for reference
during the event. This includes the X-Wing Core Set Rules Reference,
X-Wing FAQ, X-Wing Tournament Regulations (this document), any Event
Outline relevant to the event, and any other relevant document for the event. 
 
 
 
The bit about "any other relevant document for the event" could include print outs of FFG email rulings for things they suspect will come up at the tournament.

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Don't the new tourney rules say that you cannot reference outside materials?  And is this email 'ruling' not an outside material? 

 

For many of the reasons stated above, FFG's own tourney rules, and the basic rule of 'do what the card says you can do, not what you can't do' (IE 'Action' is listed twice, separately, so are two individual actions) I will be looking to GonkGonk as that is the way the card is written.  Until officially FAQed, that is.

Well then expect some arguments. The email ruling said it didn't matter which option you used, because they were both considered to be a Gonk action. This argument could go round in circles forever.

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Well, considering how slow and clunky Gonk is in A new hope, maybe its in keeping with Canon that Gonk should only be able to do one charge or discharge action per turn. This is a droid we're talking about here. When was any droid other than R2-D2 able to multitask at any time anywhere in the 7 films thus far. R2 is special as established by Canon. Even BB-8 takes a bow to R2-D2.

Edited by markspeed

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Well, considering how slow and clunky Gonk is in A new hope, maybe its in keeping with Canon that Gonk should only be able to do one charge or discharge action per turn. This is a droid we're talking about here. When was any droid other than R2-D2 able to multitask at any time anywhere in the 7 films thus far. R2 is special as established by Canon. Even BB-8 takes a bow to R2-D2.

 

wat

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Well, considering how slow and clunky Gonk is in A new hope, maybe its in keeping with Canon that Gonk should only be able to do one charge or discharge action per turn. This is a droid we're talking about here. When was any droid other than R2-D2 able to multitask at any time anywhere in the 7 films thus far. R2 is special as established by Canon. Even BB-8 takes a bow to R2-D2.

 

wat

It's just someone trying to justify the 'ban' on double Gonking.

Still haven't seen a FAQ, so I will just Gonk on.

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Don't the new tourney rules say that you cannot reference outside materials?  And is this email 'ruling' not an outside material? 

 

For many of the reasons stated above, FFG's own tourney rules, and the basic rule of 'do what the card says you can do, not what you can't do' (IE 'Action' is listed twice, separately, so are two individual actions) I will be looking to GonkGonk as that is the way the card is written.  Until officially FAQed, that is.

Well then expect some arguments. The email ruling said it didn't matter which option you used, because they were both considered to be a Gonk action. This argument could go round in circles forever.

WED-15 Repair droid shows how Gonk should have been written IF FFG wanted only one action on the card. They didn't write it that way, so guess what...

And the argument goes on.

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Oh boy, this again.

 

 Our local TO has made his own judging on it, and that's kind of how it has to go until we see something official. I can say though that nobody runs Gonk here even with the permitted synergy with EU  :P

 

I think it's "The End" in the sense that we've dissected this one about as far down as it can possibly go, given that it's a matter of inconsistencies with semantics and formatting trends, all of which have been identified and explored individually.

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As mentioned previous - this is an email ruling and is not official.  And, again as mentioned earlier, this is likely to not be the final ruling.  Until this hits an FAQ I will not be playing it that way.

 

 

Don't the new tourney rules say that you cannot reference outside materials?  And is this email 'ruling' not an outside material? 

 

For many of the reasons stated above, FFG's own tourney rules, and the basic rule of 'do what the card says you can do, not what you can't do' (IE 'Action' is listed twice, separately, so are two individual actions) I will be looking to GonkGonk as that is the way the card is written.  Until officially FAQed, that is.

 

 

So, well.....yeah....

Edited by thatdave

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TOLD YA! But don't listen to me, noooooo.

THEY SEE ME GONKING, THEY HATIN!

 

Do you have to be such a GONKinh GONK coming in here and opening your GONKing GONK GONKer. Can you GONKing please just go GONK GONK yourself until you GONK your GONK raw? 

 

 

EDIT: Oh look, they added that filter we asked for.

Edited by WWHSD

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TOLD YA! But don't listen to me, noooooo.

THEY SEE ME GONKING, THEY HATIN!

 

Do you have to be such a GONKinh GONK coming in here and opening your GONKing GONK GONKer. Can you GONKing please just go GONK GONK yourself until you GONK your GONK raw? 

 

 

EDIT: Oh look, they added that filter we asked for.

GUNBOAT!

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TOLD YA! But don't listen to me, noooooo.

THEY SEE ME GONKING, THEY HATIN!

 

Do you have to be such a GONKinh GONK coming in here and opening your GONKing GONK GONKer. Can you GONKing please just go GONK GONK yourself until you GONK your GONK raw? 

 

 

EDIT: Oh look, they added that filter we asked for.

GUNBOAT! GONK!

 

 

Fixed that for ya.  Didn't you know that's a curse word 'round 'ere now?

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