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Wildhorn

The 3 Scouts

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Seems I'm joining the U-Boat train a bit late...

 

Do you guys think it's worth it to get Three J5Ks to make this specific build? I'd like to give it a try but concerned that once new wave comes only 1 of the toilet bowls will stay in the meta. Then again I don't even know what I'm talking about so your opinion is highly sought.

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Seems I'm joining the U-Boat train a bit late...

 

Do you guys think it's worth it to get Three J5Ks to make this specific build? I'd like to give it a try but concerned that once new wave comes only 1 of the toilet bowls will stay in the meta. Then again I don't even know what I'm talking about so your opinion is highly sought.

Proxy the list before you commit to buying 3 JM5K. The list is strong, but may not float your boat. Personally, I like 2 Scouts and Palob.

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I was running three tonight. They're fun to fly, but I can see them being very much an acquired taste, and they're not the unstoppable force some make them out to be. Try one in a list and see how you like it. I can see myself flying two with a Slaver or 4-Lom, even just one (the mere idea of Tel with hull upgrade and Gonk makes me giggle).

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Kanan with TLT, FCS, 3PO and Lando, with a docked phantom, would absolutely rinse the Admiral.

 

 

C3PO doesn't work on ghost 90% of the time because you make no roll. No roll-no trigger.

 

 

C3P0 triggers every time the Ghost Landos as an action.

 

Crazy I've never realized that synergy before.

 

it's not a good synergy, though

 

6 points for an evade and maybe two or focus/evade if you're lucky

 

at that point, you can cut out the middle man with your normal action +r2d2 (crew)

Especially since Jan and Recon Specialist gives you Focus + Evade without the gamble for one point less.

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Just had a thought (Dangerous, I know).

​Trip Scouts main advantage is in their glorious alpha and beta strikes.

What happens when we masse PS 4 arc-dodgers against them instead?

They die xD

Crackswarm blows them up sky-high, we've already figured that out in playtesting

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Do you guys think it's worth it to get Three J5Ks to make this specific build? I'd like to give it a try but concerned that once new wave comes only 1 of the toilet bowls will stay in the meta. Then again I don't even know what I'm talking about so your opinion is highly sought.

It is definitely worth getting one. The JM5K is a very strong ship with torpedo Scout, Mindlink Manaroo and PO Dengar all looking very promising. Once you have played it a bit, you can decide if you like the Torpedo Scout enough to get a couple more. The great thing about the JM5K is that it doesn't need to be spammed to be strong. Even one is a great ship which means even if you decide not to run triple Scouts, you still have one of the faction's best ships for your list.

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People are worried about Triple scouts, which is understandable as it is both new and potent.

 

Now imagine what happens when this http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!191:19,136,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;191:19,-1,126,-1,13,-1:-1:25:;191:19,1,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;51:-1,-1,-1,-1,143,-1:-1:25:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadronis released.

 

Granted, no turrets or Jumpmaster dial, but better point spread and similar modifiers.

+, Large ship players are going to cry/tremble.

 

You can also go full bananas and enjoy the random chaos that http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Rebel%20Alliance&d=v4!s!66:19,143:-1:-1:;64:17:-1:25:;64:13:-1:25:;64:13:-1:25:;64:13:-1:25:;64:13:-1:25:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadronbrings.

 

The ordnance Alpha is here to stay.

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I have played against this list (three ordinance toilet seats) a couple of times now and it really doesn't work against me, its the same as dual IG lists, I just seem to have a really good game against them. The trade off however is that I seem to get tabled embarrassingly easily by such things like Carnor Jax with VI, Fel's wrath and TIE fighters. (Fel's Wrath. . you read that right, I will let that one sink in for a moment).

 

As an example, I found that good asteroid placement makes it difficult for all three Scouts to unleash hell on the same target in the same turn which is where the strength of the list lie. Also, they are so action dependant that a single stress or bump can cause the entire wombo combo to fall flat.

 

In the games that I have played against them, a single headhunter managed to car park two of them into each other and the third didn't have arc for torps. The rest of my list pounded one to within two hull of its life for the lost of only two shields on the second headhunter.

By the end of the game, I still had my Mist Hunter at full and my own Jumpmaster at half health. Two of the JM5K didn't manage to fire a single ordinance shot.

 

So in my experience, its a great list if your opponent flies right at you and tries to joust. You have the hull to survive all but the best offence and your own return fire will be crippling. Anything else however and you are just a 2 dice 360 ship, desperately trying to get stuff in arc, beyond range 2, with a focus token and at PS3. That's a lot of caveats for four dice.

 

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Just had a thought (Dangerous, I know).

​Trip Scouts main advantage is in their glorious alpha and beta strikes.

What happens when we masse PS 4 arc-dodgers against them instead?

They die xD

Crackswarm blows them up sky-high, we've already figured that out in playtesting

 

I don't see how how the Crackswarm can beat them. On the alpha strike, they gonna bump into the Bumpmaster. Leaving at least 1 or 2 tie without action, so most likely there gonna be 2 tie that will die.

 

Contracted Scout (25)
Adaptability (0)
Intelligence Agent (1)
Feedback Array (2)
Anti-Pursuit Lasers (2)
 
Contracted Scout (25)
Deadeye (1)
Extra Munitions (2)
Proton Torpedoes (4)
Boba Fett (1)
R4 Agromech (2)
Guidance Chips (0)
 
Contracted Scout (25)
Deadeye (1)
Extra Munitions (2)
Proton Torpedoes (4)
- <-- You could add 4-LOM here if you do not mind rolling for initiative vs PS2/PS3.
R4 Agromech (2)
Guidance Chips (0)
 
Total: 99
 

 

 

Edited by Wildhorn

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I've played with and against this build a good few times and it's phenomenal. I've gone from "doesn't seem THAT good" to "it's just amazing." Why do the generic and the lowest PS unique ship have EPTs? What were they thinking? I can't think of any other ship where every pilot has the EPT slot (edit: Aggressor I suppose. But that's a peculiarity of its own). Very odd when FFG seems to be moving away from giving every ship EPTs at all, let alone a ship with both a crew and an astro slot. 

 

Even with the lists suggested, I don't think they work that well. The crack swarm may work but there's so much hull and shield there to absorb damage. It's also not JUST an alpha strike, two torps each and usually only 1-2 ships launching a turn means that torp danger persists for a long time. Especially proton torpedoes are arguably nastier late-game when shields are down. The dial and the white sloop makes predicting their maneuver very hard and the barrel roll makes for amazing blockers. And being so maneuverable they can typically choose the way they engage. A lot of people have said "draw them into the asteroids", but in my experience they're perfectly happy there. They can turn on a dime and BR as necessary - if anything the asteroids allow them to block out your movement even more effectively. And the turret means they can make a blocking move or bug out and still plink away - 2 dice ain't amazing but it adds up. 

 

So far, even when building a list with facing toilet seats in mind, they just don't have an easy weakness to exploit. I asked an experienced player what, so far, he likes to face the least with the JM15K list. His answer was other JM15K lists ... which isn't a great sign!

 

Even 1 or 2 JM5K makes for a great addition to any list. They're cheap and effective. I've been using Manaroo a bit and I think she might have the best pilot ability in the game. It's phenomenally useful even without mindlink shenanigans. 

 

I think agree with the poster earlier that said this will be the biggest meta-warping thing in the game since the phantom. I think it's going to take a while before it really percolates down to smaller events just because of the hefty model requirement (not to mention 3 deadeyes and 3 extra munitions). But I think for serious tournament play it is going to be a list that everyone is going to have to be able to deal with if they want to compete. So far the solutions I've seen involving list tailoring specifically against this list do not even seem to handle it that well. Wes, Jax, Crackswarm. All of these give you tools but hardly shut down the jumpmasters hard. It's early days, sure, but the jumpmaster is going to be a challenge. 

Edited by The Inquisitor

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People are worried about Triple scouts, which is understandable as it is both new and potent.

 

 

Now imagine what happens when this http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!191:19,136,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;191:19,-1,126,-1,13,-1:-1:25:;191:19,1,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;51:-1,-1,-1,-1,143,-1:-1:25:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadronis released.

 

 

 

What's the point in triple deadeye when you have tracers? You can build a list like that now using scimitars or gammas and spend the points saved on more ordinance (another tube of tracers for Jonus plus extra munitions). 

 

You could also do this:

 

Gamma Sqdn Veteran (19), Deadeye (1), Extra munitions (2), Plasma torps (3), Guidance Chips (0)

X4

 

Thats FOUR torpedoes alpha strike at PS5 with deadeye, but no re-rolls on the torps, so probably not much more effective.

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Does triple U-Boat have to be 3x Scout?

This is 101 points:

Contracted Scout and Dengar, each with Deadeye, R4, Proton Torpedoes, EM, Chips

Contracted Scout with nothing on it, stripped down BumpMaster.

So just take one point off wherever you'd want to and there you go. Dengar U-Boat can fire off both torpedoes in a round should he be attacked.

IDK, just a thought.

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People are worried about Triple scouts, which is understandable as it is both new and potent.

 

 

Now imagine what happens when this http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!191:19,136,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;191:19,-1,126,-1,13,-1:-1:25:;191:19,1,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;51:-1,-1,-1,-1,143,-1:-1:25:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadronis released.

 

 

 

What's the point in triple deadeye when you have tracers? You can build a list like that now using scimitars or gammas and spend the points saved on more ordinance (another tube of tracers for Jonus plus extra munitions). 

 

You could also do this:

 

Gamma Sqdn Veteran (19), Deadeye (1), Extra munitions (2), Plasma torps (3), Guidance Chips (0)

X4

 

Thats FOUR torpedoes alpha strike at PS5 with deadeye, but no re-rolls on the torps, so probably not much more effective.

 

For the beta strike.

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It can be beaten. I've done it, and so have others, and it's vulnerable to bad piloting and bumps.

 

It's strong, and beats the hell out of last month's meta, but it's not invulnerable. Just requires... a new way of thinking.

 

Even old lists utilized differently can do it.

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People are worried about Triple scouts, which is understandable as it is both new and potent.

 

 

Now imagine what happens when this http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!191:19,136,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;191:19,-1,126,-1,13,-1:-1:25:;191:19,1,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;51:-1,-1,-1,-1,143,-1:-1:25:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadronis released.

 

 

 

What's the point in triple deadeye when you have tracers? You can build a list like that now using scimitars or gammas and spend the points saved on more ordinance (another tube of tracers for Jonus plus extra munitions). 

 

You could also do this:

 

Gamma Sqdn Veteran (19), Deadeye (1), Extra munitions (2), Plasma torps (3), Guidance Chips (0)

X4

 

Thats FOUR torpedoes alpha strike at PS5 with deadeye, but no re-rolls on the torps, so probably not much more effective.

 

 

My version was proton torpedoes on all of them and only 2 get extra munitions.  Gets you a stronger alpha strike with the modification from proton torpedoes, at the cost of 2 less missiles compared to that version.  Still has just as many missiles as the triple uboat total, but lets you fire 4 turn 1 instead of 3.

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People are worried about Triple scouts, which is understandable as it is both new and potent.

 

 

Now imagine what happens when this http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!191:19,136,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;191:19,-1,126,-1,13,-1:-1:25:;191:19,1,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;51:-1,-1,-1,-1,143,-1:-1:25:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadronis released.

 

What's the point in triple deadeye when you have tracers? You can build a list like that now using scimitars or gammas and spend the points saved on more ordinance (another tube of tracers for Jonus plus extra munitions). 

 

You could also do this:

 

Gamma Sqdn Veteran (19), Deadeye (1), Extra munitions (2), Plasma torps (3), Guidance Chips (0)

X4

 

Thats FOUR torpedoes alpha strike at PS5 with deadeye, but no re-rolls on the torps, so probably not much more effective.

 

My version was proton torpedoes on all of them and only 2 get extra munitions.  Gets you a stronger alpha strike with the modification from proton torpedoes, at the cost of 2 less missiles compared to that version.  Still has just as many missiles as the triple uboat total, but lets you fire 4 turn 1 instead of 3.

Why use Gamma Squadron Veterans? Why not just regular Gammas at PS 4, each with Homing Missiles, EM, and chips/LRS.

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My version was proton torpedoes on all of them and only 2 get extra munitions.  Gets you a stronger alpha strike with the modification from proton torpedoes, at the cost of 2 less missiles compared to that version.  Still has just as many missiles as the triple uboat total, but lets you fire 4 turn 1 instead of 3.

 

 

Yeah that sounds nastier. 

 

All of these bomber lists bother me less than the U-boats though. So much more fragile framework even if the total hit points is pretty close. That said, that's on paper. It might put out enough of an alpha strike to shame the triple U-boats.

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Once imperial aces drops, I wouldn't mind trying this:

Captain Jonus (22)

Adaptability (0)

Fleet Officer (3)

Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1)

TIE Shuttle (0)

Gamma Squadron Veteran (19)

Deadeye (1)

Plasma Torpedoes (3)

Extra Munitions (2)

Guidance Chips (0)

Gamma Squadron Veteran (19)

Deadeye (1)

Proton Torpedoes (4)

Extra Munitions (2)

Guidance Chips (0)

"Zeta Ace" (18)

Juke (2)

Comm Relay (3)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

A bit of a hybrid aplha strike. You get your rerolls, you get your modifications to the dice, but you also get a bit of synergy and a flanker. Definitely worth trying.

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People are worried about Triple scouts, which is understandable as it is both new and potent.

 

 

Now imagine what happens when this http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!191:19,136,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;191:19,-1,126,-1,13,-1:-1:25:;191:19,1,126,-1,-1,-1:-1:25:;51:-1,-1,-1,-1,143,-1:-1:25:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadronis released.

 

What's the point in triple deadeye when you have tracers? You can build a list like that now using scimitars or gammas and spend the points saved on more ordinance (another tube of tracers for Jonus plus extra munitions). 

 

You could also do this:

 

Gamma Sqdn Veteran (19), Deadeye (1), Extra munitions (2), Plasma torps (3), Guidance Chips (0)

X4

 

Thats FOUR torpedoes alpha strike at PS5 with deadeye, but no re-rolls on the torps, so probably not much more effective.

 

My version was proton torpedoes on all of them and only 2 get extra munitions.  Gets you a stronger alpha strike with the modification from proton torpedoes, at the cost of 2 less missiles compared to that version.  Still has just as many missiles as the triple uboat total, but lets you fire 4 turn 1 instead of 3.

Why use Gamma Squadron Veterans? Why not just regular Gammas at PS 4, each with Homing Missiles, EM, and chips/LRS.

 

 

Because regular gammas don't get the EPT so no deadeye.  Deadeye is a HUGE buff for ordnance carriers because it removes the requirement to get the TL.  Against a triple u-boat list that won't matter, but against anything else, you wanna be able to fire with a focus.

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