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SoontirFel

Imperial ace + mini swarm opinions please

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Looking at the following for competative - assume I have no crackshots

Knowing I have no crackshots, your opinions on this at 99 points

TIE/fo Fighter: · "Epsilon Leader" (19)

TIE Advanced: · Darth Vader (29)

Veteran Instincts (1)

Engine Upgrade (4)

TIE/x1 (0)

Advanced Targeting Computer (1)

TIE Fighter: Academy Pilot (12)

TIE Fighter: Academy Pilot (12)

TIE Fighter: · "Howlrunner" (18)

Push The Limit (3)

Swarm flies at 2x2 box, Vader on his own.

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I was thinking about VERY similar list lately but my micro ace (micro?) was Omega Leader

 

Soontir you know what build (35)

 

Omega Leader +Comm +Juke +Hull/Stealth

 

3xAcademy Pilot

 

exacly the same tactic as you did.

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Although I love Soontir (and I do... Obviously) do you not think Vader is more appropriate with a swarm - he out PSs standard aces and carries a bit more body. His damage output is comparable if not better than Fel when target locked and gets boost barrel roll antics also

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Although I love Soontir (and I do... Obviously) do you not think Vader is more appropriate with a swarm - he out PSs standard aces and carries a bit more body. His damage output is comparable if not better than Fel when target locked and gets boost barrel roll antics also

 In my head asking vader or soontir was like asking do you like red wine or white wine?  Individual prefferences IMO.

 

Vader got 2 actions without stress, while Fel by stressing himself get 3 , including Eye+Eye.

Similar mobility with both actions and dials, but 'ceptor got more greens (stress meta after all...)

Similar firepower.

Vader often needs to spend one of his actions on target lock.

Vader got more body while Soontir got autos.

Vader got higher PS while Soontir got better action economy.

 

Got my point? No clear winner here, for me those 2 aces are almost the same, if I would know who i play against i would adjust of course but in overall they too similar to choose a victor.

Edited by Vitalis

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Although I love Soontir (and I do... Obviously) do you not think Vader is more appropriate with a swarm - he out PSs standard aces and carries a bit more body. His damage output is comparable if not better than Fel when target locked and gets boost barrel roll antics also

As mentioned, it is kind of a matter of personal taste.  However, in my experience, I agree with your reasoning: Vader is better than Soontir alongside a mini-swarm.  The reason, imho, is that Vader is a bit more tanky with those 2 extra shields, so he can fly in beside the swarm and you can start dishing out damage, taking advantage of the howlrunner re-roll, possibly, and if Vader gets blocked up or stuck, he has the health to usually survive (although perhaps crippled).  Fel on the other hand, if he sticks close to the swarm, you will limit his escape routes (because of the number of ships on the board) so if he gets blocked up, he's dead. 

 

Of course, you could fly both in a flanking roll to avoid the issue, but still, generally speaking, I find Fel is too constrained to contribute effectively while there are lots of ships on the board (Vader is a bit better off mainly because of the 'better' dial----in this case, only better because Fel uses push the limit all the time and therefore has only 7 moves to pick from, not to mention Vader has 1 bank, which I find incredibly useful, but YMMV).  Once the numbers get thinned down, Fel becomes increasingly more powerful as he can roam where he pleases more easily without fear of getting blocked.  For that reason, I prefer to run him with a small number of ships.

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How about if the mini swarm became 4 Zeta pilots (the ps3 or 4 I forget, Tie fo)?

I've considered it.  Give it a whirl and see how it works out for you.

 

Personally, I wouldn't because I like Fel in squads of 3 or 4 ships max.  But, I know Fel + obsidian mini-swarm (5 TIEs + Fel) has won regionals and similar lists have done well, so it all depends on how it suits your playstyle.

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How about if the mini swarm became 4 Zeta pilots (the ps3 or 4 I forget, Tie fo)?

I've considered it.  Give it a whirl and see how it works out for you.

 

Personally, I wouldn't because I like Fel in squads of 3 or 4 ships max.  But, I know Fel + obsidian mini-swarm (5 TIEs + Fel) has won regionals and similar lists have done well, so it all depends on how it suits your playstyle.

This is talking about mini swarm with Vader

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How about if the mini swarm became 4 Zeta pilots (the ps3 or 4 I forget, Tie fo)?

I've considered it.  Give it a whirl and see how it works out for you.

 

Personally, I wouldn't because I like Fel in squads of 3 or 4 ships max.  But, I know Fel + obsidian mini-swarm (5 TIEs + Fel) has won regionals and similar lists have done well, so it all depends on how it suits your playstyle.

 

 

I prefer to run 5 regular ties.

Vader

chaser

wampa

3x academy

Edited by CaptainAl

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Here's my Vader list:

Vader and Friends (98)

Darth Vader (33) - TIE Advanced

Predator (3), TIE/x1 (0), Advanced Targeting Computer (5)

Mauler Mithel (17) - TIE Fighter

Dark Curse (16) - TIE Fighter

"Youngster" (18) - TIE Fighter

Marksmanship (3)

"Wampa" (14) - TIE Fighter

I'm still playing around with it, but it's a fun list to play. They just group up and focus fire. It's a lot easier than running my 7 ship TIE swarm.

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Similar mobility with both actions and dials, but 'ceptor got more greens (stress meta after all...)

Similar firepower.

It is true that they both have Boost and Barrel Roll but they do not move the same. The (non-Juno) TIE Adv.s cannot turn very well. Hard-2's and a boost at best, which Squints and Phantoms can dance around.

 

Soontir and Vader also do not have similar firepower in that Vader's is much more reliable with ATC and becomes downright fierce, if you give him Predator, whereas Soontir is "left" with a Focus token for his 3-4 dice.

 

 

In the end, it is a meta call (lots of TLTs/nasty PWT? Baron Fel excels, anything else? Vader) and playstyle based.

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It's been mentioned, but I second the notion of PS11 Vader (35pts) alongside a Howlrunner mini-swarm with either 3x Blackshot, or 2x Blackshot and Wampa.

 

Don't fly Vader with the Swarm, flank with him. If the swarm and Vader come in from different angles, your opponent has to choose the important threat and turn their back on the other. Vader can alter his action options to make sure they're wrong either way.

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I've had good luck with:

 

Vader, VI, title, ATC 

 

Howl runner, swarm tactics

Academy Pilot x4

99

 

I second the 6 ships suggestion, the blocking is unreal. You could always drop swarm tactics and put something fancier on vader, or swap him for soontir. I personally think swarm tactics is really useful, as I often find myself in a situation where one TIE is bumped and the TIE behind it has a good range one shot. Or giving damaged TIEs an opportunity to shoot before they die.

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I've had good luck with:

 

Vader, VI, title, ATC 

 

Howl runner, swarm tactics

Academy Pilot x4

99

 

I second the 6 ships suggestion, the blocking is unreal. You could always drop swarm tactics and put something fancier on vader, or swap him for soontir. I personally think swarm tactics is really useful, as I often find myself in a situation where one TIE is bumped and the TIE behind it has a good range one shot. Or giving damaged TIEs an opportunity to shoot before they die.

I do this this sometimes. I also swap Vader for Whisper of course you have to drop an Academy though. I took 3rd at a tourney with this list. Got out of top two because I made a foolish mistake with Whisper. It was a long day.

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