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you have to weigh the 1 point less for the incalculably lesser flexibility in obtaining that stress token, including no deadeye post sexy white 2-segnors (or any maneuver not going left)

 

It's worth it for the largely superior Protons vs. Plasmas.

 

 

neither of which do anything when you make yourself that predictable

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you have to weigh the 1 point less for the incalculably lesser flexibility in obtaining that stress token, including no deadeye post sexy white 2-segnors (or any maneuver not going left)

 

It's worth it for the largely superior Protons vs. Plasmas.

 

 

neither of which do anything when you make yourself that predictable

 

 

On one ship. That is predictable twice at most so that your other two ships can fire better torpedoes.

Edited by GreatMazinkaiser

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you have to weigh the 1 point less for the incalculably lesser flexibility in obtaining that stress token, including no deadeye post sexy white 2-segnors (or any maneuver not going left)

 

It's worth it for the largely superior Protons vs. Plasmas.

 

 

neither of which do anything when you make yourself that predictable

 

 

On one ship. That is predictable twice at most so that your other two ships can fire better torpedoes.

 

 

could do the same with bumpmaster, which adds the utility with intel agent with potential of Manaroo which makes things even more flexible since she can enable deadeye no matter the condition of the jumpmaster (Be it stressed, bumped, brolled w.e) and packs feedback for after the torps run dry

 

not to mention the positioning and action denial benefits that come with bumping itself, ofc

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Is the Ghost any good in this matchup? Slam into them with Chopper possibly making them predictable with that dial. Equip the Autoblaster Turret and Accuracy Corrector. Double tapping with Phantom. The 5k turn. 16 points to chew through. I haven't run the Ghost yet but it jumped out as something I'd want throw at the triple scout list.

BTW does the triple scout list have a nickname yet?

Triple U-boat.
That's lame. Let's go with the Wolf Pack (nickname for the German U-boats in WWII)

As to fighting them, maybe Wes Janson would be good against them? Otherwise, Arc Dodgers can stay out of Torp area, and Carnor/Palob could be pretty effective.

Edited by ThatJakeGuy

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Is the Ghost any good in this matchup? Slam into them with Chopper possibly making them predictable with that dial. Equip the Autoblaster Turret and Accuracy Corrector. Double tapping with Phantom. The 5k turn. 16 points to chew through. I haven't run the Ghost yet but it jumped out as something I'd want throw at the triple scout list.

BTW does the triple scout list have a nickname yet?

Triple U-boat.
That's lame. Let's go with the Wolf Pack (nickname for the German U-boats in WWII)

As to fighting them, maybe Wes Janson would be good against them? Otherwise, Arc Dodgers can stay out of Torp area, and Carnor/Palob could be pretty effective.

 

Janson, Jax, and Godalhi: None of them actually make the victim spend their token, so it stops the Overclocked shenanigans.

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you have to weigh the 1 point less for the incalculably lesser flexibility in obtaining that stress token, including no deadeye post sexy white 2-segnors (or any maneuver not going left)

 

It's worth it for the largely superior Protons vs. Plasmas.

 

 

neither of which do anything when you make yourself that predictable

 

 

On one ship. That is predictable twice at most so that your other two ships can fire better torpedoes.

 

 

could do the same with bumpmaster, which adds the utility with intel agent with potential of Manaroo which makes things even more flexible since she can enable deadeye no matter the condition of the jumpmaster (Be it stressed, bumped, brolled w.e) and packs feedback for after the torps run dry

 

not to mention the positioning and action denial benefits that come with bumping itself, ofc

 

 

At which point you no longer have three ships with torps. If that's what you want to do, that's fine, but MJ's got the right of it: 2x Proton/R4 and 1x Plasma/OCR4 beats 3x Plasma/R4 if you're wanting to run triple U-boats.

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PS4 Gammas are amazing to fight them, but they suffer against most other lists popular today. Should the meta however be overrun with wolf packs and quad TLTs they are kings. Observe your meta closely and you might become able to brag with a tournament win using 4 TIE Bombers.

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you have to weigh the 1 point less for the incalculably lesser flexibility in obtaining that stress token, including no deadeye post sexy white 2-segnors (or any maneuver not going left)

 

The 3rd U-boat only has one Plasma anyway, so it doesn't matter if you don't take extra munitions. Once it's fired it's done.

 

 

That list will be incredibly vulnerable to additional stress, though.

 

The stress dealers generally won't live long enough for it to matter. The 3rd U-boat with feedback array really won't care about stress at all anyway once his plasma torpedo is spent.

 

 

Don't see the merit of plasmas here, I'm afraid.

Telling the truth, three flechettes leave enough room for crew

and we now have lots of cheap great crew >:}

 

Because damage is king, and once your torpedoes are gone, the Jump Masters have close to zero damage output. Flechettes will not win you tournaments unfortunately.

 

 

There are some really nice crew options now that you can use for a control piece though.

 

Intel Agent + Feedback Array + Anti Pursuit Lasers on a large base ship with barrel roll is just silly good vs low HP aces like Fel.

 

 

If people sit with their stress dealers at PS2, no.  However, PS 4 stress dealers, especially if protected by, say, Biggs with R4-D6 will live long enough to weigh them down.   In fact, a stresshog could just fire at two different jumpmasters with overclocked which means that re-acquiring a second token would leave them double stressed.

Edited by AlexW

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19: Blount w/ VI, Tracers

17: Tala w/ Concussion Missile, Chips

17: Tala w/ Concussion Missile, Chips

17: Tala w/ Concussion Missile, Chips

17: Tala w/ Concussion Missile, Chips

13: Tala

Total: 100

Two U-boats are a lot less scary than three.

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A pray it works mentality:

Whisper with sensor jammer and acd. About as survivable as possible amongst Imperial small bases. A well flown soontir would dominate em. I also know that a well flown Carnor Jax would cancel the entire strategy.

 

I've seen Carnor get destroyed by them because they forget that they can still TL, Deadeye just gives you the option to use a Focus.

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If people sit with their stress dealers at PS2, no.  However, PS 4 stress dealers, especially if protected by, say, Biggs with R4-D6 will live long enough to weigh them down.   In fact, a stresshog could just fire at two different jumpmasters with overclocked which means that re-acquiring a second token would leave them double stressed.

 

If we're talking about this squad:

 

2x Proton Torpedoes + Extra Munitions + R4

1x Plasma Torpedo + OCR4

 

... then there are a couple of pertinent points.

  1. You can't stop any of the Jump Masters from firing their Torpedoes in the first round, unless you manage to dodge their arcs, kill them outright, or prevent the focus from being spent. A stress control list will not be able to do any of these.
  2. The OCR4 doesn't care if it gets stressed, because its Plasma Torpedo will already be spent anyway. Even if it has 5x stress, just ram it down your opponent's throat and block with it, it just became your control piece.

So a stress list needs to aim to get multiple stress onto the two Jump Masters that have one more Proton Torpedo left in the tube.

 

Combat will go down something like this:

  1. PS4 pieces put some stress onto the 2 Proton U-boats.
  2. U-boats kill Biggs in one round. With a little luck Biggs dies after the 2nd shot, and one of the support ships eats a Proton Torp.
  3. Proton Torp U-Boats rush in with 2 FWD greens, while the OCR4 boat rams itself down their throats with a 3 or 4 FWD to really gum up the works, because it doesn't care about shedding stress. The goal is to get the stress ships at R1 so their TLT is useless.
  4. Stress ships try and focus fire down one of the Proton U-boats. U-Boats try and focus fire down one of the remaining stress ships.
  5. It's off to the races to see who does more damage first. The U-Boats may not even need to get off a 4th torpedo, but if they do it's probably game over.

 

 

19: Blount w/ VI, Tracers

17: Tala w/ Concussion Missile, Chips

17: Tala w/ Concussion Missile, Chips

17: Tala w/ Concussion Missile, Chips

17: Tala w/ Concussion Missile, Chips

13: Tala

Total: 100

Two U-boats are a lot less scary than three.

 

Yup. The alpha strike meta is countered by.... a higher PS alpha strike meta. You probably want one Tala with a Homing Missile to threaten Fel.

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Once wave 8 hit, how would you deal with this build? 

Contracted Scout (25)Deadeye (1)Extra Munitions (2)Plasma Torpedoes (3)R4 Agromech (2)Guidance Chips (0) Contracted Scout (25)Deadeye (1)Extra Munitions (2)Plasma Torpedoes (3)R4 Agromech (2)Guidance Chips (0) Contracted Scout (25)Deadeye (1)Extra Munitions (2)Plasma Torpedoes (3)R4 Agromech (2)Guidance Chips (0) Total: 99 View in Yet Another Squad Builder

 Basically, focus to be able to shoot the torpedoes on whoever is at range 2-3 of you. Which grant you a TL on the target and with guidance chip, you will get 4 hits 74% of time, 3 hits 21% of time and 2 hits 5% of time.
  You're close, but it's not quite optimal yet. You see, for firing Plasma Torpedoes with Deadeye, Overclocked R4 yields exactly the same hit+crit distribution as having an R4 Agromech. Each die has exactly a 75% chance of yielding a hit or crit after modification. And then you use Guidance chip if you didn't get 4 hits+crits. 49jOUfA.jpg  For some unknown reason, FFG made the Overclocked R4 only 1 point, so you can save an extra point on the Plasma U-boats, resulting in:   

Now+we+re+going+to+get+quot+50+shades+of  Contracted Scout (34)Proton TorpedoesExtra MunitionsR4 AgromechDeadeyeGuidance Chips Contracted Scout (34)Proton TorpedoesExtra MunitionsR4 AgromechDeadeyeGuidance Chips Contracted Scout (32)Plasma TorpedoesExtra MunitionsOverclocked R4DeadeyeGuidance Chips

  You can further tweak this by removing Extra Munitions from the 3rd Scout, and replacing it with Feedback Array instead, to deal with those pesky aces that inevitably don't always die in the initial joust.

Wait, does that really work out as exactly the same? Don't get me wrong, they should be roughly equivalent, but given protons get the free minifocus and TLs both fix double-blanks and generally give slightly more crits on their rerolls, my intuition suggests R4 should still win out, if only by a little?

Help me out here, it's got me worried that I'm missing something in my mental arethmetic ;)

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So here's a Biggs squad that's reasonable. It doesn't go full-out stress, but it doesn't need to.

Red Ace + R2-D2 + Comm Relay

Biggs + R4-D6 + IA

Gold + R3-A2 + TLT + BTL-A4

Bandit

It looks like a list that Paul would run. The only problem is that the only counter vs high PS Aces (of which we keep getting more) is the Stresshog. Lose that and you're toast.

Against triple U-boats it could do OK. The point is to let Biggs soak the damage while Red Ace becomes indestructible in the end game.

As an aside, Red Ace is crazy jousting efficient if he can get away with greens. But you could swap out Red Ace and the bandit for another regenerator like Miranda, Corran, or Poe.

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Once wave 8 hit, how would you deal with this build? 

Contracted Scout (25)Deadeye (1)Extra Munitions (2)Plasma Torpedoes (3)R4 Agromech (2)Guidance Chips (0) Contracted Scout (25)Deadeye (1)Extra Munitions (2)Plasma Torpedoes (3)R4 Agromech (2)Guidance Chips (0) Contracted Scout (25)Deadeye (1)Extra Munitions (2)Plasma Torpedoes (3)R4 Agromech (2)Guidance Chips (0) Total: 99 View in Yet Another Squad Builder

 Basically, focus to be able to shoot the torpedoes on whoever is at range 2-3 of you. Which grant you a TL on the target and with guidance chip, you will get 4 hits 74% of time, 3 hits 21% of time and 2 hits 5% of time.
  You're close, but it's not quite optimal yet. You see, for firing Plasma Torpedoes with Deadeye, Overclocked R4 yields exactly the same hit+crit distribution as having an R4 Agromech. Each die has exactly a 75% chance of yielding a hit or crit after modification. And then you use Guidance chip if you didn't get 4 hits+crits. 49jOUfA.jpg  For some unknown reason, FFG made the Overclocked R4 only 1 point, so you can save an extra point on the Plasma U-boats, resulting in:   

Now+we+re+going+to+get+quot+50+shades+of  Contracted Scout (34)Proton TorpedoesExtra MunitionsR4 AgromechDeadeyeGuidance Chips Contracted Scout (34)Proton TorpedoesExtra MunitionsR4 AgromechDeadeyeGuidance Chips Contracted Scout (32)Plasma TorpedoesExtra MunitionsOverclocked R4DeadeyeGuidance Chips

  You can further tweak this by removing Extra Munitions from the 3rd Scout, and replacing it with Feedback Array instead, to deal with those pesky aces that inevitably don't always die in the initial joust.

Wait, does that really work out as exactly the same? Don't get me wrong, they should be roughly equivalent, but given protons get the free minifocus and TLs both fix double-blanks and generally give slightly more crits on their rerolls, my intuition suggests R4 should still win out, if only by a little?

Help me out here, it's got me worried that I'm missing something in my mental arethmetic ;)

Plasma + OCR4 + deadeye + GC

is identical (counting crits as hits) to:

Plasma + R4 + deadeye + GC

... however, Proton + R4 + GC + deadeye is better than either, specifically because you get a TL AND a soft focus. Plus you get more crits. R4 is better on protons than OCR4 since OCR4 makes the soft focus useless (except for getting a crit instead of a hit). But on Plasmas it doesn't matter.

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So here's a Biggs squad that's reasonable. It doesn't go full-out stress, but it doesn't need to.

Red Ace + R2-D2 + Comm Relay

Biggs + R4-D6 + IA

Gold + R3-A2 + TLT + BTL-A4

Bandit

It looks like a list that Paul would run. The only problem is that the only counter vs high PS Aces (of which we keep getting more) is the Stresshog. Lose that and you're toast.

Against triple U-boats it could do OK. The point is to let Biggs soak the damage while Red Ace becomes indestructible in the end game.

As an aside, Red Ace is crazy jousting efficient if he can get away with greens. But you could swap out Red Ace and the bandit for another regenerator like Miranda, Corran, or Poe.

Drop the Bandit for 2 Chips and Proton Torps on Red Ace and Biggs. Then you have 4 points for something, maybe Proton Torps on the Gold also?

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Using what I have and nothing else, I think I'd start with a very defensive Vader:

 

34 Vader + Juke + Sensor Jammer + Stealth Device

 

If he can't arc dodge with a barrel roll, he turtles up behind Evade+Focus; Juke is there to turn his defense into offense, and though Stealth Device is iffy at best it plus Sensor Jammer will turn him into a very hard to hit pilot via ordnance that spends its focus/TL. It's a build I've been thinking about for a while, but probably wouldn't be necessary until now. 

 

Then add a Zeta Leader with Predator. He's pretty strong by himself for the price, and barring bad luck the TIE/fo can survive a Proton/Plasma hit.

 

That brings me to 43 points left. I think that a Storm Squadron with AC would be consistent damage while being able to hide behind an Evade (or Focus), which leaves 20 points...

 

An Omega Squadron with Outmaneuver.

 

34 Vader: Juke, TIE/x1, Sensor Jammer, Stealth Device

23 Zeta Leader: Predator

23 Storm Squadron: TIE/x1, Accuracy Corrector

20 Omega Squadron: Outmaneuver

 

By trying to divide up the points fairly evenly, I'm minimizing the losses  - and yes, worse at jousting, but hopefully better at maneuvering. They'll have to spend at least two missiles bringing down each ship, worse than that if they decide to aim at Vader.

 

Against Palpaces, it's a matter of prediction, and hopefully my Vader will be tougher than theirs. Against TLT-spam I'm higher PS than them and can ruin them one at a time. Against regen... well, in theory my damage output is decent enough if I focus fire and don't let Miranda or Poe escape for too long. My ability to use K's and reds with most of the squadron will help that; it's pretty action-independent.

 

Might just go with Vader+VI+ATC+SD, as I wouldn't be spending the TL and would be fairly free to turtle up still. He'd take a lot of fire, but he'd kill things before dying.

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Soo if you have spent your torpedoes, say 1 ship dies before using all of them as well.  Your down to how much offense?

 

It's not so much a question of how much offence the U-boats have left afterwards, but how much the opponent has left.

 

Because even if you lose one of the Proton-boats with a torpedo still in the tube, that's still 15.4 expected damage you will have handed out just from the torpedoes. That's enough to cut most lists in half or worse, so all the PWT on the remaining U-boats have to do is mop up.

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