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Skargoth

Accused of Loaded Dice

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I just attended a Store Championship (I'm in the backseat of a 2.5 hour commute home) and made the top 8 cut at 4-1 with Brobots with 38 people. After tabling my opponent into the top 4 I noticed my opponent lingering at the table where I left my stuff, then I saw my dice were strewn on the table. I chalked it up to salty guy, but then a TO went over and joined. I was flattered I guess I was doing well.

Then I was approached by the TOs stating there had been multiple complaints about my dice. I was shocked, but the TOs were not accusatory. Still, I felt like I was going to have a panic attack at the scrutiny. They offered to open a fresh box and give me different dice to use to quiet the accusers. I instantly said yes, because I was completely innocent and had done nothing wrong.

Needless to say the next round went terribly for me because my head wasn't in the game.

At no point while I was playing did a TO come over and observe the game, even in the top 8.

The accomplishment of the day is heavily tarnished.

Pardon the unfiltered train of thought.

TLDR: Got accused of loaded dice. TOs took me aside without ever observing me play or offering communal dice and really threw off my whole game and ruined an otherwise good experience. Did they take appropriate action?

Edit: Lost to the same person in top 4 I lost to in Swiss. Also, I think opponents weren't accounting for Brobot modifiers (FCS, AT, Glitter).

Edited by Skargoth

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Although I sympathise with your mindset and that it caused your head not to be in the game (I imagine if such an accusation were levelled at me I'd feel the same way, although that is unlikely unless people think I'm loading my dice to roll blanks), I think the TO probably handled things as well as they could. I imagine the quickest resolution for them would be to simply swap your dice. I might have thought first steps may have been to casually observe one of your matches to see if your dice are behaving unusually or something, but I suppose swapping the dice is quicker.

Did they examine your dice at all first or did they go straight to offering the fresh pack?

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They looked at my dice while I was across the room without asking after my top 8 win. As I said I was kinda flattered but I didn't expect it to go any further. I'm not superstitious about my dice or anything. There was never observation even when there were only 4 tables to watch.

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You go to someone else's town and you're at their mercy. Sounds like they had the Sore Loser Click in full press mode. The TO system is wack. I don't know why anyone would agree to change dice.

That's what the TO friend who attended with me said.

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I think the TO handled it well, if he does nothing all the people that were salty they lost to you will be a huge annoyance for the tourney. Simply swapping your dice shuts everyone up.

 

Its unfortunate that it through you off your game, and i feel bad that there are those that cant handle loosing and blame it on others cheating. Way back in my mechwarrior days i was accused of having loaded dice by the person running the tournaments because i would routinely beat him and there was no way on earth anyone could beat him without cheating so he started supplying me with dice before every event I still kept beating him and so when the nice prizes came up he start cheating by making strange rules calls and what not in our matches in order for him to win. I had to take it up with wizkids games and got them involved causing him allot of issues since he was cheating. basically it destroyed my experience playing that game at organized events and everyone but the tournament organizer and his best friend started playing in my basement without prize support. (this suited the organizer just fine because then he got all the prize support and could sell the extra on ebay).

 

Long story short some people are very sore looser and the TO swapping your dice was an effort to shut them up without ruining your day. You have to shrug it off and move on, take it as a compliment that you were so good that the enemy thought you were cheating.

 

Edit: its easy to get mad at the TO but from his/her perspective swapping dice stops the people complaining in there tracks and lets the tournament continue. If they do nothing then those sore looser types will just keep escalating and making things worse for you and the TO as well as everyone else there.

Edited by Icelom

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They looked at my dice while I was across the room without asking after my top 8 win. As I said I was kinda flattered but I didn't expect it to go any further. I'm not superstitious about my dice or anything. There was never observation even when there were only 4 tables to watch.

Yeah, I guess your best bet is to take it as a sort of compliment.

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the TO did not handle this correctly. either you were using loaded dice or you weren't. if you were, he should have checked. if you weren't, he shouldn't have bothered you to change dice.

 

all he needed to do was throw your dice a few times and see if anything was wrong. a lot of people don't understand statistics. it's perfectly normal for a player to go through a few lucky streaks.

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They looked at my dice while I was across the room without asking after my top 8 win.

 

I would have been pretty pissed off at that personally.  Whatever their "reason", at the end of the day, they were going through your property without asking you first.  The decent thing to do would have been for the TO to approach you first, inform you that there had been an accusation, and ask to see your dice. 

 

Having your accuser go through your dice without a TO (at first) or you at all, present is - in my mind - akin to evidence tampering.  What if your accuser was just sh*tty because he'd lost, and decided to switch out your dice with actual loaded ones before bringing a TO over?  (Sure, it's unlikely, but not improbable.)

 

I actually keep my dice on me at all times during a tourny, just to be sure.  It also doesn't help that I think there is a klepto at many of my FLGS tournaments, as Ive come away from two separate tournys down a dice or two....

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Then I was approached by the TOs stating there had been multiple complaints about my dice. I was shocked, but the TOs were not accusatory.

Curious, how would you have handled it? Don't they have a responsibility to all players?

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Unless you have sat down with someone's dice and done some serious math an accusation like this is completely unacceptable. The human mind is built to recognize patterns even where none exist. Don't accuse people of this. Don't even let yourself think it or you'll see cheaters behind every fcs.

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There's no way I would have agreed to switch dice. That's bowing to pressure when you've done nothing wrong. It's lending legitimacy to baseless claims.

At that point I was very shaken up and was of the mindset to do anything to clear my name. Unfortunately, being shaken up also means I played like garbage. I think that bothers me most. Now that I lost with the "neutral dice" it must mean I had done something shady.

This is the location that's hosting the only Regionals in my area (yay, peninsula of Florida) so now I don't know what to do. I show up and the local clique start gossiping? My friends and I came here to check out the environment, now no one wants to come back.

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Wait, no observations? Pathetic. The odds are never great with such clouds hanging over a tournament, but that's just ridiculous.

 

Alas, you may as well go back if it's the only regional you can make.

 

Be sure to offer to share dice & templates at the start of each game, and no-one can gripe. Also (and I wish we didn't have to do this, but...) mentally prepare yourself for unsportsmanlike legalese tricks; it's tough when you're there to hang out and make friends, but some days you have to be hardened before the accusations ever fly.

 

... did they let you keep the dice? ;)

Edited by Reiver

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Go.. have fun.. kick their behinds, and when the accusations fly.. tell them to bring proof or STFU.. sore losers are not helping the situation. If you cant take your loss gracefully find a new game.. I don't cry "Cheater" when I lose, I take my loss and look to the next game, try and figure out what I did wrong.. 

 

People need to remember this is a game, and falsely accusing someone of cheating can carry over to other events.. also.. keep your hands off that which does not belong to you. 

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Wait, no observations? Pathetic. The odds are never great with such clouds hanging over a tournament, but that's just ridiculous.

 

Alas, you may as well go back if it's the only regional you can make.

 

Be sure to offer to share dice & templates at the start of each game, and no-one can gripe. Also (and I wish we didn't have to do this, but...) mentally prepare yourself for unsportsmanlike legalese tricks; it's tough when you're there to hang out and make friends, but some days you have to be hardened before the accusations ever fly.

 

... did they let you keep the dice? ;)

My dice? Yes. I brought six of each and they only gave me three per to use, I gave the loaners back. If I do go back I'm bringing the same dice and saying loudly and often they are the same as before.

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There's no way I would have agreed to switch dice. That's bowing to pressure when you've done nothing wrong. It's lending legitimacy to baseless claims.

At that point I was very shaken up and was of the mindset to do anything to clear my name. Unfortunately, being shaken up also means I played like garbage. I think that bothers me most. Now that I lost with the "neutral dice" it must mean I had done something shady.

This is the location that's hosting the only Regionals in my area (yay, peninsula of Florida) so now I don't know what to do. I show up and the local clique start gossiping? My friends and I came here to check out the environment, now no one wants to come back.

 

 

That is super easy to solve. Next time you simply play directly with the dice of your opponent and they are shut down right from the beginning. It solves as well any issues about cheating, because it is highly unlikely that someone adjusts his list to some special loaded dice that helps him more than they would for his opponent. 

 

Besides that: Events like this build character, getting all shaken because someone you barely know assumed you cheat is something you should get rid off anyway. Changing dice, playing with your dice, playing with theirs, does it matter? Just be happy that you seem to have had a lucky dice streak. 

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