This is how you swarm! Cheap and mass produced for a reason.

[Captain ICT 151]

TIEs, that is. Because you can't have enough.

 

[ EMPIRE FLEET (398 points)
1 • Imperial I-class Star Destroyer - Admiral Motti - Relentless (137)
2 • Imperial I-class Star Destroyer - Wing Commander - Flight Controllers - Expanded Hangar Bay - Boosted Comms (131)
3 • Dengar Punishing One (20)
4 • TIE Bomber Squadron (9)
5 • TIE Bomber Squadron (9)
6 • TIE Bomber Squadron (9)
7 • TIE Bomber Squadron (9)
8 • TIE Bomber Squadron (9)
9 • TIE Bomber Squadron (9)
10 • TIE Fighter Squadron (8)
11 • TIE Fighter Squadron (8)
12 • TIE Fighter Squadron (8)
13 • TIE Fighter Squadron (8)
14 • TIE Fighter Squadron (8)
15 • TIE Fighter Squadron (8)
16 • TIE Fighter Squadron (8)

 

Feel free to comment. I've thought about trading 2 fighters for Howl, (or Mauler), because more firepower. With that many bombers and up to 9 squads per turn, someone isn't going to be happy. Possibly replacing some fighters with Interceptors (which costs me in strafing runs, and in hull)

 

The origin of this fleet is a battle I just fought where I only went with 3 bombers and 8 fighters, then decided, what about increasing the firepower? In a turn, this fleet can throw out 30 anti-squadron dice, even assuming squadron commands are required, which should account for about 3 X-Wings a turn. Once the fighters are gone, then there's 6 black bomber dice and 3 blues a turn for anti-ship work.

 

Oh, and losing a few TIEs, doesn't really matter.

[SmurfWedge 192]

If you are trying this out I would definitely fit in Rhyme. He is a force multiplyer for all those squadrons.

[knasserII 2,557]

If you are trying this out I would definitely fit in Rhyme. He is a force multiplyer for all those squadrons.

Agreed. And it would certainly force your opponent to prioritize the fighters more than they would like to.

[psychoticmammal 0]

If you're ok losing one squaddie activation I'd consider swapping out the carrier ISD for a VSD fitted out similarly but with corrupter title, it'll give your bombers some reach.

[Captain ICT 151]

If you're ok losing one squaddie activation I'd consider swapping out the carrier ISD for a VSD fitted out similarly but with corrupter title, it'll give your bombers some reach.

 

Generally the speed 4 on the tie bombers is plenty fast enough to get where they need to be.

 

As for the VSD vs ISD

1. Maneuverability/Speed. A VSD is speed 2 max, with 1 yaw, unless I use a maneuver command dial, in which case, it can't activate squadrons. A speed 3 ISD even naked as far as anti-ship, is scary, and can get up in your face. I've played with a VSD and ISD repeatedly after Sullust (only 2 Imperial ships I had) and what would happen is this: The opposing fleet moves to all engage the ISD, where the VSD can't get to them. I generally got a single shot with the VSD the whole game. There was an exception, but that was only when my opponent picked fleet ambush. (Probably in 8 games like that.)

 

2. Was the fewer squadrons. I've run the VSD with basically that setup before, and it's a squad 3 carrier, and needs boosted comms due to issue 1.

 

I think VSDs are generally the only ship which is generally obsoleted by wave 2. If they at least had 2 clicks, I don't think they would be. I could see someone try an all VSD & Motti fleet with a pair of tractors, simply because it would be hard to punch out that much damage. 5 VSD1s, or 4 VSD2s (all with tractors, and a few more points.) Though I have killed 2 VSDs and an ISD with one or two turns remaining in the game before.

[Spellbound 27]

I'm in agreement.  If a VSD ever gets in medium range of one of those ackbar MC80s, it's toast.  12 damage with X-17's and an accuracy kills them, and it's not that hard to get such a roll with something like leading shots or concentrate fire.  And if the first shot doesn't kill them, the second WILL.

 

I'm not sure what FFG was thinking, making the rebel ships SO DEADLY, but also incredibly durable with ECM, while still being fast for the most part.  Meanwhile, any imperial ship but an ISD2 just gets blown apart super fast without a chance.  It seems in this age you're either an ISD2 or you're in the rebel's front or rear arc - or you're dead.

[Ardaedhel 10,844]

I'm in agreement.  If a VSD ever gets in medium range of one of those ackbar MC80s, it's toast.  12 damage with X-17's and an accuracy kills them, and it's not that hard to get such a roll with something like leading shots or concentrate fire.  And if the first shot doesn't kill them, the second WILL.

 

I'm not sure what FFG was thinking, making the rebel ships SO DEADLY, but also incredibly durable with ECM, while still being fast for the most part.  Meanwhile, any imperial ship but an ISD2 just gets blown apart super fast without a chance.  It seems in this age you're either an ISD2 or you're in the rebel's front or rear arc - or you're dead.

WOW, if you manage to regularly roll 12 damage and an accuracy on six reds and two blues, I want to borrow your dice! That's double on every single red die, an accuracy on one blue, and burning the other for Leading Shots.

Let's keep perspective here. You're talking about *minimum* 124 points of ship plus a 38-point admiral 1-shotting a 73-point ship (let's say 90ish, if you want Corrupter and Exp Hangars) on an out-of-this-world roll in an ideal positioning situation. Yeah, it's gonna hurt: that's half the enemy's fleet right there, ideally positioned and focusing on you.

[Captain ICT 151]

Ackbared ships aren't that deadly. Now, granted it hurts, but if you get something throwing 8 dice at you repeatedly, it's going to hurt, and probably kill you. Ackbar is alright, but I find him less damaging than Vader. Ackbar actually harms a lot of ships, by preventing useful double arcing. About the only ship that doesn't suffer from this is the AFM2, and that's because of the pathetic front arc on the B version that everyone seems to use. (For me, it was disturbing when I flew the prototype fleet to realize that I was up against an AFM2A variant, with it's better anti-squad weapons!)

 

The best you will get with EA, Ackbar, CF and an MC80 is 6+2+1+1=10 dice (8 or 7 Red, and 2 to 3 Blue). Excluding Advanced Gunnery (For which the response becomes a **** no, what are your other objectives?) On that, you are likely to roll about 7.5 damage on the inital re-roll. Assuming a blue is an accuracy, and there were 2 blanks (and the rest averaging out to 8 on 7 dice, then it becomes (with the loss of the other blue) 7 on 6+1.5 damage from the re-roll. (I'm just using average damage here), which nets you 7.5. Sure you could theoretically have 17 damage and an accuracy, but it's not likely. That's enough to hurt a VSD severely, but not kill it. So it takes 4 on the shields and 4 (rounding up) on the hull. This is for about average rolls, but to get 10 dice, with the reroll, 9 dice. Next turn it can basically take the same hit, if it uses engineering, this time rounded down, it survives with 1 hull. (That's without brace.)  To get enough to kill it you need 11 damage on Reds (assuming 1 blue damage). So no blanks, and of those 8, you need 3 double hits.  It's possible, but unlikely. As far as durability, I've found that generally, you just have to beat down a ship's shields if they are running lots of engineering commands (a good counter to fleets with lots of XI7s)

 

 

Anyway, on the fleet. I played a variant on Vassal.

As above except

4 TIE Bombers

Rhymer

6 TIE fighters

Motti's ship with Gunnery team and Boosted Comms.

 

vs

 

AFM2, Mon Motha

2x Torpedo Frigates

CR90 TRC

4xA-wings.

 

My opponent conceded at the end of turn 2, after both torpedo frigates were destroyed, AFM2 was in both ISD's front arcs surrounded by bombers, There were still 3 A-wings, but with 4 total health, the flanking CR90 was coming into range. (Couldn't avoid coming in.)

 

Granted the setup wasn't great for the opposing force (Superior positions let me pick where to charge both ISDs straight in.) But in general, one of the spectators commented on the fleet "Frankly, it looks terrifying."

[mobow213 133]

Would fit rhymer in there. And howl as she boost the counter for the ties from 1 to 2

[Agemman 36]

I tried to build a swarm with two ISDs too, what do you think?

 

Imperial Swarm

Faction: Galactic Empire 
Points: 400/400 

Commander: Admiral Motti

Assault Objective: Most Wanted 
Defense Objective: Fleet Ambush 
Navigation Objective: Minefields 

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Admiral Motti  ( 24  points) 
-  Admiral Chiraneau  ( 10  points) 
-  Flight Controllers  ( 6  points) 
-  Expanded Hangar Bay  ( 5  points) 
-  Boosted Comms  ( 4  points) 

Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Flight Controllers  ( 6  points) 
-  Expanded Hangar Bay  ( 5  points) 
-  Boosted Comms  ( 4  points) 

1 Major Rhymer ( 16 points) 
4 TIE Bomber Squadrons ( 36 points) 
1 "Howlrunner" ( 16 points) 
1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points) 
3 TIE Interceptor Squadrons ( 33 points)

Basically Chiraneau's ship activates Howlrunner, Mauler and the TIE/In while the other ISD activates the bombers, the next turn when Mauler is engaged Chiraneau takes him out of there damaging everyone on range 1. Also 6 dice interceptors.

[oddeye 560]

I tried to build a swarm with two ISDs too, what do you think?

 

Imperial Swarm

Faction: Galactic Empire 

Points: 400/400 

Commander: Admiral Motti

Assault Objective: Most Wanted 

Defense Objective: Fleet Ambush 

Navigation Objective: Minefields 

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)

-  Admiral Motti  ( 24  points) 

-  Admiral Chiraneau  ( 10  points) 

-  Flight Controllers  ( 6  points) 

-  Expanded Hangar Bay  ( 5  points) 

-  Boosted Comms  ( 4  points) 

Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)

-  Flight Controllers  ( 6  points) 

-  Expanded Hangar Bay  ( 5  points) 

-  Boosted Comms  ( 4  points) 

1 Major Rhymer ( 16 points) 

4 TIE Bomber Squadrons ( 36 points) 

1 "Howlrunner" ( 16 points) 

1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points) 

3 TIE Interceptor Squadrons ( 33 points)

Basically Chiraneau's ship activates Howlrunner, Mauler and the TIE/In while the other ISD activates the bombers, the next turn when Mauler is engaged Chiraneau takes him out of there damaging everyone on range 1. Also 6 dice interceptors.

I second this list. I ran the same list minus the flight controllers. I does well. You'll wish you had ECMs on the ISD that gets picked on though.

[Agemman 36]

I got another version of the list i posted, this time with 12 squadron activations each turn

 

ISD Swarm 2

Faction: Galactic Empire 
Points: 399/400 

Commander: Grand Moff Tarkin

Assault Objective: Most Wanted 
Defense Objective: Fleet Ambush 
Navigation Objective: Minefields 

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Grand Moff Tarkin  ( 38  points) 
-  Flight Controllers  ( 6  points) 
-  Boosted Comms  ( 4  points) 
-  Expanded Hangar Bay  ( 5  points) 

Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)
-  Expanded Hangar Bay  ( 5  points) 
-  Boosted Comms  ( 4  points) 

5 TIE Bomber Squadrons ( 45 points) 
1 Major Rhymer ( 16 points) 
5 TIE Fighter Squadrons ( 40 points) 
1 "Howlrunner" ( 16 points) 

With Tarkin i can give out a free squadron token to the ISDs and they can combine it with a squadron command for 6 squadron activated each, and i can do this every round. Comparing it to the other list i loose Chiraneau's ability that could be useful on bombers too but i gain 2 more squadrons.

[corlinjewell 34]

I like this one better.

[oddeye 560]

Hmmm... you bring up a good point. I need another imperial fighter pack. 6 bombers would be nice.

You can also get 12 activations out of this for 269 points:

VSD I

-Tarkin

-Boosted Comms

VSD I

-Boosted Comms

VSD I

-Boosted Comms

Leaves 131 points for fighter wing and gives long range fighter control.

[Agemman 36]

Hmmm... you bring up a good point. I need another imperial fighter pack. 6 bombers would be nice.

You can also get 12 activations out of this for 269 points:

VSD I

-Tarkin

-Boosted Comms

VSD I

-Boosted Comms

VSD I

-Boosted Comms

Leaves 131 points for fighter wing and gives long range fighter control.

With ISDs you get faster ships that can keep up with the swarm and fligh controllers that with howlrunner give you 5 dice fighters

[oddeye 560]

Hmmm... you bring up a good point. I need another imperial fighter pack. 6 bombers would be nice.

You can also get 12 activations out of this for 269 points:

VSD I

-Tarkin

-Boosted Comms

VSD I

-Boosted Comms

VSD I

-Boosted Comms

Leaves 131 points for fighter wing and gives long range fighter control.

With ISDs you get faster ships that can keep up with the swarm and fligh controllers that with howlrunner give you 5 dice fighters

Theres pros and cons in both lists.

With ISDs you only have 2 activations, less overall hull, less overall firepower (though not by much), worse deployment options, ships are worth alot more and without ECMs its a good bet youll lose an ISD every game.

With VSDs you lose speed, the flight controller boost (which you could add to my sample VSD list as there was 131 pts left), almost guaranteed to lose one VSD.

Well those are just a few of the highlighted differences. You could do a hybrid list with one ISD and two VSDs but its going to be tight on points.

Edited January 3, 2016 by oddeye

[Gorthaur25 130]

I have been kicking around the 3 VSD swarm list too. I think it would be weak to Ackbar if you can't close with your VSD's or hunt him with Rhymer but it would be fun to try it.

[oddeye 560]

I have been kicking around the 3 VSD swarm list too. I think it would be weak to Ackbar if you can't close with your VSD's or hunt him with Rhymer but it would be fun to try it.

I've been meaning to try 3 VSDs post wave 2 just haven't gotten in any games in two weeks due to the holidays. Game night is in a few days, ill bring it and see how three VSDs fair. No doubt ill be facing ackbar as he is rampant in our local scene... haha.

Double ISDs work well since you can charge in and park in their front arcs. I think with the VSDs and their crappy sublight speed I'll have to avoid "hunting" ships. I'm going to shoot for objectives, keep my fleet together and out play my opponent VS charging in head first blasting everything. Still debating whether or not i should take tractor beams...