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Icelom

Juke over predator?

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don't bother using Juke without other actions to mod your attacks

 

trust me, you will do pathetic damage unless you have the devil's own luck

 

 

and yes, JAx + Juke is fun times. Him + 3 Omega relay/juke FOs is a list

 

Jax himself does not use Juke, though

Edited by ficklegreendice

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don't bother using Juke without other actions to mod your attacks

 

Makes me wish one more time that we'd seen a TIE Advanced generic with an EPT slot.

 

I mean...4x Storm + x1 + AC + Juke would have been...ah, fun...

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that's what strom and juno are for

 

Ah, I dunno - the guarantee that higher-skill pilots have of being able to TL something they *know* they can shoot at just screams for ATC over AC, and some kind of EPT that enhances movement (hello, PtL) to ensure the right shots land based on a generally 'late' state of the table.

 

AC is great for lower-skill generics...you move early, so don't need to worry about a bump denying any actions (so can always, say, evade), and don't need any actions to get your typically-max-possible-attack-result (so you can, say, always evade).  Which are things that go SUPER WELL with the 'juke' EPT.  Only...no low-skill generic TIE Advanced with an EPT slot.  *sigh*

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With Vader and Howl, I alwasy take the evade action, and you usually shoot first with them anyway. Beyond that, I don't mind them using the focus early, then it's not there for offense or other defense.

 

I've tried Crack on Howl, and she dies pretty quick. I haven't thought about it on Vader.

 

I'm not using them in the same list, just two different examples of Juke. In my Howl list, it leaves them open to the rest of the swarm (Black squad with crack), and with Vader, they also have Maarek and Vessery shooting, so if they both get shots without defense focus, even better.

 

Howlrunner would die just as quickly with Juke as with Crack Shot, right?  Crack Shot + evade is strictly superior to Juke + evade -- until you've used up your Crack Shot.  What I wonder for Howlrunner is:  If she's going to die quickly anyway, is Crack Shot just as good or better?

 

Though Howlrunner has lasted a surprisingly long time in many of my games...

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that's what strom and juno are for

 

Ah, I dunno - the guarantee that higher-skill pilots have of being able to TL something they *know* they can shoot at just screams for ATC over AC, and some kind of EPT that enhances movement (hello, PtL) to ensure the right shots land based on a generally 'late' state of the table.

 

AC is great for lower-skill generics...you move early, so don't need to worry about a bump denying any actions (so can always, say, evade), and don't need any actions to get your typically-max-possible-attack-result (so you can, say, always evade).  Which are things that go SUPER WELL with the 'juke' EPT.  Only...no low-skill generic TIE Advanced with an EPT slot.  *sigh*

 

 

 ATC even on higher PS is very meh with only 1 action. basically PTL or bust at that point (and, given lack of green turns, it's mostly bust)

 

no defense action on five health, no thrusters is incredibly bleh and adding a crit result helps but does not solve the problem of horribly unreliable naked dice

 

Strom, being the mid PS that he is, is perfect for Juke + AC and the evade works nicely with his ability versus less dice

 

Juno will simply never be used over ATC super vader, so Juke + AC could be a decent out for her as well

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Juno will simply never be used over ATC super vader, so Juke + AC could be a decent out for her as well

 

At least not until more people try her with VI, Title and ATC.

Any other upgrades are just icing on the cake, but she is a killer budget ace.

 

A Tie Adv. that can't be reliably blocked, and has Hard 1's, at PS 10, is nothing to sneeze at for 30pts.

 

 

And then there's the 'Vader-light' version with PTL and Twin Ion Engine which is great and fun, but can be too easily arc-dodged these days.

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This is my list where i put the best users of Juke together.

You can run Vader with VI or Lone Wolf and the Inquisitor with PTL, but on Omega Leader for me Juke is just the best option.

You Evade turn 1 and hold onto your evade as long as possilble. If you get a TL on a ship, you can just take away 1 evade every time you shoot it and there is nothing he can do about it!

"Omega Leader" (21)

Juke (2)

Comm Relay (3)

Shield Upgrade (4)

The Inquisitor (25)

Juke (2)

XX-23 S-Thread Tracers (1)

Autothrusters (2)

TIE/v1 (1)

Darth Vader (29)

Juke (2)

Proton Rockets (3)

Advanced Targeting Computer (1)

Engine Upgrade (4)

TIE/x1 (0)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Edited by ForceM

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that's what strom and juno are for

 

Ah, I dunno - the guarantee that higher-skill pilots have of being able to TL something they *know* they can shoot at just screams for ATC over AC, and some kind of EPT that enhances movement (hello, PtL) to ensure the right shots land based on a generally 'late' state of the table.

 

AC is great for lower-skill generics...you move early, so don't need to worry about a bump denying any actions (so can always, say, evade), and don't need any actions to get your typically-max-possible-attack-result (so you can, say, always evade).  Which are things that go SUPER WELL with the 'juke' EPT.  Only...no low-skill generic TIE Advanced with an EPT slot.  *sigh*

 

 

 ATC even on higher PS is very meh with only 1 action. basically PTL or bust at that point (and, given lack of green turns, it's mostly bust)

 

no defense action on five health, no thrusters is incredibly bleh and adding a crit result helps but does not solve the problem of horribly unreliable naked dice

 

Strom, being the mid PS that he is, is perfect for Juke + AC and the evade works nicely with his ability versus less dice

 

Juno will simply never be used over ATC super vader, so Juke + AC could be a decent out for her as well

 

 

The problem with Juke on lower PS pilots is that as soon as they get shot at, they lose offensive punch. This makes them targets, so might be useful for biggsing, I guess. If you're fine with that and want to run non-Vader dual action Juke you could always try Alozen.

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that's what strom and juno are for

 

Ah, I dunno - the guarantee that higher-skill pilots have of being able to TL something they *know* they can shoot at just screams for ATC over AC, and some kind of EPT that enhances movement (hello, PtL) to ensure the right shots land based on a generally 'late' state of the table.

 

AC is great for lower-skill generics...you move early, so don't need to worry about a bump denying any actions (so can always, say, evade), and don't need any actions to get your typically-max-possible-attack-result (so you can, say, always evade).  Which are things that go SUPER WELL with the 'juke' EPT.  Only...no low-skill generic TIE Advanced with an EPT slot.  *sigh*

 

 

 ATC even on higher PS is very meh with only 1 action. basically PTL or bust at that point (and, given lack of green turns, it's mostly bust)

 

no defense action on five health, no thrusters is incredibly bleh and adding a crit result helps but does not solve the problem of horribly unreliable naked dice

 

Strom, being the mid PS that he is, is perfect for Juke + AC and the evade works nicely with his ability versus less dice

 

Juno will simply never be used over ATC super vader, so Juke + AC could be a decent out for her as well

 

 

The problem with Juke on lower PS pilots is that as soon as they get shot at, they lose offensive punch. This makes them targets, so might be useful for biggsing, I guess. If you're fine with that and want to run non-Vader dual action Juke you could always try Alozen.

 

 

Depending on how you set up your list, that may not even be a problem.  Maybe you want them to shoot at the low PS Juke'r rather than someone else?

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What do y'all think about putting Juke on Scourge? I'll already have two Blackshots and I don't want to buy a 3rd Kirazxzxsxzs to give him Crackshot.

Can't evade + modify his shot

Borrow a crackshot

 

 

Alternatively, Decoy isn't a bad one on Scourge. He wants to be firing last.

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Juke becomes better the more of it you have in a list.

If you can focus fire with multiple ships that all have Juke then the enemy will have a hard time choosing when to use their single focus token. Every shot beyond the first has something pretty equivalent to crackshot but it is reusable every turn, it just has an extra condition you need to satisfy. It rewards good flying and focused fire.

Your opponent could try to counter it by splitting his/her fire to strip the evade tokens off your ships but that's a win for you too because this game is all about systematically taking down one opponent at a time.

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Seriously this is why I need stuff like this in a book.  I'll never remember it all...

 

Juke is there to smash through green dice; predator through red blanks

Ergo, 2 dice = juke; 3 dice = pred

Omega squadie = juke + relay

Zeta L = predator


Ofc there are the rules of juke

1.) Only run if you can evade AND mod your reds (ala relay or v1 or acc corrector etc)

If you can't? Crackshot

2.) If you can reroll outside predator, then might as well juke!


Juke is an amazing ept for lucky opponents and their stupid natural evades :D

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I'm having a really hard time justifying Juke over predator.

For one more point it just seems so much better. I could only see running it over predator on something that you can get easy target locks and evades with. And I can see a ship that spits those two actions out for free while still getting a focus.

 

Juke is a niche upgrade, while Predator is more generally reliable.  Juke is only worth it on ships that can get an additional modification.  For example, TIE FOs with Comm Relay LOVE Juke for these reasons:

They can save the evade token.

They can take another action in subsequent turns for die modification.

They have low primary attack, so it is quite difficult to push damage through high agility, even with Predator.

 

The TIE Adv. Prototype will like it for similar reasons.  With the V1 title, the TAP can take an evade action after acquiring a target lock, granting the additional modification on the 2 attack dice.  It will also be a great choice for TIE/x7 Defenders, because of their new ability to receive free evade tokens.

 

For other ships that do not have a way to retain or receive an additional evade token on top of an attack modification, Predator will often be the better choice.

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In my experience, Vader with juke and engine ends up being action starved. Any round where you need both the boost and the roll, you are wasting your elite slot. Those are also often the rounds where you are getting range one shots.

Kinda lame.

A budget Vader at 32 is a different story, I think.

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I've play juke Vader and was not impressed honestly. I thought it would be sweet but many turns Vader really only gets 1 action because of reapplying a target lock so his damage is good. With juke he has 0 actions a turn between a target lock he can't really spend and an evade he can't use on focus rolls. Predator just feels so much more consistently useful and unrestrictive.

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I've play juke Vader and was not impressed honestly. I thought it would be sweet but many turns Vader really only gets 1 action because of reapplying a target lock so his damage is good. With juke he has 0 actions a turn between a target lock he can't really spend and an evade he can't use on focus rolls. Predator just feels so much more consistently useful and unrestrictive.

 

Well, yeah, for ATC-Vader, you use Predator.

 

Juke is for AC-Vader to be viable.

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