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Dual Cards and the X-Wing Fix

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As someone still getting into the game, I am pleasantly surprised at how much apparent love there is for the iconic T65. Normally if a pilot, ship, upgrade is released that doesn't cut it, there is small amount of angst and then it rapidly migrates to the back of the closet and bottom of the box. Not so with the original X-wing. 3-4 years and 8 waves later we are still either trying to fix it, defend it, or simply figure out the right way to fly it.

The game is called X-wing, after all. Some of us really want the iconic ship to be a reliable core component of the game.

I've been tempted to run T-70 stats with T-65 models, so my favorite ship can be viable on the board.

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X-wings are very strong in Atlanta. Several cuts have been made, including one win by yours truly. Hell, I made top 4 with 2 rookies last year, at the height of when the phantom was unbeatable, and I beat a phantom to do it.

The x-wing doesn't need much more than better pilots, and I'm not talking about the cards on the table.

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As someone still getting into the game, I am pleasantly surprised at how much apparent love there is for the iconic T65. Normally if a pilot, ship, upgrade is released that doesn't cut it, there is small amount of angst and then it rapidly migrates to the back of the closet and bottom of the box. Not so with the original X-wing. 3-4 years and 8 waves later we are still either trying to fix it, defend it, or simply figure out the right way to fly it.

The game is called X-wing, after all. Some of us really want the iconic ship to be a reliable core component of the game.

I've been tempted to run T-70 stats with T-65 models, so my favorite ship can be viable on the board.

 

I totally agree. Hopefully I didn't come across as sarcastic. That was the farthest thing from my intention.  I love flying X wings and TIEs. Now if FFG would bring out some Scum uglies at about 10-12pts. Y-Tie and Tie-Wings for the hilarity.

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The image of X Wings flapping their S Foils open and closed in the middle of a dogfight is absurd.

The image of X Wings flapping their S Foils open and closed in the middle of a dogfight is absurd.

They aren't flapping wings like a bird they are switching when needed

Something xwings do do in the books already and In the 7th movie

It's actually their main selling point in cannon because it gives the ship versatility where there was none earlier

X-wings are very strong in Atlanta. Several cuts have been made, including one win by yours truly. Hell, I made top 4 with 2 rookies last year, at the height of when the phantom was unbeatable, and I beat a phantom to do it.

The x-wing doesn't need much more than better pilots, and I'm not talking about the cards on the table.

Especially since the X-wing arguably has some of the best pilots already lol

But while I agree that X-wings always lose is a myth

I do think they need something to help them

Another action of their bar or some maneuverability would be enough honestly

Intergrated has already done much for the humble old X

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considering there are several X-wing pilots without EPT and the X-wing has no generic with an EPT slot I think you will find Biggs has just been pushed further back from the table championship. 

 

A 0 point EPT now makes the EPT slot that much valuable and no ship should have an empty EPT slot. I think adaptability may have accidentally introduced some serious power creep to the Ace wing meta and pilots like Fel's Wrath, Kir Kanos, Horton Salm, and any ship without an EPT that isn't a filler like Academy pilot out of the competitive picture.

How many ships with ept's were you running empty before? Because all adaptability doesis give another option for the ept slot, and in the mid PS level the single PA increase is most likely not going to be worth the cost of the ept slot on the ship, my guess is you will be running a muchore valuable ept the adaptability. You do realize you pay for that ept slot right? Tossing in adaptability is not free, the cost of the ept slot was still paid for. Please point me to a list running empty ept slots that just got boosted by adaptability, hell point me at a single ship other then high PS aces that got boosted from adaptability, who was running a naked ept before? Anyone?

The fact that there is a cheap droid that now adds an ept and a flexible hit point with integrated helps all those lower PS x-wing.

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The image of X Wings flapping their S Foils open and closed in the middle of a dogfight is absurd.

But when Poe Dameron does it on screen, oh man is it just the best, right?

 

 

Yeah, he flaps his wings to fit through an impassable space, totally the same thing as flapping you S-Foils to get a speed boost.

 

Just because you played Rogue Squadron as a kid, doesn't mean the game was any good, or the X-Wing flapping it's wings was a good idea. There is no cannon source that says wing-flapping makes the X-Wing go faster, and literally every card the community has come up with to represent the idea has been laughable. Because the idea of an X-Wing frantically flapping it's wings in combat is inherently laughable.

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Title: T65 only Add barrel roll action to your action bar.  2 points.  Since it is a title you can run both it and IA  You get durability and maneuverability.  It is not a T70, but gives you what an X-Wing needs.  Would not be as confusing as a dual card and easier to use.  In comparison to BB8 you would not be restricted to a green maneuver or receive stress like expert handling, but still have the same cost without eating up either the droid slot or pilot slot.

Edited by librarian101

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The T-65 needs to reflect the bravado of the pilots who made the most of their ships. I would want something like this as a title, so that you could still have integrated astro or other mod of your choice.

 

Title: "Hero of the Rebellion"

Cost: 0

T-65 X-Wing Only.

ACTION: Perform a boost or barrel roll action. Gain 1 stress token.

 

Basically, it gives you repositioning, but with a cost to reflect the less maneuverable nature of the ship. I personally don't need to have the ship perform like an Interceptor or A-Wing, but it shouldn't be a tank either. This would give it enough tactical decisions to make it clearly differentiated from the B-Wing, and even the T-70, which has improved shields and a stress-less boost. Pair this title with an integrated astro and R1 astromech and you have, essentially, for a point, put the ship back into a good jouster roll. It's slightly less durable than the B (your green dice may vary), but suddenly can maneuver a bit rather than making straight line jousting runs. 

 

Frankly, they do something like this and I would definitely use more T-65s.

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Integrated astromech fixed the x-wing.

It did not need something massive.

 

It wasn't. It does. They are bad. Goodnight.

Tell that to my regional bye.

 

 

OH NO! You just blew MJ's jousting stats, list juggler results, the designers themselves comments on the ship and the personal accounts of everyone but yourself away with that one anecdote! I guess one person winning a store championship with an X-Wing in their list proves that they're a top tier ship up there with Soontir and Vader!

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As someone still getting into the game, I am pleasantly surprised at how much apparent love there is for the iconic T65. Normally if a pilot, ship, upgrade is released that doesn't cut it, there is small amount of angst and then it rapidly migrates to the back of the closet and bottom of the box. Not so with the original X-wing. 3-4 years and 8 waves later we are still either trying to fix it, defend it, or simply figure out the right way to fly it.

The game is called X-wing, after all. Some of us really want the iconic ship to be a reliable core component of the game.

I've been tempted to run T-70 stats with T-65 models, so my favorite ship can be viable on the board.

 

 

And others would not mind to rename the game to TIE-Fighter, so what? It is just a name. Your argument is rather mood. Still there are decent arguments for having all ships at least semi-competitive and as balanced as possible.

 

Personally I like the rogue squadron title idea. It empathis the idea that those X-Wings are at their best when flying in formations to take care of each other. Though maybe 3 Range and GAIN the Evade action and "if you are outside of range 3 to another ship with this title, you may perform a free barrel roll". Handing out free evades for close formations sounds a little bit too strong, 

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I have played alot with t-65 after the IA was released and I think it was just enough for the x wing.

I think people don't realize that the x wing shouldn't be the top tier or at the bottom. It is supposed to be the middle of the road ship that the rest is compared too.

After the b wing it lost it's role on pure math but now it's back where it belong. A flexible tough fighter with very good pilots but it will and should never be the best ship in the game.

Sure it might only be rookie, biggs or wedge but what so you see for the interceptor sontir and maybe jax. It's the same for most ships

Edited by jocke01

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I think the fundamental issue is that not all x wing pilots are created equal, so any fix that would make most viable would take tarn and Biggs through the roof. I got my regional bye with Biggs with r4-d6 and IA and he functions pretty darn well with the current fix.

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While Sfoils makes an interesting mecanical implimentation for the dual cards, I suspect the Xwing fix will be a simple 1 point title that lets you equip any torpedo for free.

Aside from Ion torp and Advanced torp, it's a 3 point rebate, and those two are too expensive anyway, according to the minition pricing thread smeone made. Since we can assume a T65 will run IA over Chips, the extra price rebate is reasonable.

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The image of X Wings flapping their S Foils open and closed in the middle of a dogfight is absurd.

But when Poe Dameron does it on screen, oh man is it just the best, right?

 

Yeah, he flaps his wings to fit through an impassable space, totally the same thing as flapping you S-Foils to get a speed boost.

 

Just because you played Rogue Squadron as a kid, doesn't mean the game was any good, or the X-Wing flapping it's wings was a good idea. There is no cannon source that says wing-flapping makes the X-Wing go faster, and literally every card the community has come up with to represent the idea has been laughable. Because the idea of an X-Wing frantically flapping it's wings in combat is inherently laughable.

Not only there is no canon evidence suggesting closed S-foils give any performance boost, the movies themselves give us clues that the opposite is the case - pilots in the DS trench would gladly take some extra speed and those inside the second Death Star surely would trade firepower for some agility.

I'm not against some buffs and I like the idea of dual cards representing X-wing's universal character, but please, call it "Power Management" or "Multirole Loadout", "Mission Profile", "(Veteran's) Intuition", "Universality" or whatever, just leave the S-foils alone.

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I'd like a dual card that was a slam action on one side, and blank to hit on the other. Blank to hit would make weapons guidance look like garbage but I guess you could use them together.

Basically a speed vs offense choice before each game. Double 4 forwards would get any xwing out of the fight.

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At that point I think I wouldn't MIND going with GC over IA; not many ships can use the GC's 'turn to crit' clause, and the X-Wing being one of them (and getting Proton Torps for free) would give it two auto-crits on a shot for... 22 points?

 

Hmm, I'd still prefer something that could take Extra Munitions and shoot twice.

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As someone still getting into the game, I am pleasantly surprised at how much apparent love there is for the iconic T65. Normally if a pilot, ship, upgrade is released that doesn't cut it, there is small amount of angst and then it rapidly migrates to the back of the closet and bottom of the box. Not so with the original X-wing. 3-4 years and 8 waves later we are still either trying to fix it, defend it, or simply figure out the right way to fly it.

The game is called X-wing, after all. Some of us really want the iconic ship to be a reliable core component of the game.

I've been tempted to run T-70 stats with T-65 models, so my favorite ship can be viable on the board.

 

I totally agree. Hopefully I didn't come across as sarcastic. That was the farthest thing from my intention.  I love flying X wings and TIEs. Now if FFG would bring out some Scum uglies at about 10-12pts. Y-Tie and Tie-Wings for the hilarity.

 

That would be awesome, but their dials would be really screwed up.

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The image of X Wings flapping their S Foils open and closed in the middle of a dogfight is absurd.

But when Poe Dameron does it on screen, oh man is it just the best, right?
 

Yeah, he flaps his wings to fit through an impassable space, totally the same thing as flapping you S-Foils to get a speed boost.

 

Just because you played Rogue Squadron as a kid, doesn't mean the game was any good, or the X-Wing flapping it's wings was a good idea. There is no cannon source that says wing-flapping makes the X-Wing go faster, and literally every card the community has come up with to represent the idea has been laughable. Because the idea of an X-Wing frantically flapping it's wings in combat is inherently laughable.

Not only there is no canon evidence suggesting closed S-foils give any performance boost, the movies themselves give us clues that the opposite is the case - pilots in the DS trench would gladly take some extra speed and those inside the second Death Star surely would trade firepower for some agility.

I'm not against some buffs and I like the idea of dual cards representing X-wing's universal character, but please, call it "Power Management" or "Multirole Loadout", "Mission Profile", "(Veteran's) Intuition", "Universality" or whatever, just leave the S-foils alone.

Note I'm not disagreeing, just pointing out a hole in your logic. If they were to do it though, I'd like to see the switch be just as rare and impactful of a difference as it is in the film.

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Integrated astromech fixed the x-wing.

It did not need something massive.

It wasn't. It does. They are bad. Goodnight.

Tell that to my regional bye.

OH NO! You just blew MJ's jousting stats, list juggler results, the designers themselves comments on the ship and the personal accounts of everyone but yourself away with that one anecdote! I guess one person winning a store championship with an X-Wing in their list proves that they're a top tier ship up there with Soontir and Vader!

I mean yeah. I did. More than once. Those numbers are statistical averages, and in a vacuum. They aren't law. Maybe get better at the game and then get back at me.

Edited by nikk whyte

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I'd like a dual card that was a slam action on one side, and blank to hit on the other. Blank to hit would make weapons guidance look like garbage but I guess you could use them together.

Basically a speed vs offense choice before each game. Double 4 forwards would get any xwing out of the fight.

4 forward then slam a k turn. Yes please. Not broken and very awesome. Or just slaming 3 turns and banks. I hope this is it....and the free torpedo. Edited by GeneticDrift

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