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Elrath'

E-Web Engineers in open groups

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So, E-Web Engineers, those amazing fairly immobile damage dealers. Do you usually include them in your open groups as the Imperial player? How do do you generally use them?

 

I had the regular E-Web Engineer in my open groups in a few missions when playing the Military Might deck. The ability to throw it to the field with 5 threat felt like a nice deal. The E-Web's three dice attack and the ability to fire twice also forces the rebels to take it into account and either "waste" actions killing it or just try to avoid it. That can be helpful in delaying the rebels.

 

The weakness of the unit is its mobility. The good side is its amazing firepower. It can do some serious damage to a hero who stays on its line of sight. Given its strengths and weaknesses, how would you generally position it? Near the mission objective so the rebels have to get close to it? Or "middle" of the map (if there are spawn points there) to fire at the rebels when they move past.

 

Also, when looked from the other side. As Rebels, how big a threat do you see those E-Webs? I view them as fairly big threat and don't want to stay in one's line of fire. It's one of my priority targets as well. But should it be? It's fairly immobile so it can be possible to just outrun it and stay out of its range. And at least in early campaign, killing an E-Web in one activation is not reliable and there's a big risk staying close to it and taking some serious damage.

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Not a lot of maps big enough that your questions really make sense.  Most maps you can't run from anything and generally speaking there is a spawn in LOS to rebel scum you can just plunk the engineer down and start blasting with it.

 

Never use them.  With an incredibly feeble 5 wounds, they just go pop.  Spend the extra 1 point for Trandoshans and you're putting 12 wounds on the table that also put out good damage while being mobile.  The only thing the engineer is good for is range.

 

Also with Military Might the attachment cards like Veteran and Assault Armor give much bigger benefits to cards with multiple figures in them so even if you like engineers for some reason, they're a really bad choice.

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Yeah, I feel much the same way as you Union. Though maps have some places where you can get out of LOS. That's what I meant by running. They're not very mobile. And E-Webs seem like a bigger threat in early campaign for rebels than they do later on. You're right, Trandoshans are superior especially when used with Subversive Tactics as their strain giving ability often translates to free damage. Also with 8 threat, you can get Royal Guards which are great as well.

 

I do get a feeling that E-Webs are more flash than actual results. You hope that the rebels see them as bigger threat than they are. But as you say, the Trandoshans do a better job at that. And they're a real threat. I guess I'm just fishing for way to see E-Webs as useful.

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I have seen them work wonders. In certain missions there may be deployment points next to or very near to objectives. Plopping a new eweb down right near the objective when the heroes are headed that way or wounded is a huge threat, IMO. It forces them to attack head on, rest, or seek cover. They literally cannot afford to ignore the eweb. It can easily wound a hero in one activation, and its huge accuracy makes it a threat from a distance. There ARE better alternatives in most situations, but I get scared when they are used. They become my top priority.

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Putting the Eweb down in Aftermath to a new group of players is one of my favorite moments in the game. The first time they face a unit thatcan and will wound a hero in a single activation instills some good fear. 

 

The max damage on the engineer is 14 while a regular squad of troopers is 12, so they're not that different.  Against 1 defense die, stormtroopers will average around 6 damage per turn with their rerolls and can move, the engineer 7 with no move.

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I bring them the odd time if I see a really good spot I will be able to put them down as the Rebels come towards it.  A New Threat bottom left corner you can really trap a hero down there for multiple activations if you time it right, I had a 4sp hero trapped between my Nexu in the hallway and the E-Web just getting pummeled right into withdraw.  But not like you need any help on that tilted map.

 

Fly Solo as well once they get Han out and are coming back towards IG-88 the e-web can really do some damage if they come up the left side, and if they go around the right it wastes more time and you can take that time to move him into position to still gaurentee two attacks.

 

But overall as many have said, the Trando's are just much better value for not much more, or less in the case of the elite e-web.  But if you like to play for the thematic effect then e-web's are a great choice, or if you just want to switch it up and keep things fresh.  Just look for those spots where you know they will do damage, there are always a few each campaign where you can be like Yup, thats it.

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They usually fail me since alot of time I have to waste their activation while the heroes just hide. Then they just swarm in and take it out since Rebs get to go first every round.

 

At most they wound a single hero.... most of the time though it seems better to take other units with more hp to just slow down the rebels instead of wounding them.

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I used them a lot in my last campaign, playing inspiring leadership. set him up next to an elite officer with field general attachment.  the e-web could fire four times. it kept the heroes back from completing objectives, as they were scared to get wounded 

Edited by Spidey NZ

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I used them a lot in my last campaign, playing inspiring leadership. set him up next to an elite officer with field general attachment.  the e-web could fire four times. it keep the heroes back from completing objectives, as they were scared to get wounded

I was going to say something similar. Had a friend with inspiring leadership early in the campaign double move order one then move it into position to having it waiting for us. Had the eweb sprinting for 8 movement points that round!

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The regular E-Web isn't terrible, but there are better things to get with the Threat. The Elite E-Web though, is a terror.

 

For 2 more threat, you get 2 more points of health but with a +1 block.  I have found that winds up being a huge factor. It also has an additional point of movement. So you can set it down next to a regular officer, get to move it three spaces instead of two, and then take advantage of Recover 2 twice a round. (Or, if there's an Executive Order about, 3 times a round.  Or more, depending on if you have an Elite Imperial Officer with Field General attached.)

 

However, unless you have Endless, Royal Guards are probably still your better Threat 8 expense.  I bring the Elite E-Web for when they are already on the board though.

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For 2 more threat, you get 2 more points of health but with a +1 block.  I have found that winds up being a huge factor.

 

+1 block is FAR FAR more effective than people probably estimate.  Against a blue + green with 1 black it takes the average damage from 2 to 1... Yeah, halving it.  Compared to the regular's 5 wounds it's almost as if the elite had 14.  Add on the recovery 2 on top of that and it is an entirely different unit.  Obviously not quite so effective against the later game's bigger guns, but still very powerful.  This is why the Military Might deck is so powerful, you can give block to 2 point storm troopers AND +2 wounds AND +1 damage, each of which are much bigger benefits than people probably suspect.

 

I think the one thing that can potentially make the engineers shine is that they're troopers, so they can benefit from a lot of special cards like the Sustained Fire agenda and can be healed by snow troopers (which is cheesy as anything, but if the mission is "wound everyone" and the rebels are sitting someone back and double recovering every turn, I don't feel so bad.)

Edited by Union

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Putting the Eweb down in Aftermath to a new group of players is one of my favorite moments in the game. The first time they face a unit thatcan and will wound a hero in a single activation instills some good fear. 

 

The max damage on the engineer is 14 while a regular squad of troopers is 12, so they're not that different.  Against 1 defense die, stormtroopers will average around 6 damage per turn with their rerolls and can move, the engineer 7 with no move.

 

E-Webs may lack movement speed, but you also need to consider range. Range can be very important not just for safety of your figures, but also for ensuring the rebels move (thus putting them into a position they may not want to be in).

 

Assuming a black die on defense and no surges, and no other factors such as upgrades, mission bonuses, focus, rerolls,  etc... Stormtroopers only hit 100% of the time at Range 3 or less. (83.3% at Range 4, 55.5% at Range 5, and falling to an abysmal 36.1% at Range 6, and an almost impossible 8.3% at Range 7). Fun fact: A Stormtrooper's absolute maximum range is 9 spaces, with a 2.25% chance to hit. 

Another thing to consider is that the stormtrooper has a 66% chance to roll a single surge (56% vs a single black die, and 33% vs a white die), and 16.7% chance at rolling two surges (without a reroll), and while these could be used to increase effective range with +2 ACC, the fact that you would be gambling that shot to begin with does not bode well for overall strategy, much less doing any appreciable damage to a hero.

 

Whereas in the same scenario, an E-web will hit 100% of the time at Range 5 or less, and the range drop off isn't as severe until range 8 (88.8% at Range 6, 78% at Range 7, but 38.8% at Range 8). The E-Web does not have a surge for accuracy ability, so you don't have to worry about evades making the shot miss.

That said, I like using E-Webs with Probe Droids and the Technological Superiority class deck. Technical Support is a cheap 1XP upgrade that allows all your droids to heal, clear conditions, or grant focus to an adjacent friendly figure. Makes the rebels wonder what they should target, the E-Web, or all the support droids!

 

Edited by Fizz

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> E-Webs may lack movement speed, but you also need to consider range.

 

I've never had any consideration for range as the Imperial player.  There is almost never a situation where the Rebels have the luxury to draw something out into a long range gun fight.  The maps themselves are rather cramped, even Hoth isn't all that big, and Imperial deployment points are always close to objectives or where the rebels are.

 

I have made good use of engineers before, but usually it's an elite.  Last game was the virus upload side mission and I hid a guard in behind the eEngineer giving him +2 defense.  I also had the fire at will agenda effectively allowing 3 shots in a row, which, with the help of the guards was enough to take an armored Biv from unhurt to wounded, then cause him to withdraw next round.

 

> Stormtroopers only hit 100% of the time at Range 3 or less.

 

Stormtroopers can move 4 spaces before firing, their effective minimum range is 7 which is half the length of most maps.  In two campaigns that I've been Imp, I've had a stormtrooper not get accuracy exactly once and that was because I took a gamble on killing an echo base trooper who was at range 5 or 6 rather than damaging Biv who was at 2.  And that wasn't even a stormtrooper it was a snowtrooper so didn't have a reroll.

Edited by Union

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Last night, I took an eweb into Dark Obsession. Naturally, Vader was a beast. But the eweb and an elite officer ended up being crucial to winning the main for Imperials. Eweb and Elite officer popped up at the blue spawn, just as MHD-19 got the final pair of doors up in front of Vader. With Vader on the opposite side of the hallway and only two turns remaining, the officer ordered the eweb to turn his back to the enemy, then to burn down the doorway. The engineer them burned down the further door on his own activation. This allowed Vader to rush down the hallway unimpeded.

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