Honing for Store Championship (If I end up not running it)

[Drasnighta 26,833]

So, definitely looking at honing my list and playstyle to potentially compete in the Store Championship.

 

There is a chance I'll be running it, and not playing it, in which case, I'd still like to get the list Squared Away so I can be an adversarial practice game on the way in for people...

 

(My Gaming Dates are 17th, 31st of Jan, and 14th of Feb, before the Tentative Store Champs on the 28th of Feb)

 

 

I usually run Garm and B-Wings...  I was considering Switching up to Ys a bit, even though the Black Die has always seemed to have a Hatred for me...

 

Tentatively, I have this list:

[ REBEL FLEET (400 points)
1 • MC80 Assault Cruiser - XI7 Turbolasers (120)
2 • Assault Frigate Mark II B (72)
3 • Assault Frigate Mark II B - Garm Bel Iblis - Boosted Comms (101)
4 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
5 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
6 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
7 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
8 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
9 • HWK-290 (12)
10 • X-wing Squadron (13)
11 • X-wing Squadron (13)
12 • Wedge Antilles X-wing Squadron (19)
13 • Objectives - Advanced Gunnery - Fleet Ambush - Superior Positions (0)

 

 

I had success previously with an ISD-I, VSD-I, VSD-I + Rhymerball, with the Ships being essentially Naked...

 

So trying the same with the Rebels for the most part...  Of course, part of me looks at it and says "You could drop that second X-Wing for an Upgrade to Ackbar, how does that feel?"  And honestly, it feels okay - because that Nearly Naked MC80 Assault is designed to Slash/ Drive a Wedge (not THE Wedge, A Wedge) into the enemy force, firing away...

 

There's no Init Bit.  A Y-Wing could give me 10 points for one though.

 

Advanced Gunnery, because No-one wants to give an MC80 that Objective, which funnels you to either Fleet Ambush, which lets me get a bit of a Jump on you, or at least, piecemeal (and this is a 50/50 with Hyperspace Assault), and Superior Positions, because I have a hell of a Tendency to fly ships into my own Minefields when I set them up...

Thoughts / Crazyness?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ginkapo 9,321]

Wedge Y's and no Dutch. Outright Criminal.

 

In fleet ambush, how are you going to get your third ship into the fight? Might thought would be engine tech on the MC80 to storm in and slow down fast. Not that it matters as anyone with any sense will make you take Superior Positions.

 

As an aside, are the X's for the Y's or the HWK?

[Drasnighta 26,833]

Wedge Y's and no Dutch. Outright Criminal.

 

In fleet ambush, how are you going to get your third ship into the fight? Might thought would be engine tech on the MC80 to storm in and slow down fast. Not that it matters as anyone with any sense will make you take Superior Positions.

 

As an aside, are the X's for the Y's or the HWK?

 

 

I've had precisely 0 luck with Dutch so far, unless I pay a further 12 point Flight controllers tax on the two AFMK-IIs...  So many times I've failed to do that single point of damage.

 

Remember, these are my Objectives, which means they're being picked from if I'm player 2...  If I'm player 2 in Fleet Ambush, its the Enemy that's being Ambushed...  I don't know if I'd pick my opponents fleet Ambush without a good look at his other objectives, but that being said, it could be the Garm Carrier and Speed 3...  

Xs are for the HWK to start with - but I'm fairly flexible.  I'd love to be able to draw in the enemy fighters and keep bombing.

[Lyraeus 4,759]

So you can run an SC and still play in it. The Tournament rules specify Regional and above. 

 

As for advice. . . Hmmmmm i see your plan. . .

 

How is this?

 

Vote Dras!

Faction: Rebel Alliance 
Points: 390/400 

Commander: Admiral Ackbar

Assault Objective: Advanced Gunnery 
Defense Objective: Contested Outpost 
Navigation Objective: Superior Positions 

MC80 Command Cruiser (106 points)
-  XI7 Turbolasers  ( 6  points) 

Assault Frigate Mark II B (72 points)
-  XI7 Turbolasers  ( 6  points) 

[ flagship ] Assault Frigate Mark II B (72 points)
-  Admiral Ackbar  ( 38  points) 
-  XI7 Turbolasers  ( 6  points) 

1 Wedge Antilles ( 19 points) 
2 X-Wing Squadrons ( 26 points) 
1 Jan Ors ( 19 points) 
2 Y-Wing Squadrons ( 20 points) 

Fleet created with Armada Warlords

[Lyraeus 4,759]

Personally though I think Precision Strike is a much better Red Objective right now. . . 

[Ginkapo 9,321]

Sigh, its not my day. Your fleet would be great at being first player fleet ambush if thats any concillation.

 

I agree with Lyraeus about X17s everywhere, pure damage isnt enough with only three activations (and no gunnery teams). I disagree that Y's need Jans brace to protect them from attack, they have loads of hull anyway. Spam them, spam!

[Lyraeus 4,759]

Here is option 2 

 

Vote Dras!   
Author: Lyraeus

Faction: Rebel Alliance 
Points: 394/400 

Commander: Admiral Ackbar

Assault Objective: Advanced Gunnery 
Defense Objective: Fleet Ambush 
Navigation Objective: Superior Positions 

[ flagship ] Assault Frigate Mark II B (72 points)
-  Admiral Ackbar  ( 38  points) 
-  XI7 Turbolasers  ( 6  points) 

MC80 Command Cruiser (106 points)
-  Boosted Comms  ( 4  points) 
-  XI7 Turbolasers  ( 6  points) 

Assault Frigate Mark II B (72 points)
-  XI7 Turbolasers  ( 6  points) 

2 X-Wing Squadrons ( 26 points) 
1 Wedge Antilles ( 19 points) 
2 Y-Wing Squadrons ( 20 points) 
1 Jan Ors ( 19 points) 

Fleet created with Armada Warlords

[Lyraeus 4,759]

Sigh, its not my day. Your fleet would be great at being first player fleet ambush if thats any concillation.

 

I agree with Lyraeus about X17s everywhere, pure damage isnt enough with only three activations (and no gunnery teams). I disagree that Y's need Jans brace to protect them from attack, they have loads of hull anyway. Spam them, spam!

Jan is not for the Y-Wings, she is there for the 2 X-Wings.

[Drasnighta 26,833]

Personally though I think Precision Strike is a much better Red Objective right now. . . 

 

Oh, I love precision strike.  Its got my vote almost 90% of the time, because I am a Bomber Guy...

 

 

Unfortunately, I've only got the 2 XI7s - and I really do like that Blue->Red switch on the Assault...

 

 

And I'll be honest, a 33% reduction in my number of squadrons...  Even picking up Jan...  It makes me very edgy.

 

 

 

 

Also, if I'm running it, I won't have time or opportunity to play...  As its likely to be a Big event, being that the Sentry Box is the largest store in the Area...  And by Area, I mean, like, North America...  Or something...

Edited January 8, 2016 by Drasnighta

[Ginkapo 9,321]

 

Sigh, its not my day. Your fleet would be great at being first player fleet ambush if thats any concillation.

 

I agree with Lyraeus about X17s everywhere, pure damage isnt enough with only three activations (and no gunnery teams). I disagree that Y's need Jans brace to protect them from attack, they have loads of hull anyway. Spam them, spam!

Jan is not for the Y-Wings, she is there for the 2 X-Wings.

 

The Hwk is there for the Y's, the X's are there for the Hwk. So taking Jan reverses the hiararchy of the squadrons. The X's are there to die, no point wasting points on them. Personally I suggest that he only needs Hwk, Wedge and all the rest as Y;s.

[Lyraeus 4,759]

 

Personally though I think Precision Strike is a much better Red Objective right now. . . 

 

Oh, I love precision strike.  Its got my vote almost 90% of the time, because I am a Bomber Guy...

 

 

Unfortunately, I've only got the 2 XI7s - and I really do like that Blue->Red switch on the Assault...

 

 

And I'll be honest, a 33% reduction in my number of squadrons...  Even picking up Jan...  It makes me very edgy.

 

 

 

 

Also, if I'm running it, I won't have time or opportunity to play...  As its likely to be a Big event, being that the Sentry Box is the largest store in the Area...  And by Area, I mean, like, North America...  Or something...

 

10k sq ft big?

 

Hmmm Ok I can work with that . . . 

 

Now I understand that the loss of some squadrons can hurt but you are pushing a ton of damage through. 

 

Vote for Dras 2.0   

Author: Lyraeus

Faction: Rebel Alliance 

Points: 391/400 

Commander: Admiral Ackbar

Assault Objective: Precision Strike 

Defense Objective: Contested Outpost 

Navigation Objective: Superior Positions 

MC80 Assault Cruiser (114 points)

-  Heavy Turbolaser Turrets  ( 6  points) 

[ flagship ] Assault Frigate Mark II B (72 points)

-  Admiral Ackbar  ( 38  points) 

-  XI7 Turbolasers  ( 6  points) 

Assault Frigate Mark II B (72 points)

-  XI7 Turbolasers  ( 6  points) 

2 X-Wing Squadrons ( 26 points) 

1 Wedge Antilles ( 19 points) 

1 HWK-290 ( 12 points) 

2 Y-Wing Squadrons ( 20 points) 

Fleet created with Armada Warlords

[Ginkapo 9,321]

In that lineup Lyraeus:

 

Drop Ackbar for Garm, drop the two naked X;s. And add 4 Y's.

 

Dropping Ackbars 6 red bonus, for 4 black dice and the flexibility of Garm.

 

I prefer the latter personally.

Edited January 8, 2016 by Ginkapo

[Drasnighta 26,833]

I do usually prefer Garm...  But I am also wondering if Garm's holding me back...

I was looking at Ackbar, because I'm looking at being Aggressive with that MC80 - I'm aiming most games for getting at least a single Ackbar Slash before dying...


...  Otherwise...  Compromise?

[ REBEL FLEET (392 points)
1 • MC80 Assault Cruiser - Heavy Turbolaser Turrets (120)
2 • Assault Frigate Mark II B - XI7 Turbolasers (78)
3 • Assault Frigate Mark II B - Admiral Ackbar - XI7 Turbolasers (116)
4 • HWK-290 (12)
5 • X-wing Squadron (13)
6 • X-wing Squadron (13)
7 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
8 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
9 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
10 • Y-wing Squadron (10)
 

[Maturin 1,583]

I don't like XI-7's paired up with squadrons. Too often my ships would put damage onto hull but leave shields that the squadrons would then have to burn through. What about HTT's all around to encourage the redirect? If not, I'd almost rather see the XI-7s dropped for another Xwing.

As to your fighters, what squadron opposition do you expect Dras? Do you expect that 2 x-wings is enough to hold off or kill enemy squadrons while you kill the ships? I have been encountering more intense anti squadron load outs on Vassal, and I have been very happy to have been packing 4X's and 2A's to escort my Y's. It's probably overkill and I will be reducing my squads to add in Ackbar, but it's something to think about. I'm thinking you might want to go all X's...

[Drasnighta 26,833]

I don't like XI-7's paired up with squadrons. Too often my ships would put damage onto hull but leave shields that the squadrons would then have to burn through. What about HTT's all around to encourage the redirect? If not, I'd almost rather see the XI-7s dropped for another Xwing.

As to your fighters, what squadron opposition do you expect Dras? Do you expect that 2 x-wings is enough to hold off or kill enemy squadrons while you kill the ships? I have been encountering more intense anti squadron load outs on Vassal, and I have been very happy to have been packing 4X's and 2A's to escort my Y's. It's probably overkill and I will be reducing my squads to add in Ackbar, but it's something to think about. I'm thinking you might want to go all X's...

 

I simply don't have the Cards to do it...  Its going to be 50/50 one way or the other...

 

As for Squadrons, at the moment, its a case of "It will either be enough, or nothing I do will be enough..."

 

Mostly because I'm the main Squadron Player, but I've got potentially 2 Imperial Players who are going 130+ points a piece in Squadrons...  I did post a picture of what happened when their two Rhymer Balls imploded upon each other last weekend...

 

...

And I do want to go all X-s, to be honest.  I really do.  But I'm already subject to Red Die Hell with Ackbar, and I'm still too edgy...  My Squadron background is the B-Wing Cloud, so even Ys are **** Unreliable in comparison for me...  The last time I rolled with 8 X-Wings with a Double AFMK-II fleet with MC30, I failed to kill a single TIE Interceptor out of a Force of 6, or put a damage on a Ship, for the loss of 5 X-Wings...  

 

 

 

 

If I do, is a Squadron Contingent that is:

HWK, X-Wing, X-Wing, Luke, Wedge  going to be viewed favourably, above, say, A HWK and 5 X-Wings  ?

Edited January 8, 2016 by Drasnighta

[Lyraeus 4,759]

I love XI7 Turbolasers with squadrons. They strip the shield zone you are attacking down super low and then you punch through with a now stronger attack since their mitigation is gone.

Sure the can redirect 1 point but if they had 3 points on their front you would need 4 damage to collapse the shields and 5 damage to deal a card (after brace). If I attack the zone I will be hitting with my ship with the squadrons first, not only am I forcing the use of defense tokens but I can ping that zone so that I need less damage to get through.

[Maturin 1,583]

If you want to beat 130+ point R-balls, I'd suggest going all X. Your ships will be potent enough that red bombers will be sufficient, and still wins you points for superior positions.

With your latest build, i would drop the Y's (as much as I love them) and the HWK, and go with 6 X's. You don't need to ball up, so you're much less vulnerable to being locked down than your opponent. Consider dropping the XI's to get Flight Controllers - that extra blue really really helps with one-shotting Interceptors and A-wings, which you really want to do to minimize return fire. Maybe one FC is enough, for that first strike. Boosted Comms on both AF in return for the other XI-7.. It really gives you flexibility for the fighter battle. You're going all in on the space superiority game, but think of it as ensuring you get 130 points of enemy squadrons added to your MoV.

Edited January 8, 2016 by Maturin

[Maturin 1,583]

I love XI7 Turbolasers with squadrons. They strip the shield zone you are attacking down super low and then you punch through with a now stronger attack since their mitigation is gone.

Sure the can redirect 1 point but if they had 3 points on their front you would need 4 damage to collapse the shields and 5 damage to deal a card (after brace). If I attack the zone I will be hitting with my ship with the squadrons first, not only am I forcing the use of defense tokens but I can ping that zone so that I need less damage to get through.

When it works it's great, but I often find later in the game my squadrons aren't in position to collaborate that exactly with the commanding ship, especially if they're nose-riding without the benefit of squadron commands. If the target ship has few/no shields left, then the squadrons are contributing. If there are still shields elsewhere, the XI-7 ship is effectively working alone to bring those hull points to 0.

[Drasnighta 26,833]

If you want to beat 130+ point R-balls, I'd suggest going all X. Your ships will be potent enough that red bombers will be sufficient, and still wins you points for superior positions.

With your latest build, i would drop the Y's (as much as I love them) and the HWK, and go with 6 X's. You don't need to ball up, so you're much less vulnerable to being locked down than your opponent. Consider dropping the XI's to get Flight Controllers - that extra blue really really helps with one-shotting Interceptors and A-wings, which you really want to do to minimize return fire. Maybe one FC is enough, for that first strike. Boosted Comms on both AF in return for the other XI-7.. It really gives you flexibility for the fighter battle. You're going all in on the space superiority game, but think of it as ensuring you get 130 points of enemy squadrons added to your MoV.

 

 

As Always, if I take that advice, and kind of slather it over my list as a bit of a Compromise, I end up with something like this:

Of course, XI7s and HTTs are interchangeable on one Ship...

[ REBEL FLEET (396 points)

1 • MC80 Assault Cruiser - XI7 Turbolasers (120)

2 • Assault Frigate Mark II B - XI7 Turbolasers (78)

3 • Assault Frigate Mark II B - Admiral Ackbar - Flight Controllers - Boosted Comms (120)

4 • X-wing Squadron (13)

5 • X-wing Squadron (13)

6 • X-wing Squadron (13)

7 • X-wing Squadron (13)

8 • X-wing Squadron (13)

9 • X-wing Squadron (13)

[Lyraeus 4,759]

Here is a better question Drasnighta, what do you feel most comfortable with?

I don't know your meta so I can't advise you on what you will see (but a 130 point Rhymerball might not be it)

[Drasnighta 26,833]

Thats just it - outside of the fact I know I have 2 players who are readily embracing large Rhymerballs (with either a mix of ISD-VSD-Raider, or Triple Vics), my Meta is shifting at the moment, and I believe I'm seeing more Squadrons about, but at this point, its hard to tell...  I'll hopefully get a spy at the Monthly tourner at Myth tomorrow to tell me what it looks like there, and then try to extrapolate some...

 

 

 

I think I'm settled on the 3 Ships - MC80 Assault, and the pair of AFMK-IIs, with a chunk of Squadrons...  Without a Neb-B, I wouldn't be comfortable taking Bs and YT-1300s, but just about everything else is a possibility (with 3x Packs of Rebs, and 2x R&V)...

 

But you see, here's my problem - I only get to game every 2 weeks, and If I'm lucky, that's 2 Games - its usually 1...  The rest of the time, I'm a full-time-Stay-at-Home Father of a 2 Year old, so my time is spent in Supervision of him, which gives me ample time to both paint commissions - and if I don't have any of those, like now - to Hang out here on the Forums, and to build so many lists that I keep going in circles and circles and circles...

What I'm after, is something that appears to be a solid baseline list, from numerous areas, that looks like it could work in just about any meta - and aim to practice with just that list from that point on, until the end of Feb when the Store Champs roll around.

[Lyraeus 4,759]

Hmmmmm so the Assault Cruiser is a good move. The blue dice for the Anti-squadron is a good idea bit at the same time the way your list is set up, you won't be using squadrons often. . . Hmmmmm I am not sure how I feel about taking on the Rhymerball. . . In all honesty, a token Jan Ors with 3 X-Wings can hold them off and put pressure 9n them to deal with them, while that goes on you can easily have the Y-Wings jump in. . . Hmmmm

[Maturin 1,583]

Hmmmmm so the Assault Cruiser is a good move. The blue dice for the Anti-squadron is a good idea bit at the same time the way your list is set up, you won't be using squadrons often. . . Hmmmmm I am not sure how I feel about taking on the Rhymerball. . . In all honesty, a token Jan Ors with 3 X-Wings can hold them off and put pressure 9n them to deal with them, while that goes on you can easily have the Y-Wings jump in. . . Hmmmm

A good point about the Assault Cruiser.  But swapping out for Y-wings + Jan only gives you 2 Y's, and is that enough to make a significant bombing difference?  You do get more hull points out of it and with FC Y-wings can do all right....but I can't help but feel that Dras might as well go all in.  The faster you can kill off enemy squadrons, the sooner you can get to bombing runs.

 

With the list I've been running recently (2AF, Neb, 4X, 5Y, 2A, HWK) I've been able to dominate the space superiority battle quite handily, even against 7A's in one game (3 dead turn 1 from the X-wings alone), and against a 130 point Rhymerball (with Howl and Soontir).  I would expect 6 X's to do similarly well, but 4 X and 2 Y might struggle a bit.  

 

(I actually have lost my games with this list because the ship portion of it has been....anemic.  You don't have that problem with yours though!)

[Drasnighta 26,833]

So, Myth Games posted pics of the Forces in Use...  Some are more difficult to make out than others...  But here we go.


https://www.facebook.com/MythGames.ca/posts/10153518866003773

[Maturin 1,583]

Looks like you have enough firepower to take on anything there. The small ship spam lists might give you the most trouble.