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Indalecio

The Chains that Rust

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It could be done technically, but with the limitation that you cannot port the Act III elements to other campaigns, which is a huge limitation. But yeah, you would need to add 1/3 of the whole game released so far including expansions to support a new Act, so that's extremely unlikely, especially if you were considering this for a mini-expansion.

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Right, so I'm thinking Chains will really be hero based. Maybe we won't get as many monster groups, or really anything for the OL side but will get a whole bunch of heroes and classes. Then You get the second part of the whole Campaign with it. Maybe some more new shop cards. It's purely speculation of course. 

 

The "problem" that I can see on this, is the fixed monster groups on the quests. If there are no new monsters, they are then "forced" to pick only base game ones (open groups aside). I usually like that the expansion quests are "thematically linked" with the new monsters.

 

 

That's an extremely good point and one of the reasons, why splitting up a big box expansion into two small box expansions may be not a good idea.

 

However since MoB came only with 3 monstergroups, maybe there will be one monstergroup in Chains that rust (as there are usually 4 monstergroups in one big box) or new lieutenants may play a bigger role (maybe they can summon monsters that come as tokens, but you can use the MoB minis if you have them), or they release another 2 miniature large small monster group smiliar to the dark elves, that did offset the high mini-count for the kobolds in the H&M pack.

 

Also 2 small box expansions are more expensive than one big box, so I hope we at least get the same amount of content (4 monsters, 4 heroes, 4 classes), I know getting more content (5 monsters, 5 heroes, 5 classes) would make the higher price a non-issue, but seems extremely unlikely. If they really plan to release less (3 monsters, 2-3 heroes, 2-3 classes), getting these expansions would be a very low priority for me.

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After my first play of MoB today, I have to say that I really appreciate this new direction. It feels like they spent more time with the campaign in this expansion and focused on a more immersive story experience. The monsters are threatening to say the least and the taint cards add a new level of urgency and real consequence to each choice for the heroes. If this is the result that the split expansions yield then I am very happy with the new direction. There seems to be a lot of fear that straying from the mold is a scheme to grab more of our money or to put less in each box, but it seems to me that the opposite is true. What is notable here is the difference from the previous formula. This expansions seems to really achieve some dramatic changes to how the game has been played and I couldn't be more excited by that.

However, I don't see how the CTR can function as a standalone very effectively and continue the thematic experience. If it does not require MoB to play then it will have to add more monsters as well and not be as hero focused as I hope it will be.

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Not having to develop and playtest the hero stuff probably let them deliver a better campaign experience.

I think they'll be going for mini campaigns... choose any act 1 campaign followed by any act 2 campaign. With MOB + CTR Being the first combination.

FFG could do a lot with that formula.

They could give rules for bringing in a hero/overlord at the start of act 2 so the number of players could change or the players have the option of swapping hero's or changing who plays the overlord.

The overlords may be able to switch lieutenants between mini-campaigns, so FFG can sell twice as many and the overlords wouldn't have to run 20 campaigns to use all the lieutenant figures.

FFG could take the opportunity to fix rumours and squeeze them in between mini-campaigns.

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Knowing FFG, i'm sure that "The chains that rust" is going to be a solo campaign, with new monsters and lieutenant and would be able to being playable alone as a full act 2 campaign.

 

So, no need to wait for it

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FFG told us that MoB is an Overlord expansion, so the content is focused on strenghtening the overlord. So they gave us 3 new monsters, tainted cards, a new condition, a quiete new tricky terrain, travel cards.

Now what we can guess is that CtR will be an heroes expansion, and the only way to balance MoB would be to give us at least 4 new classes, and why not a new game effect as a counterweight  to the tainted cards. But still it looks quite hollow, i can't stop hoping for something really new.

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Could you explain what you mean by 'hollow'? The tainted effect alone is huge. It answers years of community feedback about second edition from people who thought the perpetual KO,stand up from heroes felt cheap. I may not have been among that group, but it's clear that the Bilehall campaign is unique- something quite new. As for 'Chains', who knows?

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Could you explain what you mean by 'hollow'? The tainted effect alone is huge. It answers years of community feedback about second edition from people who thought the perpetual KO,stand up from heroes felt cheap. I may not have been among that group, but it's clear that the Bilehall campaign is unique- something quite new. As for 'Chains', who knows?I

True the tainted cards are cool, it brings a lot of tension in the game for the heroes, cause for now it is more like that :  aaah i am knock out ..so what ? Alas only 6 cards...

 

for the "hollow" thing, it was a comment on my guess at what would be in the CtR expansion. 4 classes is not worth what... 30 bucks ?! So they must be up to something...

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After my first play of MoB today, I have to say that I really appreciate this new direction. It feels like they spent more time with the campaign in this expansion and focused on a more immersive story experience. The monsters are threatening to say the least and the taint cards add a new level of urgency and real consequence to each choice for the heroes. If this is the result that the split expansions yield then I am very happy with the new direction. There seems to be a lot of fear that straying from the mold is a scheme to grab more of our money or to put less in each box, but it seems to me that the opposite is true. What is notable here is the difference from the previous formula. This expansions seems to really achieve some dramatic changes to how the game has been played and I couldn't be more excited by that.

However, I don't see how the CTR can function as a standalone very effectively and continue the thematic experience. If it does not require MoB to play then it will have to add more monsters as well and not be as hero focused as I hope it will be.

 

That sounds really great. I'm glad this box comes with a new gamestyle for Descent that appearently works well and brings a new spin to the game. How close was your game? Did both parties have a realistic chance to win the scenario for the most part of the game? My only fear is that heroes would give up really easily after 2 heroes died, which can be pretty fast after a few unlucky dice-rolls.

 

I think as long as the content is really good, they can split it up this way. However I think this would get pretty low on my list, if both expansions together come with less content than 4 monstergroups and 4 heroes and classes. 4 monstergroups and 3 heroes/classes or 3 monstergroups and 4 heroes/classes is still pretty ok, anything less will make me get other stuff (namely the campaign book and H&M packs) first and makes it really hard to justify these expansions.

Edited by DAMaz

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How close was your game? Did both parties have a realistic chance to win the scenario for the most part of the game? My only fear is that heroes would give up really easily after 2 heroes died, which can be pretty fast after a few unlucky dice-rolls.

 

I think as long as the content is really good, they can split it up this way. However I think this would get pretty low on my list, if both expansions together come with less content than 4 monstergroups and 4 heroes and classes. 4 monstergroups and 3 heroes/classes or 3 monstergroups and 4 heroes/classes is still pretty ok, anything less will make me get other stuff (namely the campaign book and H&M packs) first and makes it really hard to justify these expansions.

I should preface this response with the fact that my gaming group has, unfortunately, fallen apart recently and that I play almost exclusively with the RedJak Automated Overlord deck these days. If you have yet to find that, it's a fan created deck that runs the overlord and monsters and in my opinion it's quite effective and entertaining. However, I don't lose to the deck very often. I think this is mostly due to the fact that I am an experienced player on both sides of the board because 2nd edition quickly became my favorite game and I play it a lot, now unfortunately mostly solo or with one other player.

That being said, MoB is clearly built for more experienced hero players. You start your introduction mission already having 1xp to spend, so the idea is to play with heroes that already know what direction they're planning to go and to build the strongest party possible. The game was close and felt well balanced for experienced players (me and a friend that has played almost as much as I have). Even with the automated overlord deck, there was a very real chance that the overlord was going to win several times, but heroic feats won the day, as it should be.

The undead monsters are a very nice change to the norm, with the hordes of reanimates boosting each other's abilities to the point that, if they're in a tight group, you really have to kill the target of your attack in one swing or they get all their health back and you might as well have missed. If one of the heroes ends his/her turn next to the master broodwalker everything goes into crisis mode and you have to figure out, as a team, how to get that player out of there before they start their turn in sludge and have to burn all of their fatigue trying to get away. The high health and low defense make for monsters you have to hit hard and fast to take them down. The overlord was running the First Legion plot deck from the Ardus Ix'Erebus lieutenant deck and that really makes these large groups of small monsters intimidating. At one point, we had succeeded in killing both of the master reanimates and then all 4 of the minions suddenly gained the attributes of the masters. That was a satisfyingly rough turn.

Beyond that, the story is provocative and immersive on top of some really well crafted missions. I would say that the only other campaigns that build a satisfying story are SoN and the campaign book, the campaign book being a greater success than Shadows. So far, I think I prefer this even to the campaign book. Still, I would say that this is an expansion that will benefit you most and be the most satisfying to your group if you own and have explored a lot, if not most (I have all of it), of the other expansion material and have found what works best for you as a group. I highly recommend the campaign book. Before that release, I felt that the campaigns delivered fun game play experience but failed to connect objective with motive. I knew what I needed to do in each quest, but the stories did not compound to build a greater arc for me. The reason I kept playing was to build my hero, not to find out what came next in the story. I found that dissapointing because it's not as though the stories of the campaigns are static each play through, different mission selections and rumor cards can make them quite dynamic, actually. I really want to find out what comes next in MoB.

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I got MoB yesterday. I have read through the campaign and it looks great.

I am really looking forward to playing it. Also the undead monsters look really useful for other quests outside of MoB.

I would love to have the tainted card mechanic outside of the MoB campaign.

I hope the Chains that Rust provides more tainted cards.

This will definitely need a more experienced player group looking for a challenge.

Overall this seems to be a good direction from my point of view.

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I've haven't bought Manor of Ravens because it only included two heroes. 

 

I haven't bought Mists of Bilehall because it doesn't contain any heroes.

 

If Chains that Rust comes with a Mage and a Healer Class... then I'll be forced to buy all three Mini-Expansions.  I'd want the 4 heroes and the complete Undead Campaign.

 

I'm hoping this is the case.  I secretly want it all. :D

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So, with it being March now...the 12th to be exact (on this day of writing) it is nearly half-way through this month and still no announcement.    Can we realistically expect to see this expansion by the end of this year?  

I suppose that MoB was announced in August 2015, and then released in February 2016.  That's 7 months from announcement to release.   

If we assume that Chains will be released this year in December at the latest then we would have to expect an announcement before the end of June (based on the 7 month window)

 

Regardless of the the content, I am just hoping that we can see this expansion this year.   *fingers crossed*

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Maybe The Chains that Rust's development partially overlapped with MoB, so if it takes 7 months it might not mean 7 months from the release of MoB

 

I certainly hope that is the case.   You would almost have to assume that because they broke up the expansion into two smaller boxes that it would take less time to develop.    At least, that is my reasoning. 

I hope at some point that they will release an expansion for expansions.    I know Arkham Horror did it with their last expansion and it worked out fine (I own all Arkham Horror) and they did it in a very smart way.    I always wanted Descent 1ed to do something similar. 

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and about next H&M, since now this would be full new monsters !

Are there really all Descent 1st monsters already featured in the expansions of Descent 2nd edition? I always thought there were way more?

Not sure, because I don't own the 1st edition stuff.

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and about next H&M, since now this would be full new monsters !

Are there really all Descent 1st monsters already featured in the expansions of Descent 2nd edition? I always thought there were way more?

Not sure, because I don't own the 1st edition stuff.

Shards of Everdark and Stewards of the Secret will complete all monsters from 1st edition.

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Eh. I liked the coop PoDs. Looks like they're going for something very similar and I don't have too much of a problem with that. It has definitely rekindled or in some cases kindled excitement about the game and that can never be bad. I'm now confident that we'll see Chains and more expansions after it. I am just terribly curious about how they're going to handle this two box campaign. A lot of people complained about Mists and I just don't understand it. It's got to be my favorite expansion. It's filled to the brim with theme like none of the other expansions have been. Also, dark minotaurs are on their way!!!

Edited by Kethith

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and about next H&M, since now this would be full new monsters !

Are there really all Descent 1st monsters already featured in the expansions of Descent 2nd edition? I always thought there were way more?

Not sure, because I don't own the 1st edition stuff.

 

Yes, and Dark Minotaurs and Crow Hags were new monster already

But there is 12 heroes to be remade before having them all remade

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I was thinking that the fact that they have no more monsters to put out and new monsters means more time and more money than the previous monster and hero expansions, which might mean they choose to do the last one all heroes. I'd like to see more new monsters, but I would understand if that's just not feasible.

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