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Kaimuund

Yuuzhan Vong Ships, Read Before Hating

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I had no idea this was a thing until I read this thread.  After a cursory glance, I don't appreciate the 40k/Star Wars crossover.  Not even for a second.

 

But I do enjoy people making up their own games and such.  We wouldn't have any games at all if not for the creativity of people like the OP.  He may have chosen a a controversial topic to talk about but that looks like a pile of work he's done there, so...

 

Keep it up!  Even if people hate it, people hate everything, don't mine 'em too much.

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I honestly love the idea of the project action. Makes for interesting choices between boost and barrel roll and gives boost without auto thruster possibility. Also, attacks during the activation phase, while probably being a rules nightmare, would be cool to set a faction apart.

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Given the direction that Disney is taking, the Vong ain't gonna happen.

 

They inspire about the same level of hate as the Disneyverse. 

 

 

 

 

No they don't.

They might, for you, but not for the general public.

Edited by OddballE8

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Given the direction that Disney is taking, the Vong ain't gonna happen.

 

They inspire about the same level of hate as the Disneyverse. 

 

 

 

 

No they don't.

They might, for you, but not for the general public.

 

 

The general public is unaware of the existence of the EU in general, so yeah, that's true. Amongst the various One True Star Wars tribes (OT only, OT/PT only, Non-Disneyverse only, Disneyverse only, etc...), yeah, the Vong are just as much of a base breaker as Rebels.

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Given the direction that Disney is taking, the Vong ain't gonna happen.

 

They inspire about the same level of hate as the Disneyverse. 

 

 

 

 

No they don't.

They might, for you, but not for the general public.

 

 

The general public is unaware of the existence of the EU in general, so yeah, that's true. Amongst the various One True Star Wars tribes (OT only, OT/PT only, Non-Disneyverse only, Disneyverse only, etc...), yeah, the Vong are just as much of a base breaker as Rebels.

 

I disagree.

I understand that you don't like what Disney has done, but don't speak for the fans in general.

I know plenty of people who are well aware of the EU, but like the new Disney stuff. (but none of them liked the Vong)

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Updated. 

 

Added Crew, Secondary Weapons (just 2, they don't really need more than that as the generics would work), and Pilots

 

Adjusted the dials, actions and point costs based on feedback. 

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Given the direction that Disney is taking, the Vong ain't gonna happen.

 

They inspire about the same level of hate as the Disneyverse.

 

No they don't.

They might, for you, but not for the general public.

 

The general public is unaware of the existence of the EU in general, so yeah, that's true. Amongst the various One True Star Wars tribes (OT only, OT/PT only, Non-Disneyverse only, Disneyverse only, etc...), yeah, the Vong are just as much of a base breaker as Rebels.

I disagree.

I understand that you don't like what Disney has done, but don't speak for the fans in general.

I know plenty of people who are well aware of the EU, but like the new Disney stuff. (but none of them liked the Vong)

Which is also an opinion, as most of the people I know prefer the EU and either dislike disneyverse or are indifferent.

As there are no official numbers, you are only forced to speculate. However, what you can't argue are the reviews to Aftermath and the Marvel comics from Disney, and they're consistently medicore to subpar.

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Given the direction that Disney is taking, the Vong ain't gonna happen.

 

They inspire about the same level of hate as the Disneyverse.

 

No they don't.

They might, for you, but not for the general public.

 

The general public is unaware of the existence of the EU in general, so yeah, that's true. Amongst the various One True Star Wars tribes (OT only, OT/PT only, Non-Disneyverse only, Disneyverse only, etc...), yeah, the Vong are just as much of a base breaker as Rebels.

I disagree.

I understand that you don't like what Disney has done, but don't speak for the fans in general.

I know plenty of people who are well aware of the EU, but like the new Disney stuff. (but none of them liked the Vong)

Which is also an opinion, as most of the people I know prefer the EU and either dislike disneyverse or are indifferent.

As there are no official numbers, you are only forced to speculate. However, what you can't argue are the reviews to Aftermath and the Marvel comics from Disney, and they're consistently medicore to subpar.

 

 

Sure, but then most reviews of EU material I've seen have been mediocre. I know, I know, there were some great gems in the EU material. But let's be fair, most of it was mediocre at best (and some of it was truly horrible).

However, I wasn't the one stating that everybody love the Disney stuff.

He was the one stating that they inspired the same level of hatred as the Vong.

Edited by OddballE8

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Probably something to do with the authors in EU going Jedi crazy and really getting carried away with Force powers. My big issue with the EU is that every author seems to have a need to make a mark, so there is this escalating 'one upping' as authors try out do one another on plot solutions or Force powers, and it starts to get ridiculous. 

 

I've read that Wolverine in the Marvel comics got his head punched off by the hulk and sent to the moon, where it grew a second Wolverine who came back to Earth to meet up with his body, which had regrown its head. Then the two Wolverines fought the Hulk. That kind of crap as comic book and novel writers get carried away and we end up with over the top Mary Sues, with Luke created black holes and Deus Ex Machina with the Force, and all kinds of things that should never have been allowed into the universe. 

 

Almost as bad as Midichlorians. Almost. 

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As there are no official numbers, you are only forced to speculate. However, what you can't argue are the reviews to Aftermath and the Marvel comics from Disney, and they're consistently medicore to subpar.

 

You name one book out of more than a dozen new canon books as a basis for your argument?

To be fair you are right about Aftermath, it was a total let down but you also conveniently left out books like Lost Stars, Lords of the Sith, Tarkin and Battlefront: Twilight Company, all of which have gotten rave reviews and we've only just gotten started with the new canon stuff. How many crappy EU books did we get over the past 2-3 decades? I think you know the answer to that one.

Same goes for the comics. We've gotten some really good ones from Marvel comics (Shattered Empire, Vader Down, Kanan) and some not so good ones (Chewbacca, Leia). Dark Horse put out alot of really good stuff when they had the license and only time will tell if Marvel can do the same but so far I think they're on the right track.

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Coming back around to see how the progress has come, and I'm pleased that it's still coming  :)

As you're aware by now though, "everybody's a critic" and I have to throw out my two cents that I'm dissapointed to see the unique Biot upgrades and Project actions dissapeared. As a mere consumer of your work I wanted those, but logistically I can understand not adding more work than necessary for you, the inventor. Keep it up!

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Thank you for the feedback! I agree that the loss of the Project action is sad, as it had some viable faction flavor, but here are my thoughts:

 

I playtested the Project action, and looked into the resources available, and it didn't play quite right. It also gave a lot of maneuverability to everything, as well as bumping up the point costs. A large ship that starts around 50 points is very hard to fit into a list. I've changed it to the boost action, and made all of the fast maneuvers red instead. I'm working on some other ideas for specific flavor for the group, but think the project action might have been too much. All of the ships have access to Cannons, one way or another, and I suspect a Coralskipper with a Tractor Beam to be an easy pickup for 18 points. 

 

On the Biot and Dovin Basal, I thought it might be excessive to add two unique upgrade types. As Biot is pulled from a source that shortened "Biotech", I chose to use the Tech upgrade to represent both. This let me put the two lists together, and not have different ships with different unique upgrades, as well as dip into the existing pool. All of the generic non faction upgrades are still available for the Vong (like Comm Relay), the Vong just use a Biotech analog. 

 

This made the builds much cleaner, and made them look less 'fan custom' that would be hard to fit into a casual game. It also let me balance them to the advanced ships currently in the game, namely the TIE FO and the T-70 X Wing. 

 

As to the idea of the Mary Sue in the room, ie. the Yuuzhan Vongs ability to ignore enemy fire and turn off their enemy's shields, the timeline assumes that the counters to these have already been found. For games before this has occurred, I have some scenarios for a campaign, but those kind of mechanics seem better left for special scenarios rather than ship abilities as balancing them would be very difficult. 

 

After I make the upgrade cards, I'll post some sample lists that work fairly well and are themed for any interested. 

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Everyone I'd ever met that actually read the EU loved the Vong until I came onto these forums. I still love the Vong. Yea there were quite a few bad books, but there were some good ones too.

I'd much rather read about a new alien threat that kills off main characters, and defies the Force, then some Imperial Admiral who can do everything, and is always right.

That said, I don't think they really fit into X-wing, though you seem to be doing a good job, keep up the good work!

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I can see what you mean by too expensive, however they are the same price point as X wing T 70's, TIE FO's and Decimators. The Orbalisk is on par with a Starviper, only trading down the agility for a crew slot, and one more shield (Torpedo for Tech). I don't think they're low cost ships, but I think they are priced about right and each fill a role in the standard roster with the ability to customize to fit other roles. 

 

I left a lot of book interpretation out, such as the Dovin Basal shield interactions, in lew of better balance. I think they're pretty good. I also took note from FFG's often book and text adherence, in line with E wings, TIE Defenders, many pilots, and some of the EU ships (StarViper, IG-88/IG-2000, Boba Fett and Firespray). 

 

Could you give me some more specifics?

 

Some lists could be:

 

3 Coralskippers with basic cannons and autothrusters + Orbalisk Ace with debuff crew (tactician)

15 + Fletchette Cannon (4) + authrusters

15 + Plasma Cannon (5) + autothrusters

15 

30 Nom Anor - HLC + Tactician + Title (1) [40] + Lone Wolf

 

 

5 Coralskippers with 1 being an ace (FO swarm) 

15 + 3 Ion Pulse Missiles

15 + 2 Autothruster

15 + 2 Autothruster

15  

23 + 5 Plasma Cannon (2 for title, 3 for cannon) + 3 Predator (31) + 2 Autothrusters

 

 

1 Stoneclaw with Regen Orbalisk (fat han and regen x wing/e wing) Fly like a pancake in circles, let the Orbalisk tail and then shoot forward to strike. Can do a double regen Orbalisk if you want to make sure to hold the end game, using the 31 point Orbalisk (when you deal a dmg card, regen 1 shield), and the 4 point regen Tech Biot (move speed 1, regen 1 shield), and then take a healing crew (3 points, discard to remove 2 face down damage cards). Fatten up the Stoneclaw, and just use the PWT. Take the title to get evade tokens, and add the Reinforce action with a Tech Biot, to Reinforce/Evade each round. Only issue is naked red dice. 

 

1 Stone claw PS 4 w Reinforce tech and Yammosk crew and HLC  (60) and 2 Coralskippers with munitions (plasma torps) and autothrusters (alpha strike and fat turret) (40) Fly the Stoneclaw around the asteroids to give it +1 agility and reinforce, then use the PWT and HLC to chew stuff up. Let the Coralskippers engage the biggest thing they have and loose the 2 Plasma torps to drop shields and coup de grace with the Stoneclaw. Any stress or ion tokens can be moved around to keep the coralskippers alive, or a coralskipper can take evade and have it moved to the Stoneclaw (using the Yammosk) Yammosk - 2 crew - 6 points - once per round, you may assign any one token to any other friendly ship. (can have stress or ion assigned to other ships, or have one ship take an action and assign the token to a different ship).

 

1 Orbalisk w cannon/tactician (31), 2 Coralskippers with munitions (plasma torps --) 36 , Orbalisk Ace w Tech and FCS (33) 

 

 

They all have boost, but do not have access to turret upgrades, so they will fly similar to Imperials, however they are a little more forgiving with a tad more health on their bigger ships (orbalisk and Stoneclaw) but a little less Agility (well 1 more on Stoneclaw). 

 

Once I have the crew and named the upgrades, I'll make some lists and show you. They have a unique play style in my tests so far, as they can't get out of the scrum easily. They need to stick together and then knife fight, and try to get the advantage. They struggle against Imperial aces unless they have a well tuned Stoneclaw (unless Soontir..), but do very well against Scum, and do pretty well against Rebels depending on match up. 

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Kudos to the OP for having the guts to bring something fresh and new for the game. Even if it is the Vong. Now, bioships are not a bad idea but the way in which the Vong were handled and written was just wrong.

 

Probably something to do with the authors in EU going Jedi crazy and really getting carried away with Force powers. My big issue with the EU is that every author seems to have a need to make a mark, so there is this escalating 'one upping' as authors try out do one another on plot solutions or Force powers, and it starts to get ridiculous. 

 

I've read that Wolverine in the Marvel comics got his head punched off by the hulk and sent to the moon, where it grew a second Wolverine who came back to Earth to meet up with his body, which had regrown its head. Then the two Wolverines fought the Hulk. That kind of crap as comic book and novel writers get carried away and we end up with over the top Mary Sues, with Luke created black holes and Deus Ex Machina with the Force, and all kinds of things that should never have been allowed into the universe. 

 

Almost as bad as Midichlorians. Almost. 

 

The Force Planet says hello.

 

Heck, you get this even within the main movies. Spinning Palpatines of doom.

Edited by Lampyridae

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Found this old post when looking for suggested Vong stats for X-wing so I could use the shapeways miniatures to recreate a space battle prior to a WOTC miniatures Vong ground battle.

 

Obviously we won't see this in the game but it's great for thematic casual battles. Great stuff here! I had considered creating a generalized Bio-tech slot and letting the Vong be the only ones with access to it and have things like:

Coralskipper 

Skill 2-7 (I like your pilots despite not knowing what book or kaboom is)

Atk 3

Agi 2

Hull 4

Shields 0

EPT and Bio-tech upgrades

 

Modification

Dovin Basal 

Yuuzhan Vong Only. Limited

At the start of the combat phase, either assign a reinforce token to your ship, perform a free boost action or remove one shield from an enemy ship at range 1.

5 Points

 

Cargo, two slots

Yammosk

Yuuzhan Vong Only.

Increase the pilot skill of all Yuuzhan Vong ships by 2.

Action: Once per round a friendly ship may perform a free action. 

Cost 10

 

I think your crew are fantastic though and very fitting. I would have liked to see a Nom Anor crew with a similar to Theek and/or Captured TIE approach where you either copy an ability or cannot be attacked until you attack

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I'm all happy for seeing the Vong ships in the game. I don't think they'd be suited as part of Scum but as their own individual minor faction, however whether there'd be enough ships to cover it depends. Ultimately it'd be up to FFG to decide on how they'd treat the Vong in the game, but their appearance would surely be a great surprise regardless.

Edited by Vector

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Just the name "Vong" seems so un-STARWARS'ey, makes me think of a Chinese Kung-Fu B-movie; expecting to hear things like: "Chop Chop Mistar, me gonna make U bleed sooo haaaard" and then a lot of really bad Kung Fu stunts follows.... perhaps in a kitchen among chefs cooking alot of nudles... so no, not the Vong please. 

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